God Bless Canada
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Remind me to address your definition of "a second."I'm here, pick in a second.
Remind me to address your definition of "a second."I'm here, pick in a second.
The Trail Of The Stanley Cup said:With the addition of Morris, the Mets had a team that was always a contender. Morris was a very versatile player and was used at both RW and Centre. He was a great favourite with the Seattle fans for eight years and they were sorry to see him traded to Calgary, where he had one more good year. He figured on four championship teams, played in three cup series and was on one Stanley Cup winner.
In his first two years at Seattle he centred a line of Jack Walker and ***** ****** with Frank Foyston at rover, alternating with Foyston at Rover. He was the scoring leader in his first year and in the 1917 cup series, when the Mets defeated Candiens three games to one, Bernie scored 14 goals in four games, the best effort since the days of Frank McGee.
The next year he centred ****** and Gord Roberts while in 1919 he played RW on a line with Foyston and ****** and the Mets won another championship... He was chosen for the PCHA All-Star Teams of 1918 and 1919... He had three more good years with Seattle centering Foyston and *** *****. Two of those years they were in the playoffs but lost to Vancouver.
He was traded to Calgary in 1924, where playing on a line with ***** ****** and Rusty Crawford he was a big factor in the Tigers winning the championship of the WCHL.
Total Hockey said:A goal-scoring star who helped bring the first Stanley Cup to the USA. He is sixth all-time in goals and fifth all-time in points in the PCHA.
Lord Stanley's Cup said:The goal-scoring star of the year.
Players: The Ultimate A-Z Guide Of Every Player Who Has Ever Played In the NHL said:It was not because of his NHL career that Morris was a legend by the time he retired. He was one of the great players of the PCHA, winning a Stanley Cup with Seattle and establishing himself as one of the great scorers of the game. In the 1917 Finals, he scored 14 goals in the series against Montreal with the great Georges Vezina in the nets. He is not in the HHOF, but some consider his exploits comparable to other PCHA stars such as Cyclone Taylor, Tommy Dunderdale, Mickey MacKay, and Frank Foyston, who are in the Hall. Perhaps his exclusion is because of the 1919-20 season, which he spent in prison after some trouble with U.S. Authorities.
Globe and Mail said:Bernie Morris, aggressive little center player...
The Trail Of the Stanley Cup said:(game 1, 3-1 Habs) Bernie Morris was the best for Seattle, scoring three of their goals and keeping Vezina hopping with many other attempts.
(game 2, 6-1 Seattle) Bernie Morris and Frank Foyston were the stars.
(game 3, 4-1 Seattle) Bernie Morris was again the star for Seattle.
(game 4, 9-1 Seattle) Bernie Morris was sensational and easily the outstanding star. He scored six goals in this match, raising his total to 14 for the series, the best record since Frank McGee.
Backcheck: A Hockey Retrospective said:Morris seemed to be the principal fly in the Montreal ointment, the Seattle forward snagging six scores alone.
Seattlehockey.net said:The 1918-19 season was the fourth consecutive in which Morris led the Mets in scoring, and confidence in Seattle was high going into the two games, total goals playoff with Vancouver for the right to play for the Stanley Cup. A few hours before the start of the first game Bernie was informed that he was being sought by the authorities on charges of draft evasion. He immediately turned himself in, figuring that it was just a misunderstanding that would be cleared up quickly. He was wrong, and the subsequent investigation and court proceedings not only kept him out of the playoffs and 1919 Stanley Cup finals, but also resulted in his detention at Camp Lewis (now Fort Lewis) for almost a year, preventing him from taking the ice for the 1919-20 season. His name was finally cleared in the spring of 1920, just in time to make the trip east with the Mets for the 1920 Stanley Cup finals against Ottawa. Morris wasn't in game shape, only earning two assists in five games as the Mets lost the series three games to two.
The Hamilton Bettmans select right-winger Billy Boucher
He's described as a "dangerous scorer" who "played a gritty style."
He has 4 top-tens in goals, and 2 top-tens in assists.
He led the league in PIMs twice, and has a Stanley Cup to his name.
I think you need to edit some of that bio.
Also, regarding the Alfredsson-Barber comparison, Alfredsson was the captain and best player for a very good team that, yes, underachieved in the playoffs. Barber was the third best player at most on his Cup-winning teams. It's not exactly a fair comparison. Give the Senators Bernie Parent and I think they win at least one Cup - 2003 and 2006 are both good possibilities. And when it comes to leadership, Barber had Bobby Clarke and others; not really comparable to Ottawa. I agree that you don't really count on Alfredsson for leadership in this format, but 1) his leadership might be looked on very differently if the Sens had ever had a good goalie in the playoffs, and 2) As players, Alfredsson's resume is every bit as good as Barber's.
I really wonder who here actually saw Bill Barber play. I don't think this comparison would be made with a straight face by anyone who did.
The guy who is Alfredsson's owner made the comparison, not me. I'm not sure what is so "unfair" about cross-examining someone for making such a bold claim. All of the mights and maybes about Alfie's career are monopoly money in the ATD - god only knows how many "could have beens" we could throw around about bygone players if we got started with that kind of silly speculation. It's only because we've all seen Alfie play that anyone even attempts this kind of revisionism.
Alfie's questionable track record as captain is not, however, the biggest reason why he doesn't belong in Barber's category among ATD wingers. On ATD 1st lines, if you're going to put a lesser player into that situation, he needs to at least bring what it takes to match up with opposing 1st liners. Barber is a guy who you can put on the ice against a Richard or a Howe, and while he certainly won't win the matchup, he has the tools to effectively check both players, while contributing offensively to an ATD 1st unit in a secondary role. Considering that a healthy majority of history's greatest wingers (especially the power forwards) have played on the right side, a fast, physical 2-way left winger like Barber is extremely valuable in countering opponent's top line players. Alfredsson is soft and he plays the right wing. That, alone, puts him in a lesser category than Barber. The leadership issue is not the most important difference between the two.
loh.net said:As a player, Frank was revolutionary, much like Lester, who was then a star with the Montreal Wanderers. In the years prior to the Patricks' rise, the position of defense was used strictly to protect a team's own goal. Together, they were the first defensemen to rush with the puck and play an offensive role. The family moved to Nelson, British Columbia, where the brothers continued to win converts to their rushing style.
...When Frank was introduced as a Millionaire, he was called the best defenseman in the world.
...Patrick scored six goals in one game, establishing a record that has never been surpassed by NHL defenders. Frank was the leader, on the ice and in the boardroom, of a Vancouver team that won the Stanley Cup.
Ultimate Hockey said:In his earlier days, Patrick was a top-notch defender... never shied away from the rough stuff... a strong skater whose stickhandling ability allowed him to indulge his fondness for the rush... Frank was a standout for teams such as the Montreal Victorias, Renfrew Creamery Kings and Vancouver Millionaires.
...with his team headed for a championship, he could not stay off the ice. He played a pocketful of games that year and when Si Griffis broke his leg, Patrick hopped over the boards yet again. He scored two goals as Vancouver swept the series from the Ottawa Senators in three straight games.
The Trail Of the Stanley Cup said:He was not the equal of Lester as a player but nevertheless he was a very good defenseman. A rugged and well-built athlete, he did not mind mixing it up with players like Joe Hall. He holds one record that has stood for 50 (now 90+) years, being the only player to score six goals in a game while playing defence... He performed as a regular player himself on the Vancouver team. He was good enough to make the PCHA All-Star Team... In 1915 he decided to devote full time to his official duties. When his team was headed for the championship he could not keep off the ice. He played a few games of the regular schedule and then when Si Griffis broke his leg, Patrick took over his defense position and swept Ottawa in three games, Patrick scoring two goals.
The Renfrew Millionaires said:An outstanding defenseman and equally outstanding as a keen student of hockey
Hockey Hall of Fame Legends said:A superlative combination of athletic prowess, philosophical ingenuity and vision... a formidable puckhandler and rushing defenseman.
The Renfrew Millionaires said:Lester and Frank Patrick delighted the railbirds with their beautiful stickhandling and skating.
The Patricks: Hockey's Royal Family said:For some reason, perhaps because of his deceptively quiet manner, Frank was always being "tested" by the opposition, and Newsy was one of the best testers in the business. On this particular occasion, it was Lalonde, frustrated at what he felt to be Frank's overenthusiastic checking, clubbed him on the side of the head with the butt of his stick, opening a gash beside the ear. Staggered by the force of the blow, Frank had wheeled, reeled, and while going down had expertly countered with an almost identical blow to the base of Lalonde's skull. Newsy also went down, and out. It may have been the first time that both protagonists in a two-man brawl were carted off the ice together.
The Patricks: Hockey's Royal Family said:Although Ernie Russell scored five times for the victors, Frank, who bagged a pair of goals for the losers, was named the outstanding player.
The Patricks: Hockey's Royal Family said:Through toe contest, Hall and Patrick had been exchanging pokes and chops, and already bloodied by a swipe from Patrick, Hall had had enough. After taking one more of these knocks, Joe went splashing up the ice after Frank, who hit him again. Hall stopped and struck back with his stick, slicing Frank's cheek. A lively scrap ensued, during which Hall received yet another nasty gash, this time over his eye.
The Renfrew Millionaires said:Bod Joe was constantly running at the Patricks... Frank had fought back, too hard, insisted Hall, who said that he had been crosschecked by patrick earlier, without a penalty being called... Hall was continually frustrated in his attempts to corner Frank Patrick. The latter was retaliating... Their lively scrap terminated when Hall dropped his stick and hit Patrick, who retaliated with a Jefferys punch
The Renfrew Millionaires said:One particular Haileybury fan was most obnoxious. Not only did he shout obscenities at the players as they skated close to the boards in the area where he was perched, he would also shove a stick through the wire screen in an attempt to poke them. Renfrew players had become aware of him and warned eachother of his habit, wondering aloud as to why such fans were allowed into the game. He seemd to be especially primed to goad Taylor and when The Cyclone was sandwiched between two Haileybury players, causing him to fall heavily to the ice, the fan jmped up next to the screen. He pounded on the mesh with his hands, shouting a stream of obscenities at the dazed and windless Cyclone. He moved along the boards, and reached the ara directly above where Taylor lay. He hovered over the writhing form, separated only by the screen which his face pushed against, the steady torrent of abuse continuing.
Frank Patrick, normally a mild-mannered individual, bent over his teammate, disgusted at the individual. Suddenly he wheeled, the butt-end of his stick smashing against the screen in the exact location of the insensitive screamer's face. A spatter of blood spurted from his nose and sprayed the screen, boards, and ice. The suddenly quieted disturber slowly slumped out of view.
Even after Frank Patrick butt-ended the foul-mouthed fan, Haileybury's Art Ross skated over towards him and surreptitiously offered his congratulations and thanks for having quieted the troublemaker.
The Patricks: Hockey's Royal Family said:It wasn't until half an hour before game time that Frank had even decided to play. He had sustained a deep cut under the eye five days before against Victoria, and although the stitches had been removed, the eye was still badly swollen. Against New Westminster, the cut was reopened in the 3rd period and began streaming blood, but he stayed on the ice for the full game and beat ******** for his sixth goal just before the final whistle.
The Stanley Cup said:The score was tied 1-1 when Frank Patrick broke through the entire Ottawa team to score a sensational goal. The Senators never recovered, and were beaten 6-2.
The Trail Of The Stanley Cup said:Frank patrick filled in on the defence himself and took keen delight in jousting with his old pal Art Ross.
Backcheck: A hockey retrospective said:Cook and Frank Patrick were in great form on the defence and were hard to beat. The rushes of both of them were of the spectacular order.
NY Times said:The fine team from Vancouver of the PCHA, which will represent the far west in the sectional conflict for titular honors, will include, among others, Frank Patrick, who is undoubtely the most sensational player in Canada.
Maybe, I was a little harsh but I really don't like Fergy. I would take Kurtenbach ahead of Fergy any day, Kurtenbach was a much better skater & player. Maybe Fergy did put up better stats but he had better team mates. His stats aren't that great when you consider Beliveau was his usual centre. Just not sure what Fergy brings to a ATD team. Fighting isn't important, He can't keep up with the fleet RW's in his division, and he certainly won't score. At least Kurtenbach can play a strong checking role. Good guy to put up against big offensive centres.i selected ferguson as a 4th-line role player - a position i believe he suits well.
in my opinion, i don't see much that separates him from an earlier 4th line pick (orland kurtenbach - who, for the record, was a solid pick). both were tough but, fergie has a higher ppg, beat kurt in points in nearly every season, has a championship pedigree, and is spoken of very highly by his teammates (i.e., jean beliveau).
also, i believe he does have the ability to play in a fourth-line role in the atd. he certainly had no trouble holding down a job in the original 6 era. and, certainly had no trouble helping his team to 5 stanley cups., in which he played an important role. he's by no means the slowest player / worst skater in the draft - as a 4th liner, he'll definitely be used sparingly.
The guy who is Alfredsson's owner made the comparison, not me. I'm not sure what is so "unfair" about cross-examining someone for making such a bold claim. All of the mights and maybes about Alfie's career are monopoly money in the ATD - god only knows how many "could have beens" we could throw around about bygone players if we got started with that kind of silly speculation. It's only because we've all seen Alfie play that anyone even attempts this kind of revisionism.
Alfie's questionable track record as captain is not, however, the biggest reason why he doesn't belong in Barber's category among ATD wingers. On ATD 1st lines, if you're going to put a lesser player into that situation, he needs to at least bring what it takes to match up with opposing 1st liners. Barber is a guy who you can put on the ice against a Richard or a Howe, and while he certainly won't win the matchup, he has the tools to effectively check both players, while contributing offensively to an ATD 1st unit in a secondary role. Considering that a healthy majority of history's greatest wingers (especially the power forwards) have played on the right side, a fast, physical 2-way left winger like Barber is extremely valuable in countering opponent's top line players. Alfredsson is soft and he plays the right wing. That, alone, puts him in a lesser category than Barber. The leadership issue is not the most important difference between the two.
D George McNamara - a gigantic, defensive defenseman who loves to bodycheck and is a member of the HHOF. And perhaps, more importantly, he was a first team allstar in MLD 11. I think he's a worthy #6 in this thing. I mean, we're at the point where we are selecting #4 guys from dynasties to be defensive dmen, so I think a HOFer, (even from an early era) fits in.
Although I think Alfredsson was better in real life, I grant your points on Barber's advantages in the ATD setting. I'm not arguing that Alfredsson should be drafted ahead of Barber. But I can't let this bit pass - Alfredsson is not and never was soft. He doesn't run around hitting guys, but he goes hard after the puck and will initiate contact or take a hit to make a play. Maybe he would get run over by Gordie Howe coming out of the corner, but he wouldn't back down.
The Hockey News
In 1981-82, he became the only player in NHL history to register 40 goals and more than 300 penalty minutes in a single season, a standard that still stands today.
Joe Pelletier, Legends of Hockey
He took over from Bobby Hull as the Blackhawks 50 goal scorer. At the same time he took over from xxxx xxxx as the Hawks enforcer and heart and soul. It sounds like almost the perfect combination for a hockey player. For a couple of seasons in the 1980s, Al Secord was that player.
In Cam Neely-like fashion, Secord could hurt you two ways - with his goals, or with his fists. Playing on Chicago's "Party Line" with Denis Savard and Steve Larmer, Secord scored 40 goals three times, including 54 in 1982-83. At the same time he was a hard crashing forechecker and a feared fighter.
Secord's first full season in Chicago, 1981-82, was his break out year. Playing on left wing with superstar Denis Savard, Secord scored 44 goals and 75 points, while amassing an amazing 303 penalty minutes.
"I was playing with Denis Savard regularly. My presence gave him more time to operate on ice and I got more ice-time than ever before. I played really physical game that year and I fought quite a bit. Even though I had a lot of penalty minutes that year, I never thought I got penalties because of my reputation. The referees respected me and I respected them."
Secord took his game to the next level in the 1982-83 season, becoming only the 2nd Blackhawk player to score 50 goals. He finished with 54 goals, 20 of them on the power play, and 86 points. With his obvious scoring importance, he toned his fighting game down, and picked up only 180 PIMs.
Former teammate Terry Ruskowski had was glad Secord was on his team.
"Secord was very strong in the corners. He intimidated a lot of people and because of his presence he got the puck. In front of the net he got a lot of deflections. Guys were scared to move him out because if they cross-checked him or hit him too hard, Al was coming back to get revenge on them.
"A lot of people thought Al was just a tough guy who couldn't play. He worked hard in the corner, he had a very good shot, and he was strong on his skates.
After a 50 goal season and 2nd consecutive all star game nod, all seemed to go well with Secord's career. But then disaster struck when he was forced to deal with a serious injury. He missed all but 19 games with torn abdominal muscles. The season after that he missed considerable time with pulled muscles in his thigh. Doctors determined the two serious injuries were related as Secord had one leg that was measurably shorter than the other.
Secord returned to a full 80 game season in 1985-86, and even hit the 40-goal mark for once more. In one game he equaled the NHL record for fastest 4 goals by one player, scoring on 4 shots in 8:24. But the injury continued to hamper him, affecting both his skating and his conditioning. He would spend only one more season in Chicago.
Nice. He was one of two I was considering as my team's #7. Here's hoping one of you doesn't reach to get the other defenseman I think should make his big draft debut.D George McNamara - a gigantic, defensive defenseman who loves to bodycheck and is a member of the HHOF. And perhaps, more importantly, he was a first team allstar in MLD 11. I think he's a worthy #6 in this thing. I mean, we're at the point where we are selecting #4 guys from dynasties to be defensive dmen, so I think a HOFer, (even from an early era) fits in.