Would you rather have this Leafs or Jets group of four young forwards?

[VoluntaryDom]

This may get taken as an insult, but it is seriously not meant be one.

Why are people so high on Hyman now? Not saying he isn’t a good player but I just remember a lot of people last year saying that Matthews was carrying him/Matthews was stuck playing with him. Has he improved a great deal?

Just want a legitimate answer without this turning into a flame war.

He's doing much more offensively. But he's still not particularly good.

 

[Leafidelity]

He's doing much more offensively. But he's still not particularly good.

He's still the best PKer on a team with a real good PK. And 14 goals isn't too shabby.

 

[Peggy]

you can tell a lot of leafs fans don't understand the importance of these players because of depth
I hear leafs fans talk shit about hyman and even brown

guys like Lowry are praised because of the matchup he faces and physical presents he brings on the ice
armia as well has offensive upside, but has found himself usefully in a depth role, but you could probably use him top 6 if need be

roslovic will get there. it's his first nhl season
Winnipeg doesn't like to rush their projects
let them learn the game

I guess leafs, likely that all of them stay bottom 6 players, by talent or depth.

roslovic is projected top 6
what're you talking about

right now he's playing on winder as a depth role because the jets are got centres down the middle and the teams kind of "stacked" atm
it's not gonna be easy to beat established nhlers that easily

ehlers, laine, wheeler, perreault, Connor

 

[VoluntaryDom]

He's still the best PKer on a team with a real good PK. And 14 goals isn't too shabby.

Yeah I'm not doubting his PK ability, forechecking, or overall two way game. I just don't think he'd have much production without Matthews and Nylander and the like. He's a 3rd liner.

 

[ole ole]

Surprised by the results. Makes me wonder how many posters actually watch the Leafs and Jets. The Jets are my 2nd team and I can say with 100% certainty that the Leafs group are better players.

That's because the Leafs are your favorite team.
Give me the Jet players.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

you can tell a lot of leafs fans don't understand the importance of these players because of depth
I hear leafs fans talk **** about hyman and even brown

guys like Lowry are praised because of the matchup he faces and physical presents he brings on the ice
armia as well has offensive upside, but has found himself usefully in a depth role, but you could probably use him top 6 if need be

roslovic will get there. it's his first nhl season
Winnipeg doesn't like to rush their projects
let them learn the game




roslovic is projected top 6
what're you talking about

right now he's playing on winder as a depth role because the jets are got centres down the middle and the teams kind of "stacked" atm
it's not gonna be easy to beat established nhlers that easily

ehlers, laine, wheeler, perreault, Connor

My point exactly ^
Yes Roslovic will be bottom 6. Who is he going to replace in the top 6?

 

[Maplebeasts]

Jets AINEC.

Mind you, Connor Brown is involved in this poll so you never know. Leafs fans didn't want to trade him for Trouba a few months ago:

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/trouba-to-toronto.2395933/

Laughable.

Not as laughable as not pointing out that only a very, very small number of us actually agree with that.

 

[Peggy]

My point exactly ^
Yes Roslovic will be bottom 6. Who is he going to replace in the top 6?

we're hoping little eventually when he's ready. but right bow the jets are looking to make a Stanley cup push

whether you agree they can make it or not. Chevy didn't push for brassard and statsny to win a round
so right now he's on the wing
maybe he starts seeing more time as centre next year

plus just because he plays bottom 6 doesn't mean he's a bottom 6 player
that's like saying Malkin is a 2nd line centre because he plays on the 2nd line

 

[Peggy]

it's funny because leafs fans always used the narrative you pick the centre over wings

well here you have 3 centres and a winger vs 4 wingers

what changed the narrative ?

 

[WillTheThrill]

Jets AINEC.

Mind you, Connor Brown is involved in this poll so you never know. Leafs fans didn't want to trade him for Trouba a few months ago:

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/trouba-to-toronto.2395933/

Laughable.

Off topic but I still would not do this trade as a Leaf fan. Dermott is just way too valuable. In fact, among all NHL defensemen with 10+ games played since the All Star break, Dermott leads in 5v5 points per 60.

 

[Peggy]

Off topic but I still would not do this trade as a Leaf fan. Dermott is just way too valuable. In fact, among all NHL defensemen with 10+ games played since the All Star break, Dermott leads in 5v5 points per 60.

it's not like the leafs are perfect . they still need some work

having another defenseman like trouba would do great for the leafs
it's working well for winnipeg and he doesn't even wanna play here lol

 

[Hischier and Hughes]

Without Matthews how good is Hyman really?

Serious question

 

[The Podium]

Without Matthews how good is Hyman really?

Serious question

Probably the same. This isnt a Maroon situation, Hyman will always be what he is; a bottom 6 forward who is amongst the best on the team defensively and on the forecheck.

 

[TOGuy14]

Without Matthews how good is Hyman really?

Serious question

His game would probably be exactly the same since most of his offence is generate from his own hustle and forecheck.

If he didn't have absolute stone hands he would probably have an extra 15+ goals a season with the way Matthews feeds him all the time.

Likely to get the same amount of points / performance playing on any of the top 3 lines for us with any players around him.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Without Matthews how good is Hyman really?

Serious question

The real question is how good Matthews would be without Hyman.

 

[WillTheThrill]

it's not like the leafs are perfect . they still need some work

having another defenseman like trouba would do great for the leafs
it's working well for winnipeg and he doesn't even wanna play here lol

I agree they need work, especially on the back end. However I don't think Trouba is worth parting with Dermott. Dermott may even end up just as good or better than him. The Leafs have a long window and don't need to part with a valuable asset like Dermott to get a player of Trouba's calibre.

 

[StatisticsAddict99]

I agree they need work, especially on the back end. However I don't think Trouba is worth parting with Dermott. Dermott may even end up just as good or better than him. The Leafs have a long window and don't need to part with a valuable asset like Dermott to get a player of Trouba's calibre.

Lol

 

[PhilJets]

Jets wuhuuu!

I bet Bobcock would Love Lowry on his team.

 

[Peggy]

I agree they need work, especially on the back end. However I don't think Trouba is worth parting with Dermott. Dermott may even end up just as good or better than him. The Leafs have a long window and don't need to part with a valuable asset like Dermott to get a player of Trouba's calibre.

that doesn't make sense

so you take the gamble that dermott ends up being better than trouba while he currently isn't? when trouba is a young defenseman who plays on a top pairing for the the jets?

because you don't want to part ways with players that are replaceable?

dermott and brown are easily more replaceable than trouba
every team in the league has prospects that could replace those 2
not every team has the prospects to replace trouba tho

 

[dratbunnies]

This is what I was talking about earlier, Leaf fans expect the compared players to be vastly better or else it’s “to close to call”(/ even/ in the Leaf players favour).

Roslovic has more PPG in the NHL and PPG in the AHL this season, he is actually much better than anyone in this poll and has the highest ceiling.

Good thing "too close to call" is a perfectly legitimate answer :p

 

[snowkiddin]

In the Matthews’ threads, Matthews makes the players around him better.

In this thread, Hyman is the exact same without Matthews.

Heavens.

 

[StatisticsAddict99]

In the Matthews’ threads, Matthews makes the players around him better.

In this thread, Hyman is the exact same without Matthews.

Heavens.

I have no issue with Hyman, I personally think he is probably the most valuable player in the poll as he is very good defensively and helps Matthews allot(he’s very underrated in Toronto), but yeah allot of Leaf fans arguments take a 360 when it comes to the next individual comparison. My main issue is all these Leaf fans saying that basically all of the Leafs players are just as good as Roslovic because there numbers are close(they’re not really, they down Play the word better and more, ie “he only has ___ more ___, so how is he better?”). This is why I think it’s hard to find a better player than a Toronto player, because it’s always virtually a tie or they are better if it’s close(look at Nylander/ Ehlers, Ehlers has out produced Nylander last year and now this year and there are plenty of Leaf fans that say Nylander is better and the majority says it’s a tie). The only way you can beat them is if your player is significantly better(but then there is a slim of excuses behind that as well).

 

[Krauser]

Using the SKATR comparison tool: Tableau Public

Armia vs Hyman


Edge to Armia, especially defensively.

Copp vs Brown


Copp easily the worst Jet here, can’t score. Even then, he’s miles better than Brown at shot suppression despite heavy defensive zone starts.

Lowry vs Kapanen


Kapanen looks OK here but Lowry’s one of the best defensive forwards in the league. Oh, and he’s a centre — we all know how valuable they are.

Roslovic vs Johnsson

Johnsson’s only played 5 NHL games in this, his D+5 year. He’ll turn 24 in November, while Roslovic will still be 21. Johnsson doesn’t show up in the SKATR tool, so I decided to compare Roslovic to a top 6 Leafs winger also born in 1997 and drafted in 2015:



Edge to Marner, but Roslovic holds up well on several fronts (Game score, CF%, xGF%, 5v5 points). Might turn out to be more than a depth player in the long run.

...

Lowry and Armia look better than any of the Leafs in this poll, especially Lowry who’s just a force defensively. Roslovic gets the small sample size warning but his numbers aren’t far off Marner’s 5v5. Jets also have 2 successful centres here and another (Roslovic) who played C in the AHL and may move to the middle next year.

So it’s the Jets, easily.

 

[Hunter368]

Jets wuhuuu!

I bet Bobcock would Love Lowry on his team.

Damn right he would love Lowry, Lowry’s a monster defensively, physically, fights, center, 6’5” tall, only 24 years old and can score at a 3rd line rate. Perfect 3rd liner.

 

[WillTheThrill]

that doesn't make sense

so you take the gamble that dermott ends up being better than trouba while he currently isn't? when trouba is a young defenseman who plays on a top pairing for the the jets?

because you don't want to part ways with players that are replaceable?

dermott and brown are easily more replaceable than trouba
every team in the league has prospects that could replace those 2
not every team has the prospects to replace trouba tho

Dermott has been one of the Leafs best 4 defenseman since being called up. He's only 21. Lol at every team in the league having a prospect like Dermott though.