Wait wait.. you think Franzen is playing better than Kaberle ever did?
I read that, and stopped reading.
For one thing, it's apples and oranges. Kaberle is a defencemen, Franzen is a forward. However, Kaberle was a top pairing defencemen. Kaberle actually has scored 65+ points in his career, Franzen has never topped 60. Kaberle at one time was counted on for nearly 30 minutes a game. Franzen?
Kaberle at his best was a #1 defencemen. Franzen has never been more than a 2nd line center thus far in his career.
You realize Kaberle is a defencemen right?
Wow.
Been away for a while.
I
meant to say at their best (NOW) IE 2011 both giving 100% i would rather have Franzen vs Kaberle. Obviously comparing career stats Kaberle comes out on top, no questions, he has put up good numbers I'm no idiot, its not hard to look up career stats. He is good offensively, no doubt. I will leave it at that.
Maybe now that's clarified, try reading the post of mine.
I made it quite clear now Toronto has a slight edge in prospect pools. I also made it quite clear that its not due to Toronto having superior drafting, where my team obviously has the advantage. That's my whole point here in the thread. I got arguments against that fact, so I put forward facts showing this.
I showed that If Toronto had not traded players off its roster(you can call it a rebuild) its current prospect pool(I listed the one before the new hf rankings came out since they weren't out yet) would be left looking something definitely less then it is right now. If you also remove additional draft picks that Toronto had at its disposal due to trading roster players for picks then their current pool of prospects is not as good either. You combine these two factors and compare players drafted from original picks, then our current prospect pool would be better obviously, and that would mean our drafting is better too right?
@Other Leaf fans in the thread:
I see some of you have disagreed that getting additional draft picks from trading roster players is not going to effect the outcome of your prospect pool? Lets make this really simple: THIS IS JUST AN EXAMPLE. If TEAM A has twice as many draft picks as TEAM B, it makes sense TEAM A's prospect pool is going to look better since they have twice as many chances of drafting players.
Now leaf fans if we were to look at ability of drafting, let us compare what each team has drafted(in our current pools) via original picks, and then compare prospect pools. Detroit has the better pool. Your team also picks before Detroit and usually not just by a bit. Just re-read my post, and you will see it.
If you add in the prospects your team traded roster players for, and add in the additional prospects that they drafted by obtaining ADDITIONAL picks, THEN Toronto's prospect pool looks slightly better.
My point is it doesn't mean you have better drafting. Who would have the better prospect pool if Detroit traded roster players for 3 new additional top prospects, and then also traded 3 roster players for multiple picks, like firsts and seconds? Obviously Detroit would.
@OTHER LEAF FANS:
One of you guys sad its silly I'm comparing 30 years of draft history between the two teams to show who is better at drafting. The reason I'm doing this is because their is a little girl in the thread whining that it is luck Detroit was able to obtain better players in late rounds via the draft during a twenty year period and that's the only reason why our drafting was better. So i go back another ten years, and we compare again our drafting, so our team again out drafts you, so for a 30 year period Detroit out drafts Toronto. My argument is you cant argue that a team is better at drafting continually better players over a thirty year period because luck cancels itself out after such a long period of time. So I made my point with evidence (that no leaf fan has attempted or can try to refute). Which is all I wanted to do. Thank you.
@LEAF FANS SAYING THE LAST FEW YEARS TORONTO HAS PUT FORWARD MORE NHLers:
If our team picks near last every time and picks for skill, then our picks are going to be deficient in one area or another that means it takes longer for them to arrive. Guys that get drafted in the top 10 or around that in the first round have a good chance at being nhl ready, the guys later on in the draft order are often projects that are going to need time to be nhl ready (usually lack of size or strength). That's one reason some more of Toronto's recent picks have made it to the NHL sooner then Detroit's-see the 2006 and reference earlier in the thread by EmbrasedBias. Another reason is Detroit has a stronger team than Toronto so its harder for prospects to make the team, which means the have to wait longer, or sometimes have to get traded before they see significant nhl duty(See Quincey). So because of this a bit more Toronto draftees lately make it to the Nhl. Some of them wouldn't make Detroit in the first place.
This is talked about in
this article:
