Wings Select Lucas Raymond 4th Overall

[Oddbob]

It gives me hope that 2020-21 is the last year of bottoming out and transition before the upswing begins in 2021-22.

I hope we only play 40 games (wishful and joking thinking) as we are going to suck and this year wore my energy out! Tough to watch this team without young guys getting a lot of the opportunity.

 

[ShanahanMan]

Raymond xxx Zadina
Berggren Larkin Mantha
Bertuzzi Veleno Fabbri
Soderblom Rasmussen Neiderbach
Svechnikov Grewe Mastrosimone

Pretty sick potential forward picees

Zadina has done nothing (so far) to indicate being a potential top 6 winger. Just too weak with the puck and horrible with turnovers. I hope this changes obviously but right now, I’m seeing 3rd line.

 

[TheMule93]

Zadina has done nothing (so far) to indicate being a potential top 6 winger. Just too weak with the puck and horrible with turnovers. I hope this changes obviously but right now, I’m seeing 3rd line.

did you watch him at all last year? He made huge strides and was playing extremely well prior to injury. Last year was a an awesome year for him in terms of development.

 

[Henkka]

Zadina has done nothing (so far) to indicate being a potential top 6 winger. Just too weak with the puck and horrible with turnovers. I hope this changes obviously but right now, I’m seeing 3rd line.

What is this bullshit?

You guys just whine and don't watch the games?

 

[Larkin2AA]

Zadina has done nothing (so far) to indicate being a potential top 6 winger. Just too weak with the puck and horrible with turnovers. I hope this changes obviously but right now, I’m seeing 3rd line.

This site is wild, man. What games were you watching? 2018 replays?

 

[Ezekial]

This site is wild, man. What games were you watching? 2018 replays?

did you watch him at all last year? He made huge strides and was playing extremely well prior to injury. Last year was a an awesome year for him in terms of development.

I'm convinced that guy just hates his life and comes on here to vent the frustrations of his day. I've never seen him say anything good about anything.

 

[nbwingsfan]

I mean, he’s a top 5 on most rankings. I’d be disappointed if he wasn’t putting up 90+ points in his prime.

I think you really overrate how many players actually hit 90pts...

Lafreniere, Stutzel anf Byfield are undoubtedly better/more offensive players and Perfetti was seen as just as offensive as him. So you think there will be 5+ 90pt players from this draft? That would make it probably the greatest draft of all time.

Temper expectations. Anything above ~65pts is gravy.

 

[Ezekial]

I think you really overrate how many players actually hit 90pts...

Lafreniere, Stutzel anf Byfield are undoubtedly better/more offensive players and Perfetti was seen as just as offensive as him. So you think there will be 5+ 90pt players from this draft? That would make it probably the greatest draft of all time.

Temper expectations. Anything above ~65pts is gravy.

I mean, Kyle Connor had 73 points in 71 games as a 22/23 year old last season. It's not a stretch to think one day Raymond could be a ppg player at some point.
The poster you are replying to is talking about prime Raymond.
Last season Mantha paced 72.4 points over an 82 game season, we better hope to Christ our highest draft pick in 30 years can produce at least that clip in his prime.

 

[nbwingsfan]

I mean, Kyle Connor had 73 points in 71 games as a 22/23 year old last season. It's not a stretch to think one day Raymond could be a ppg player at some point.
The poster you are replying to is talking about prime Raymond.
Last season Mantha paced 72.4 points over an 82 game season, we better hope you Christ our highest draft pick in 30 years can produce at least that in his prime.

And Kyle Connor and Mantha are very good first line players so im not sure what your point is there...

Its already been shown thay about ~10 players score 90+pts a season. There are three guys in the draft who are undoubtedly better than Raymond (right now) and another who was seen with a high offensive ceiling. So if we're playing "best case scenario" then there will be 5 of the 10 players who hit 90pts just from this draft alone? Highly unlikely.

I dont want the kid to be shit on by fans who have unrealistic expectations. Seventy is MUCH more realistic than expecting ninety plus.

 

[Ezekial]

And Kyle Connor and Mantha are very good first line players so im not sure what your point is there...

Its already been shown thay about ~10 players score 90+pts a season. There are three guys in the draft who are undoubtedly better than Raymond (right now) and another who was seen with a high offensive ceiling. So if we're playing "best case scenario" then there will be 5 of the 10 players who hit 90pts just from this draft alone? Highly unlikely.

I dont want the kid to be shit on by fans who have unrealistic expectations. Seventy is MUCH more realistic than expecting ninety plus.

Both players were picked in the late teens. I hope we picked a good first line player #4 overall.

 

[TCNorthstars]

I don't see Ras having 2nd line ability. He looked fine in the AHL, but he couldn't even show he had bottom line wing ability in the NHL. I see him as a middle 6 winger, and maybe even trade bait.

You mean when he was a baby giraffe who should have been in the AHL but couldn’t because of a stupid rule?

 

[nbwingsfan]

Both players were picked in the late teens. I hope we picked a good first line player #4 overall.

A 70point player IS a good first line player
Thats a strange way to look at things knowing how development works.

Jamie Benn was a Hart Trophy winner as like a 4th round pick? Should we expect all our picks in round 1-3 to be better?

Want me to list all the top 5 picks who ended up no where close to 90pt players?

Ill ask again, do you expect 5 or more players from this draft to be 90+ players?

 

[ArmChairGM89]

A 70point player IS a good first line player
Thats a strange way to look at things knowing how development works.

Jamie Benn was a Hart Trophy winner as like a 4th round pick? Should we expect all our picks in round 1-3 to be better?

Want me to list all the top 5 picks who ended up no where close to 90pt players?

Ill ask again, do you expect 5 or more players from this draft to be 90+ players?

There is nothing wrong with thinking the fourth overall pick might be capable of ppg+ at his peak.

especially considering teams might have passed on him simply for lack of playing time in a men’s league and thus less of a chance to prove his Current production capacity. I think he’s the most likely candidate to have been undervalued, for that reason.

 

[nbwingsfan]

There is nothing wrong with thinking the fourth overall pick might be capable of ppg+ at his peak.

especially considering teams might have passed on him simply for lack of playing time in a men’s league and thus less of a chance to prove his Current production capacity. I think he’s the most likely candidate to have been undervalued, for that reason.

There a massive difference between thinking a player "might" hit 90 points versus being disappointed if hes not scoring 90+ like the poster I responded to stated

 

[ArmChairGM89]

There a massive difference between thinking a player "might" hit 90 points versus being disappointed if hes not scoring 90+ like the poster I responded to stated

That’s true. I didn’t realize the original post. To expect 90+ out of anyone is kind of silly. Especially with the lack of exposure from Raymond last year. I hope he can be that. My disappointment comes in if he’s not scoring 70+ yearly.

 

[Henkka]

That’s true. I didn’t realize the original post. To expect 90+ out of anyone is kind of silly. Especially with the lack of exposure from Raymond last year. I hope he can be that. My disappointment comes in if he’s not scoring 70+ yearly.

Auston Matthews has scored 80 points at highest. 69-62-73-80 his career years.

Some f***ing realism in here.

 

[nbwingsfan]

That’s true. I didn’t realize the original post. To expect 90+ out of anyone is kind of silly. Especially with the lack of exposure from Raymond last year. I hope he can be that. My disappointment comes in if he’s not scoring 70+ yearly.

I agree. If hes scoring around 70pts a year ill be thrilled. Anything above that is above realistic expectations. Fully expecting him to be a top 10 offensive player consistently doesnt even make sense logistically

 

[ShanahanMan]

I'm convinced that guy just hates his life and comes on here to vent the frustrations of his day. I've never seen him say anything good about anything.

Was the personal jab really necessary? All because I’m tempering expectations with Zadina?

Yes, I agree he’s made strides and much better than he was in early 19, but he still, in my opinion, has not developed his game enough to be a top 2 line winger. Not until he gets better at protecting the puck and reducing turnovers.

Just being realistic.

And yeah, 11+ years as a member should give some indication I “watch games”.

 

[Henkka]

Best comparable for Raymond?

Imo,

DANIEL ALFREDSSON.

 

[TheOtherOne]

Best comparable for Raymond?

Imo,

DANIEL ALFREDSSON.

Why the f*** do prospect "comparables" always come from the same country?

What does the fact that "they were both born in Sweden" have to do with how they play hockey?

I will never understand this nonsense.

 

[ArmChairGM89]

Was the personal jab really necessary? All because I’m tempering expectations with Zadina?

Yes, I agree he’s made strides and much better than he was in early 19, but he still, in my opinion, has not developed his game enough to be a top 2 line winger. Not until he gets better at protecting the puck and reducing turnovers.

Just being realistic.

And yeah, 11+ years as a member should give some indication I “watch games”.

He was on pace for more goals and less give aways than Dylan Larkin. 5th year Dylan Larkin. Rookie zadina.

is dylan Larkin a top six player?

 

[Ezekial]

Auston Matthews has scored 80 points at highest. 69-62-73-80 his career years.

Some f***ing realism in here.

82 games his rookie year
62 games his sophomore year
68 games his 3rd year
80 points in 70 games (90+ point pace over 70 games) his 4th year

Technically you're right.
Technically Anthony Mantha isn't a 50 point scorer.
But Henkka would be the first one to make an argument that Mantha is better than that in a giant post with tons of different stats and rates to make his argument (as usual)

I agree you shouldn't set wild expectations for him, but to say expectations are 65+ point prime player are pretty low for our best prospect in decades.

 

[BeersHockey]

Zadina has done nothing (so far) to indicate being a potential top 6 winger. Just too weak with the puck and horrible with turnovers. I hope this changes obviously but right now, I’m seeing 3rd line.

This is a Skip Bayless-level hot take. Zadina was excellent down the stretch playing with the hottest of garbage.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Why the f*** do prospect "comparables" always come from the same country?

What does the fact that "they were both born in Sweden" have to do with how they play hockey?

I will never understand this nonsense.

Because how they play hockey is very similar. Raymond is projected more as a playmaking winger than a goalscorer. Alfredsson was more of a playmaking winger than a goalscorer. How they skate the puck up ice, how they carry it in the offensive zone, how they drop when they shoot, and how they both play a 200 foot game. They are very similar in these regards.

I can't think of comparing Raymond to a similar winger from another country because when I think of 2-way right-shoooting playmaking wingers with gamebreaking ability the very first thought I have is Alfredsson.

 

[Henkka]

Because how they play hockey is very similar. Raymond is projected more as a playmaking winger than a goalscorer. Alfredsson was more of a playmaking winger than a goalscorer. How they skate the puck up ice, how they carry it in the offensive zone, how they drop when they shoot, and how they both play a 200 foot game. They are very similar in these regards.

I can't think of comparing Raymond to a similar winger from another country because when I think of 2-way right-shoooting playmaking wingers with gamebreaking ability the very first thought I have is Alfredsson.

Yeah, didn't really think it before, but that's the nearest feeling for me too currently.