ZAR

[Dipsy Doodle]

ZAR is producing at around a 34 pt race in his career. Even if he is playing with whoever, he’s still producing at a pretty solid rate given ice time and usage.

A Sheary-esque pace over 59 games while being used with elite offensive players far more often than his play warranted, and that's not counting a lone assist over 13 playoff games.

Meh.

 

[Tender Rip]

A Sheary-esque pace over 59 games while being used with elite offensive players far more often than his play warranted, and that's not counting a lone assist over 13 playoff games.

Meh.

I think that's fair. What would also be fair would be to check what he does next season before closing the book on him. We are talking about a guy who effectively has less than a season in the NHL so far.
Would be worth more for us to have him come genuinely useful than having that likely cap-room extra.

 

[ziggyjoe212]

ZAR has a Horny-esque skill set. I feel like Sullivan hopes he reaches Horny's level as those kind of players are hard to find.

Still, I don't understand why ZAR get's more playing time than Blueger.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I think that's fair. What would also be fair would be to check what he does next season before closing the book on him. We are talking about a guy who effectively has less than a season in the NHL so far.
Would be worth more for us to have him come genuinely useful than having that likely cap-room extra.

I would generally agree, but for me it's not about cap space with ZAR, it's about usage. If Sully continues to shoehorn him into the top 6/9 above better options, then that's a drag on the roster. I'd like to see ZAR earn his opportunities, but he might be a toy JR has to take away.

 

[TheDuderino]

methink he is not good on PK, always step late...when he is in we collapse, thats shi... PK

You can *think* whatever. Your problem is that when he was added to the PK a) he scored their first shorty and b) the PK % went steadily up.

 

[TheDuderino]

I would generally agree, but for me it's not about cap space with ZAR, it's about usage. If Sully continues to shoehorn him into the top 6/9 above better options, then that's a drag on the roster. I'd like to see ZAR earn his opportunities, but he might be a toy JR has to take away.

Who is the better option?

 

[TheDuderino]

I think we saw, briefly, ZAR's upside and it was quite good - IF he can maintain that level. Unfortunately he got injured and never regained his form.

I'd like to see ZAR get 2 years here. There's a chance he could be that "complementary" piece in the Top 6 that works either for a season or two or maybe just small stretches. He's worth keeping around.

This off-season is huge for him. Simon too.

 

[TheDuderino]

There's every reason to doubt his abilities.

11 of ZAR's 17 points came with one of Kessel, Malkin, or Crosby. Sprong's 3 years younger, a much greater portion of his points were goals, he didn't play with any offensive talent comparable to our top 3 forwards in Anaheim, and only 4 of his 19 points came with Getzlaf.

They aren't comparable.

ZAR is the better player. Sprong was given his shot at a Top 6 player several times here and failed miserably every time. ZAR produced in that role.

ZAR more TK than GV Sprong opposite by nearly 2-1

ZAR far more physical

ZAR 200’ Sprong 60’ on a good day...

ZAR better scoring pace with no PP time that’s a Sprong got...

There is really no metric that matters that reveals Sprong as the better player...

Btw, a player with Cy Young stats isn’t a positive.,,

 

[TheDuderino]

Still, I don't understand why ZAR get's more playing time than Blueger.

Because he’s better. So is Simon.

 

[TheDuderino]

ZAR is not a skilled player at the NHL level, and again, college scoring does not refute this. There have been plenty of older college players who've scored a ton and not been skilled enough to make an impact at the NHL level. None of that takes what you said out of context.

I can’t believe I’m in this conversation. Bennett was teamed with vet and skilled players at Denver. ZAR was not until his Junior year.

ZAR was arguably the best forward player in the NCAA most of his Junior season and all of his Senior season.

There has never been a time above PeeWee when Bennett was considered the best player in his league.

ZAR is far and above a much better player than Beau Bennett in both skill and accomplishment. It’s ridiculous to even believe otherwise and beyond ridiculous to make that argument.

We also don’t know what ZAR will do at the NHL level. He’s shown skill and he’s shown growing pains. I’ve said before that this off season is huge for him. Let’s see a greater body of work before declaring him a *plug*...

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

ZAR is the better player. Sprong was given his shot at a Top 6 player several times here and failed miserably every time. ZAR produced in that role.

ZAR more TK than GV Sprong opposite by nearly 2-1

ZAR far more physical

ZAR 200’ Sprong 60’ on a good day...

ZAR better scoring pace with no PP time that’s a Sprong got...

There is really no metric that matters that reveals Sprong as the better player...

Btw, a player with Cy Young stats isn’t a positive.,,

Oh? When was that?

 

[Gurglesons]

A Sheary-esque pace over 59 games while being used with elite offensive players far more often than his play warranted, and that's not counting a lone assist over 13 playoff games.

Meh.

ZAR played more time without Sid and Malkin combined than with and actually contribute to more goals for without them.

Interesting to criticize his production as a forward in the playoffs when he was a 4th liner.

I think you’re really reaching here about ZAR being useless like most on here. I’m not a huge fan, but he’s a nothing cost prospect with some potential and the majority of the time he has been played in the top six has been due to injury and he has produced.

 

[steelcityassault]

Oh? When was that?

@ NYI only full game with Sid. 1 goal 2 assists

 

[TheDuderino]

@ NYI only full game with Sid. 1 goal 2 assists

IIRC, he played there the next game as well and was -2 and got yanked and then demoted...and the NYI sucked last year...

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I can’t believe I’m in this conversation. Bennett was teamed with vet and skilled players at Denver. ZAR was not until his Junior year.

ZAR was arguably the best forward player in the NCAA most of his Junior season and all of his Senior season.

There has never been a time above PeeWee when Bennett was considered the best player in his league.

ZAR is far and above a much better player than Beau Bennett in both skill and accomplishment. It’s ridiculous to even believe otherwise and beyond ridiculous to make that argument.

We also don’t know what ZAR will do at the NHL level. He’s shown skill and he’s shown growing pains. I’ve said before that this off season is huge for him. Let’s see a greater body of work before declaring him a *plug*...

For a guy who follows college hockey closely, you have trouble weighting the accomplishments of a 1st rounder as a freshman/sophomore and an undrafted player who put up numbers as a junior/senior.

Bennett was always more skilled than ZAR.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

ZAR played more time without Sid and Malkin combined than with and actually contribute to more goals for without them.

Interesting to criticize his production as a forward in the playoffs when he was a 4th liner.

I think you’re really reaching here about ZAR being useless like most on here. I’m not a huge fan, but he’s a nothing cost prospect with some potential and the majority of the time he has been played in the top six has been due to injury and he has produced.

Interesting? Well, yeah, it's kind of my point. Spoonfeed him time with elite offensive players and he can produce like Sheary between injuries. Play him away from elite offensive players and he doesn't really produce.

He should be a 4th liner on this team if he's on the team at all. The problem is that the coach always plays him out of his depth.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Who is the better option?

This past season? Any number of players. We'd have benefitted from Blueger or Johnson in the line-up over ZAR in the playoffs.

 

[Gurglesons]

Interesting? Well, yeah, it's kind of my point. Spoonfeed him time with elite offensive players and he can produce like Sheary between injuries. Play him away from elite offensive players and he doesn't really produce.

He should be a 4th liner on this team if he's on the team at all. The problem is that the coach always plays him out of his depth.

But he’s producing at a relative level as a 4th liner as he is with Malkin. (He spent 20 or so minutes with Sid this year).

This coach doesn’t always play him out of his depth. Our LW depth for the majority of the year was Jake, ZAR, Simon, Hagelin and Pearson. Everyone outside of Jake saw equal minutes with Geno.

I know your personal agendas so let’s just leave Rust out of it. ZAR was basically forced to be with Malkin.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

But he’s producing at a relative level as a 4th liner as he is with Malkin. (He spent 20 or so minutes with Sid this year).

This coach doesn’t always play him out of his depth. Our LW depth for the majority of the year was Jake, ZAR, Simon, Hagelin and Pearson. Everyone outside of Jake saw equal minutes with Geno.

I know your personal agendas so let’s just leave Rust out of it. ZAR was basically forced to be with Malkin.

It's a regular thing pixies. And yes, the dumb usage of Rust factors in.

 

[Gurglesons]

It's a regular thing pixies. And yes, the dumb usage of Rust factors in.

It isn’t a regular thing.. he player over 70 more minutes than with Sid and Geno combined.

 

[steelcityassault]

IIRC, he played there the next game as well and was -2 and got yanked and then demoted...and the NYI sucked last year...

Now we're looking at which specific team it was done against... my God

 

[TheDuderino]

Now we're looking at which specific team it was done against... my God

Yes...how dare me point out that his best game scoring wise was against the team that was easiest to score against last season...my so bad...

 

[wizmet12]

ZAR is the better player. Sprong was given his shot at a Top 6 player several times here and failed miserably every time. ZAR produced in that role.

ZAR more TK than GV Sprong opposite by nearly 2-1

ZAR far more physical

ZAR 200’ Sprong 60’ on a good day...

ZAR better scoring pace with no PP time that’s a Sprong got...

There is really no metric that matters that reveals Sprong as the better player...

Btw, a player with Cy Young stats isn’t a positive.,,

lol

 

[TheDuderino]

This past season? Any number of players. We'd have benefitted from Blueger or Johnson in the line-up over ZAR in the playoffs.

The Johnson comment was just plain silly...he was limited in his ice for a reason... mostly that he was routinely ragdolled.

Blueger was in the lineup in Game 2. It’s telling you forgot that. Given his performance, it’s also not surprising.

 

[TheDuderino]

For a guy who follows college hockey closely, you have trouble weighting the accomplishments of a 1st rounder as a freshman/sophomore and an undrafted player who put up numbers as a junior/senior.

Bennett was always more skilled than ZAR.

There is no real hockey world that exists in which Beau Bennett (a puck universally panned, btw) was or is a better player than ZAR.

It’s not even a matter of agreeing to disagree. It’s a ridiculous argument and I’m now out of it.

Feel free to claim the last word...