Are the Leafs stupid not to get a 1D

[rent free]

No. They're smart for running the course and not putting all their eggs in a basket for a 1D

 

[Trapper]

If a player like Doughty is available UFA we can absolutely be in the talks.
With that being said, I'd be happy with a RHD Dermott. You can also build by committee.
Whatever people want to argue Rielly is, he is a top 4 D and I'll leave it to the rest to work out. Having 5 top 4 D can work IMO as well. Look at Vegas. You also need to have the 4 lines of forwards who can play all 3 zones with speed.

 

[Liferleafer]

If all we have to go on is what HF is pricing these guys at, i think the only one worth looking at is Tanev. Karlsson is going to cost a shit ton.....Rangers fans are insane with what they want for McD, and OEL will be the same. I don't want to be dealing Lil/Dermott or even Kap as JVR is likely gone. I think Tanev will be affordable.

 

[Morgs]

I'd trade assets for OEL or Tanev.

Karlsson is too expensive, and McDonagh is not good enough.

 

[shortfuze]

Exactly what ive been saying all along. This year is not the year. Tampa/boston way too good this year to pass the 1st round. They would be considerable underdogs to win round 1

Granted both Tampa and Boston’s have some games in hand. But why are they so much better then Toronto? All it takes is for them to lose a couple of games and they are right with us. Plus from what I’ve heard Boston’s schedule isn’t that good where as Toronto has already played a hard schedule.

 

[Liminality]

I'd trade assets for OEL or Tanev.

Karlsson is too expensive, and McDonagh is not good enough.

OEL would be nice but I think he brings a lot of what we got in our dmen now, although seemingly better. Tanev would be good too if he ever played more than 59 games on average the past 5 seasons. Karlsson yeah, he's way too pricey. We keep complaining about bringing in top two way defenders. McDonagh is actually a realistic option this time and brings that. Maybe not top tier like a doughty but he's also going to cost less on our assets. He's still a top pairing guy with attributes that we've been searching for.

If the assets they want are too much though, continue the search next year.

 

[Buds17]

Yes, several D are apparently available and expected to move, and I imagine we'll be actively involved in much of the talks. Have to see what they go for and where they end up, before I can evaluate my satisfaction or disappointment with what we did or didn't do.

 

[griffon1]

I'd be ok with McD if the price was right. I just don't want to be giving up 2nds for 3rd pairs or 4th liners.

 

[Morgs]

OEL would be nice but I think he brings a lot of what we got in our dmen now, although seemingly better. Tanev would be good too if he ever played more than 59 games on average the past 5 seasons. Karlsson yeah, he's way too pricey. We keep complaining about bringing in top two way defenders. McDonagh is actually a realistic option this time and brings that. Maybe not top tier like a doughty but he's also going to cost less on our assets. He's still a top pairing guy with attributes that we've been searching for.

If the assets they want are too much though, continue the search next year.

The thing about OEL is although he's known for his puck moving and offense, he's actually one of the better defensive defenseman in the entire NHL (arguably better defensively than offensively). In GAR, he brought a top-10 defensive value for two consecutive years, and his rel.CA/60 this year is -6.23 (9th best for guys that have played over 500 minutes, 7th best for guys that have actually played in some real comp). Tanev is hardly even ahead of him in this statistic that defines your shot suppression ability. The only other two way defenseman that are better at suppressing shots than him are Hampus Lindholm (Josh Manson) and Mark Giordano. IMO he's a top-4 defenseman in hockey (after Karlsson, Hedman, and Doughty), and him being on a real team that can help provide him with offense could put him even higher to improve his offensive ceiling.

McDonagh on the other hand is thought of as a "two way defenseman", but he hardly has an impact on either side of the ice. He plays a little tougher comp than OEL does, but he doesn't bring the defensive prowess or the offensive ability. He's thought of as a #1 defenseman, but Morgan Rielly is far better than him offensively, and he's better at suppressing shots than him defensively in much much tougher comp.

OEL/Karlsson = our #1 defenseman
McDonagh = our #2 defenseman (but barely better than Gardiner)
Tanev = our #3 defenseman

 

[Liminality]

OEL/Karlsson = our #1 defenseman
McDonagh = our #2 defenseman (but barely better than Gardiner)
Tanev = our #3 defenseman

Makes sense, I don't watch OEL but I go by what I've read of him. I think OEL would be my #1 pick cause his speed fits well with our system and if he does bring that defense we'd be in a pretty good spot, but he's got to cost quite a lot too I guess.

Are those stats just for this year? Cause I thought McDonagh was liked in the advanced stats before. Possibly a down year for most rangers?

 

[Swedish Gretzky]

stop trolling the leafs board

How old are you?

 

[I Believe]

For Karlsson/OEL, very little is off the table. Otherwise you're not getting Karlsson/OEL.

It's a tough choice, but I think i'd rather stand pat. Trading for one and having them walk shortly after is just an absolute nightmare scenario.

 

[Morgs]

Makes sense, I don't watch OEL but I go by what I've read of him. I think OEL would be my #1 pick cause his speed fits well with our system and if he does bring that defense we'd be in a pretty good spot, but he's got to cost quite a lot too I guess.

Are those stats just for this year? Cause I thought McDonagh was liked in the advanced stats before. Possibly a down year for most rangers?

OEL (2014-2018):

ToIQoC: 29.25 (average 1st pairing comp)
ZSR: 45.51 (lower = more defensive zone starts)
PDO: 99.07

rel.CA60: -5.32 (minus is good for against stats)
rel.CF60: +1.99
rel.CF%: +3.63
------
rel.xGF%: +3.66
------
rel.GF%: +4.54
-----
iCF60: 11.55
ixGF60: 0.24
-----

McDonagh (2014-2018)

ToIQoC: 29.42 (moderate 1st pairing comp)
ZSR: 43.63
PDO: 102.26

rel.CA60: +1.78
rel.CF60: +0.52
rel.CF%: -0.60
------
rel.xGF%: +2.56
------
rel.GF%: +3.93
------
iCF60: 8.67
ixGF60: 0.21


Although it's a bit unfair to McDonagh as he had to carry around the corpse of Dan Girardi, OEL hasn't exactly had much better in Stone/Murphy mostly. OEL is much much better at suppressing shots, and he's better at creating shots. They're both great defenseman, OEL is just in a completely different weight class, and would be deserving of the assets we'd be spending especially if the cost of these two are relatively similar.

 

[Fogelhund]

We would be stupid to not make a deal for a Top pairing D, particularly a RHD, if there is a deal available, that doesn't gut the team.

 

[Morbo]

I think whether or not the other top teams (Tampa, Boston, etc) land a major upgrade will have a lot to do with people's feelings on this topic.

 

[ULF_55]

we have a 1D

Yep, just like every team in the league.

 

[ULF_55]

The Leafs defence will improve markedly when the Leaf forwards stop blowing the zone early, start paying closer attention to their assignments, not get caught deep, support the D properly on pinches and when the D challenges the opposition forwards on zone entries, and can win a board battle or 2. Not to mention being on the right side of the puck more often.

None of that is on the D, and you could get the 6 best D-men in the league playing for the Leafs, but the issues will remain the same.

It may not be the sexy answer, but it is the one that will bring the most success at the cheapest price.

That will only change when Babcock leaves.

They blow the zone because that's what they're supposed to be doing otherwise Babcock would have changed that.

 

[ULF_55]

We would be stupid to not make a deal for a Top pairing D, particularly a RHD, if there is a deal available, that doesn't gut the team.

Leafs are going to be losing one or both of Bozak and van Riemsdyk this year. Or maybe none ...

So if you are using prospects and picks for a long term top pairing defender you aren't going to be gutting the team.

Hunter's picks will make the NHL when they're ready, but the core outside of Kadri and Marleau are young and will be here 5+ years, so losing a couple / few prospects that are close to making it isn't going to gut the team.

With Matthews, Nylander, Marner, Kadri, Rielly, Dermott, Zaitsev, Brown/Kapanen all locked up for the next several seasons you're looking for very good depth players and you can always get 1 and 2 year rentals to supplement every summer's UFA crop.

They should be looking at the best available top pairing defenders to lock up for their retirement contracts.

 

[LeafFever]

We have a gaping whole in the lineup, yeah I love Rielly but our blueline is still thin given Tanev, Karlsson, OEL and McDonagh are to some degree out there this deadline and up coming draft should it be imperative to land one?

Is this the kind of window you look back on and question why didn't you pull the trigger.

Even take a run at John Carlson as a UFA or a Trouba deal in July

To that end I'm ok with flipping JVR and/or Bozak for picks as ammo for a July deal.

-edit- Liljegren is off the table IMO, I'm a fanboy for Ryan Merkley so this thread is me questioning my blind faith in the draft, by all means bash my opinion looking for diverse hot takes and such.

Are you trying to say Rielly is not a #1D but Chris Tanev is? Good lord Tanev is overrated on here. He can't stay health and has no offensive abilities.

 

[NoTouchIcing]

If a player like Doughty is available UFA we can absolutely be in the talks.

Alternatively, John Carlson is a UFA this coming summer.

 

[Zizzzzy]

EK hasn't done anything to impress me lately. Not saying hes no good anymore, but hes going to get paid based on his credentials and not his play of late. I'd like to stay clear of him.

 

[LeafFever]

OEL look like crap BTW. You have to be really careful that you don't give up a ton on the wrong guy. That +/- would be talked about non-stop in Toronto.

 

[Morgs]

OEL look like crap BTW. You have to be really careful that you don't give up a ton on the wrong guy. That +/- would be talked about non-stop in Toronto.

OEL has had one "bad" season in his entire career, and that one season (last year) was still better than most defenseman have in their career.

+/- is a joke, and when people see him play they'll get over it.

 

[Morgs]

EK hasn't done anything to impress me lately. Not saying hes no good anymore, but hes going to get paid based on his credentials and not his play of late. I'd like to stay clear of him.

EK is still the best defenseman in hockey, don't let people fool you into thinking he's having a bad year.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

I dont support any short term Playoff run moves.
Own Rental is fine. Players might not like us moving JVR at the deadline. That being said his powerplay goals will diminish in the dont call anything playoffs.