Why isn't Pierre Turgeon in the HHOF
- Thread starter GoldenSeal
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seventieslord
Student Of The Game
GlitchMarner
Typical malevolent, devious & vile Maple Leafs fan
I think Turgeon was at least better than Joe Nieuwendyk to be honest.
MadLuke
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- Jan 18, 2011
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GlitchMarner
Typical malevolent, devious & vile Maple Leafs fan
His offense is definitely of a high calibre. He has impressive points per game finishes during a couple of dead puck era seasons in which he missed games due to injuries as well ('98 and '00). But as has been noted, his Hart voting record isn't great. He was also never more than a Sixth Team All-Star for whatever reason. He wasn't anything special defensively, but that shouldn't be enough to keep him out in and of itsself.
Whether it's right or wrong, he seems to have a reputation for having been a talented player who wasn't as good as his numbers and didn't make the type of impact one might think he did just from looking at his stats.
Nonetheless, the way the Hall has been trending, i'll be surprised if he stays out forever.
Last edited:
Jim MacDonald
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I look at this and I'm shocked he isn't there already.....the majority of the "markers" seem to be checked. 500 goals, check, over 1000 games played, check. A point-per-game or better player, check. It looks like he was close to a point per game in the playoffs as well. A 20 year career too! Although it was a bit before I really got into hockey, it sure seems like he was part of some blockbuster trades for some reason.
sr edler
gold is not reality
- Mar 20, 2010
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HHOF lost all reasonable meaning to me a couple of years ago, and I don't get why some people are still so very obsessed with it, trying to advocate for this and that player being in or out. I caught a post some day ago (in the Is Clark Gillies underrated? thread here, I think) claiming Phil Esposito's said the HHOF doesn't mean as much to him now when everyone and his grandmother is in it, and I must say I understand that line of feeling/thinking. In the same thread there were posts discussing it as a detriment also to the lower tier type of HHOF players (Gillies, Duff, potentially Tikkanen) who will/would only get mud thrown at them when the topic is brought up. It has become a somewhat poisonous debate.
Inducting everyone into the HHOF is not good for anyone. It's just pointless. Pierre Turgeon will still sit on the bench in Piestany whether or not he's in the HHOF. He will still get mauled from behind by Dale Hunter. He will still have 1327 regular season points and 97 playoff points. Just nothing will change. The only thing that will happen/change is that he will have to hold a very awkward speech in front a bunch of people, just like everyone else.
Sergei Makarov is not a better player now when he's in than he was when he was out (though he obviously was a legitimate inductee going from a reasonable standard of excellence).
Jack Ruttan is still Jack Ruttan and Bernie Morris is still Bernie Morris whether or not the HHOF cards are turned on them in a parallel universe.
Inducting everyone into the HHOF is not good for anyone. It's just pointless. Pierre Turgeon will still sit on the bench in Piestany whether or not he's in the HHOF. He will still get mauled from behind by Dale Hunter. He will still have 1327 regular season points and 97 playoff points. Just nothing will change. The only thing that will happen/change is that he will have to hold a very awkward speech in front a bunch of people, just like everyone else.
Sergei Makarov is not a better player now when he's in than he was when he was out (though he obviously was a legitimate inductee going from a reasonable standard of excellence).
Jack Ruttan is still Jack Ruttan and Bernie Morris is still Bernie Morris whether or not the HHOF cards are turned on them in a parallel universe.
I don't understand all these hipsters whining about Hunter ruining his career.
Turgeon played his best hockey for the Blues, in the regular season and playoffs.
I don't think he's a HHOF player but they've let worse player then him in. Andreychuk was worse then Turgeon in the playoffs excluding living off Gilmour in Toronto and he got in for example since they were teammates during the years the sabres choked every year.
Turgeon played his best hockey for the Blues, in the regular season and playoffs.
I don't think he's a HHOF player but they've let worse player then him in. Andreychuk was worse then Turgeon in the playoffs excluding living off Gilmour in Toronto and he got in for example since they were teammates during the years the sabres choked every year.
Andreychuk is a better example for the point you're trying to make.
Nieuwendyk wasn't as talented as Turgeon but you'd be hard pressed to find a GM who would take Turgeon over Nieuwendyk.
Edit if you reply- I just read the post you were quoting. Nevermind the first part lol.
sr edler
gold is not reality
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As a 1C everyone would take Turgeon. As a 2C they would all prefer Nieuwendyk.
I doubt it.
One guy played like a man the other played like a mouse. This isn't Gretzky vs Trevor Linden where a soft player has a massive advantage over the working man. Nieuwendyk was marginally less talented then Turgeon but could play in any situation.
The fact Nieuwendyk won 3 cups as a 2c had more to do with his versatility and the fact 2 good teams wanted to pick him up(Dal and NJD). Turgeon was useless if he wasn't scoring.
sr edler
gold is not reality
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Put Nieuwendyk as your 1C and nothing creatively happens in the offensive zone. It's not a coincidence Calgary went nowhere with him as their 1C. Couldn't fight themselves out of the 1st round of the playoffs over an extended period of years (with a strong lineup). A 1C needs to be able to make some plays. Find some guys. Dish out some nice cookies. Deflecting pucks in front of the crease is a nice skill. You need those guys on your team. But it's not a necessary skill for your 1C. Tomas Holmström can do that stuff, in an ideal situation.
You honestly type like a guy who never watched either of these guys play and has spent too much time on hfboards or playing whatever NHL game is out. 1C this 2C that. One guy has 3 cups the other is a punchline.
There are winners and there are losers. Turgeon's teams barely made it out of the first round when he was a 1C so there goes your entire argument. The biggest upset in his entire career he wasn't even apart of (injured by hunter) and Ferraro(who was actually a crappy 2C) decided to have the series of his life and outperform Mario Lemieux.
sr edler
gold is not reality
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Ah, so you're a Cup counter? I'm not even a Turgeon fan, I'm just calling a spade a spade. Turgeon advanced out of the 1st round as a 1C a couple of times. He beat Dale Hunter, for instance.
I don't play games, by the way. I did as a kid in the early 90s though. NHLPA Hockey to SNES. Was pretty good at it too, T. Linden flying down the wing blasting right handed slappers.
BarBeauWahlDobLok
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I am a forty year Islander fan and Pierre Turgeon is one of my favorites of all time. He is definitely my favorite who has no connection to the Islander dynasty years (Pat LaFontaine came onto the team in 1984 just in time for the Dynasty to end, but played with all the players who won the Cups).
I would have plenty of reasons for Pierre Turgeon to not be in the Hall Of Fame, but an argument can be made that he must be there because some of the marginal players who have gotten in. I don't know why Martin St. Louis, Dave Andreychuk, and even Clark Gillies are in. They were good players, but not legends. Pierre Turgeon was better than all of them.
I've never met him, but you can just tell he's a good man. For me, he was a strange example of flamboyant, subtle skill. That doesn't make sense. It is a paradox. He wasn't flashy, but he did these things that were so skillful, but so controlled. He was smooth, deceptively fast, a great passer, a great wrist shot, a great, albeit underused, slap shot, and he made players around him better.
His playoff experience was limited, but that's a result of the teams he played on. He was young on the Sabres, and they never won a round with him. He played two seasons of playoff hockey with the Islanders. In the first year, Dale Hunter got mad at him because he scored after he gave him a beautiful pass. I would like to put Dale Hunter and Tom Wilson on the same rocket to Betelgeuse. Then the Islanders got slaughtered by the Rangers in 1994. The Canadiens team he played on in 1995 didn't make the playoffs. The Blues have always struggled in the playoffs. The Stars were one or two and out by the time he got there. Ditto for the Avalanche. He just never latched onto that great team the way other players who are in the Hall Of Fame did.
Martin St. Louis and Dave Andreychuk being in there over Jeremy Roenick makes me cringe. The committee is misguided. Frankly, I don't know why Brendan Shannahan is in the HOF. He wasn't he cornerstone of any great team. He was an also ran on the Hull and Oates line. It was Hull and Oates, not "Hull, Oates, and Shannahan" - He won a Cup on a Red Wings team that would have won Cups whether they had Brendan Shannahan, Steve Thomas, Wendell Clark, or Kirk Muller.
The HOF has become a joke. Fewer people should be in it, but it will be watered down forever.
I would have plenty of reasons for Pierre Turgeon to not be in the Hall Of Fame, but an argument can be made that he must be there because some of the marginal players who have gotten in. I don't know why Martin St. Louis, Dave Andreychuk, and even Clark Gillies are in. They were good players, but not legends. Pierre Turgeon was better than all of them.
I've never met him, but you can just tell he's a good man. For me, he was a strange example of flamboyant, subtle skill. That doesn't make sense. It is a paradox. He wasn't flashy, but he did these things that were so skillful, but so controlled. He was smooth, deceptively fast, a great passer, a great wrist shot, a great, albeit underused, slap shot, and he made players around him better.
His playoff experience was limited, but that's a result of the teams he played on. He was young on the Sabres, and they never won a round with him. He played two seasons of playoff hockey with the Islanders. In the first year, Dale Hunter got mad at him because he scored after he gave him a beautiful pass. I would like to put Dale Hunter and Tom Wilson on the same rocket to Betelgeuse. Then the Islanders got slaughtered by the Rangers in 1994. The Canadiens team he played on in 1995 didn't make the playoffs. The Blues have always struggled in the playoffs. The Stars were one or two and out by the time he got there. Ditto for the Avalanche. He just never latched onto that great team the way other players who are in the Hall Of Fame did.
Martin St. Louis and Dave Andreychuk being in there over Jeremy Roenick makes me cringe. The committee is misguided. Frankly, I don't know why Brendan Shannahan is in the HOF. He wasn't he cornerstone of any great team. He was an also ran on the Hull and Oates line. It was Hull and Oates, not "Hull, Oates, and Shannahan" - He won a Cup on a Red Wings team that would have won Cups whether they had Brendan Shannahan, Steve Thomas, Wendell Clark, or Kirk Muller.
The HOF has become a joke. Fewer people should be in it, but it will be watered down forever.
Ah, so you're a Cup counter? I'm not even a Turgeon fan, I'm just calling a spade a spade. Turgeon advanced out of the 1st round as a 1C a couple of times. He beat Dale Hunter, for instance.
Turgeon made it out of the first round 4 times in his entire career. 3 of those happened alongside Demitra who could be considered equal to Turgeon on those blues teams in terms of who was 1C/2C.
Dale Hunter was somewhat valuable(if he wasn't in the box too much) and extremely entertaining but he was never a legit first line center at any point in his career minus a few offensively challenged years for the caps before the traded for Oates.
The goal of the NHL is to win cups and teams with Nieuwendyk clearly has a better shot of winning.
Another example, my all time favorite childhood player Dale HAWERCHUCK. A fellow first overall pick, 6 years older and within a year the Sabres realized he was exponentially better then Turgeon who sulked his way off the team after Hawerchuk took over his ice time.
One season?
Vanek is since he start the career 3rd.in PPG, only Ovechkin and Malkin score more often.
He lead the NHL in PPG 2009.
In all time LW he is with points a Top 30 guy and goals top 40.
ALL TIME.
100 years of NHL.
Vanek is quite more as that guy from season 06/07.
Sure, later from 1992/93 onward Francis was there and deserves credit for it, but to their Stanley Cup years it doesn't really apply yet. Stevens on the other hand soon after hit problems with physical and mental health and regressed quickly, even if he was still a PPG player leaving Pittsburgh (but never again since).
GoldenSeal
Believe In The Note
I like how some posters talk about a single player as if there was no team around them and they single handedly won the Stanley Cup, which is ridiculous. You look at the roster of the Cup teams most of the players mentioned here in comparion to Turgeon and you'll notice several of their teammates went on to be enshrined in the HHOF and/or are considered legends themselves.
I've never help being in an All-Star game as being some big deal. It's always seemed more like a popularity contest than anything else.
Turgeon not having any hardware beyond the Byng, in an era where most of the current record holders played in, is a dubious thing. I'd look more at how many times he was nominated for an award in that era because only a handful really won them. It's an era where you could have been absolutely elite and skated in the shadows, never to be noticed, especially if you're on the wrong teams.
It seems a large part of the issue many have with Turgeon is his seemingly lack of toughness. The truth is, he played in the wrong era. If he was playing today, I feel no one would notice it and few would really care.
As for Turgeon being in the HHOF, I'll give this reason: Players like Turgeon were the start of the changing of style of hockey that we are seeing today, from the brutal enforcers to the fast and skill-based game that has become the standard for any team wishing to go after and win the Cup.
Given other players in the HHOF, Turgeon's stats make it clear that he should be there as well. I get how people feel the HHOF should be the Best of the Best, but that's not how the HHOF is being run.; It's designed mainly for the History of the Sport itself and as much as Piestany is mentioned, the fact that he didn't get up to fight, was a part of that history.
I've never help being in an All-Star game as being some big deal. It's always seemed more like a popularity contest than anything else.
Turgeon not having any hardware beyond the Byng, in an era where most of the current record holders played in, is a dubious thing. I'd look more at how many times he was nominated for an award in that era because only a handful really won them. It's an era where you could have been absolutely elite and skated in the shadows, never to be noticed, especially if you're on the wrong teams.
It seems a large part of the issue many have with Turgeon is his seemingly lack of toughness. The truth is, he played in the wrong era. If he was playing today, I feel no one would notice it and few would really care.
As for Turgeon being in the HHOF, I'll give this reason: Players like Turgeon were the start of the changing of style of hockey that we are seeing today, from the brutal enforcers to the fast and skill-based game that has become the standard for any team wishing to go after and win the Cup.
Given other players in the HHOF, Turgeon's stats make it clear that he should be there as well. I get how people feel the HHOF should be the Best of the Best, but that's not how the HHOF is being run.; It's designed mainly for the History of the Sport itself and as much as Piestany is mentioned, the fact that he didn't get up to fight, was a part of that history.
sr edler
gold is not reality
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Turgeon made it out of the first round 4 times in his entire career. 3 of those happened alongside Demitra who could be considered equal to Turgeon on those blues teams in terms of who was 1C/2C.
Dale Hunter was somewhat valuable(if he wasn't in the box too much) and extremely entertaining but he was never a legit first line center at any point in his career minus a few offensively challenged years for the caps before the traded for Oates.
The goal of the NHL is to win cups and teams with Nieuwendyk clearly has a better shot of winning.
Another example, my all time favorite childhood player Dale HAWERCHUCK. A fellow first overall pick, 6 years older and within a year the Sabres realized he was exponentially better then Turgeon who sulked his way off the team after Hawerchuk took over his ice time.
I don't know why you're starting posting pics and talking about Hawerchuk. I agree Hawerchuk was better than Turgeon. Nieuwendyk had a good/great 99 playoff run, as a 2C behind Modano. Outpointed by Modano. Just like Brind'Amour had a good/great 06 playoff round, as a 2C behind Staal. Outpointed by Staal. Nothing to sneeze at, but there's a difference in the amount of scoring related load carrying.
By the way, it may be a bit too generous calling Nieuwendyk a 1C during the 1992–1995 Calgary Flames stretch, when Calgary constantly lost to lower seeded teams in the 1st round, since he was outscored by dragon slayer Robert Reichel 2/3 of the time.
ChiTownPhilly
Not Too Soft
So much weirdness- so little time...
As long as we're throwing out unsubstantiated stuff, I couldn't help noticing that Lindros didn't get inducted until after Ed Snider irreversibly achieved ambient air temperature. Coincidence?
Generally accurate, I suppose... but before we compare HHoF to BBHoF with full invidiousness- did you catch a load of what Cooperstown did earlier this month?!? That said, when the Baseball Hall of Fame drives their vehicle into the dungpile, you can usually figure out who decided to play ClownCar Wheelman (e.g.: LaRussa. Reinsdorf.) That's a contrast to Toronto, where Hockey Hall of Fame proceedings have all of the transparency of a closed-door session of the Stalin-era Politburo.
Hossa isn't a borderline Hall of Famer; he's a mainstream Hall of Famer. There will be NO suspense as to his induction.
Nick Hansen
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- Sep 28, 2017
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Because Turgeon shouldn't be in the HHOF. Lots of points but nothing that stands out league-wide each season.
I posted these quotations in another thread on Turgeon but perhaps they bear repeating.
This was in response to questions about his leadership, whether he made teammates better, and other intangibles, so the quotations focus on those elements rather than his scoring. Here they are again, in chronological order.
Associated Press, April 12, 1988:
Sabres' coach Ted Sator said: "The kid's gone from 18 to 28 in the span of four playoff games. Pierre’s always been a big-game player and I think this is his element now."
In the first game of the series, Turgeon had a hand in all three goals. In Sunday's fourth game, he scored Buffalo's first goal and assisted on Tucker's winning goal 5:32 into overtime.
Montreal Gazette, October 6, 1988:
"He's going to be a star in this league," Sator said yesterday. "He worked very hard - both on and off the ice during the off-season. He has one more year of maturation and his command of English is much better now.
"He's got a year under his belt and he's grown into a leadership role. I think he's going to have a banner year this season."
"He's just a tremendous athlete and a tremendous competitor," Sator said.
Edmonton Journal, Feb 22, 1990:
"He's a very talented hockey player," said linemate Dave Andreychuk, who had helpers on both of Turgeon's goals. "He does things with the puck we just shake our heads at."
"People can see he's got great offensive skills. I know that from playing against him," said blueliner Doug Bodger, a former Pittsburgh Penguin.
"We call him Sneaky Pierre the way he goes out there and hides, but he leads out on the ice in other ways.
"He's playing with confidence. He leads out on the ice. …He's playing like a leader."
"He's putting in the work and getting back into the defensive end of the game," Andreychuk said.
"You can really see that from the first year. He knows he has to work hard and he's doing it night after night."
Montreal Gazette (Michael Farber), April 7, 1990:
“Turgeon is one of those players who makes everyone around him better.”
Toronto Star April 19, 1990:
(after Turgeon had 2 goals and an assist in win over Habs to tie series at 2):
"We had to get our big guns gunning but that's how it is on any winning team, your shooters must do the shooting," Dudley said. "But Pierre doesn't have to prove anything to me or anyone else. I know how good he is and how he's showed up in the big games all season."
Vancouver Sun, March 20, 1993
"He's not an outspoken guy. But in his own way, he's become a leader," coach Al Arbour, who has had some great ones, said Friday. "He's a silent leader.
"He has progressed and he's going to keep progressing. Everything we've asked him to do, he's done."
"He's a real team guy," Islander captain Patrick Flatley said. "He's still young, but he's starting to assume aleadership role. Even last year to this year he's taken on more of a leadership role, and I think that progression will continue."
"He's had an MVP season," Flatley said. "He has produced in big games, important games. He has come up big for us all season. He takes losing very hard."
Associated Press (May 6, 1993):
“One reason they didn’t [win] was the fact that their missing superstar, Pierre Turgeon, just might be more vital to the Islanders’ success in the short run than Lemieux is to the Penguins in the long run.”
Montreal Gazette (May 6, 1993):
“Pierre carried this team all year," said goaltender Glenn Healy, who stopped 22 shots Tuesday. "He's the big piece of the puzzle, no doubt. When Pierre scores, we usually win."
Don Maloney (September 16, 1993):
“Pierre is our Mario Lemieux, our Eric Lindros, our superstar," general manager Don Maloney said. "His on-ice accomplishments speak for themselves."
Jack Todd (Montreal Gazette, April 22, 1995):
“The implication, that he had no heart, is simply not borne out by the numbers. Turgeon’s playoff stats have been good throughout his career, including the '92-93 season when he had six goals and seven assists in 11 games despite being bushwhacked by Dale Hunter.”
Montreal Gazette (April 19, 1996):
"With the team dying around him, Turgeon all but loaded the Canadiens on his back and dragged them into the playoffs in `95."
Canadian Press, May 2, 1996 (quoting Tremblay):
“Pierre Turgeon is a great captain. Twice he took the whole team out for dinner on the road. When someone was having trouble, he would go talk to the player. I call that good leadership.”
Mike Keenan (Nov 3, 1996):
"A superstar centre doesn't come available that often. But he is a player you can build a franchise around."
"In my opinion, with all due respect to Bernie Federko and perhaps Red Berenson, I don't think there's ever been a better centreman in this organization, including Adam Oates.”
"Red Berenson and Bernie Federko had the numbers but not the speed. They were a different generation."
"He has to be considered at least among the best. He's 27, in the prime of his career. He's never had a winger to work with like Brett Hull. He's played with teams that never made the playoffs.”
“He's not the best centreman in the league - (Mario) Lemieux is the best, there's still Gretzky and Messier - but he's in the top group.''
Brett Hull (Nov. 6, 1996):
"He is your typical superstar centreman. He can handle the puck, he can shoot it, he can make the play late to guys. He does everything you want.”
Edmonton Journal, Nov 16, 1999
"It was a great effort," Quenneville said. "He beat the guy to the icing and pretty much got the job done on a second and third effort. It's nice to see him produce again, and he continues to provide a lot of determination."
"He's been great all year, and he's fun to watch out there," McAlpine said. "He's working hard, and he's so skilled. He's been big for us."
Globe and Mail, Nov. 18, 1999:
Simply put, there's an edge to Turgeon’s game now, one that emerged during the Stanley Cup playoffs last spring.
"Yeah, I think his play, particularly in that Phoenix series, showed a lot more leadership," said Quenneville
National Post, Jan 15, 2000:
On the eve of last year's NHL playoffs Turgeon asked for an audience with Blues coach Joel Quenneville. He told Quenneville that he wanted more responsibility, to be the guy on the ice in the last minute of the period or last minute of the game, to be the go-to guy.
"It showed that he felt that he had more to offer. And he delivered," Quenville said.
Midway through the Blues' first-round playoff series against the tough Phoenix Coyotes, Turgeon began to reinvent himself in front of his teammates' eyes.
He played tough along the boards. He took the big hits and, after being down 3-1 in the series, the Blues won the series in a heart- stopping seventh game in which Turgeon scored in overtime.
Turgeon continued his fine play in the next round against Dallas. He took a brutal slash from Pat Verbeek and kept the Blues alive in the series with critical playmaking. He added five more points (he had 13 in total), including an overtime winner in Game 4. If not for mediocre goaltending from Grant Fuhr, the Blues may well have upended the eventual Stanley Cup champions.
"He was determined to make the team win," Quenneville said. "That's a sign of the elite players."
You could always count on the points, said Quenneville, "but he raised his game to a higher level."
That brand of play did not disappear with the playoffs. Turgeon scored a handful of goals in one of the first training-camp scrimmages and has not backed off since. He has consistently been in the top three or four scorers this season and will return to the NHL All-Star Game on Feb. 6 in Toronto, his fifth all-star appearance.
His 23 goals and 55 points leads the Blues and marks the 12th consecutive season with at least 20 goals. More significantly, the 30-year-old continues to play the important minutes of St. Louis games. Where he was sometimes hidden from other team's top lines earlier in his career, he is now matched against them. He is a central figure on the power play, of course, but he also kills penalties. He has answered his detractors while becoming a complete player.
This was in response to questions about his leadership, whether he made teammates better, and other intangibles, so the quotations focus on those elements rather than his scoring. Here they are again, in chronological order.
Associated Press, April 12, 1988:
Sabres' coach Ted Sator said: "The kid's gone from 18 to 28 in the span of four playoff games. Pierre’s always been a big-game player and I think this is his element now."
In the first game of the series, Turgeon had a hand in all three goals. In Sunday's fourth game, he scored Buffalo's first goal and assisted on Tucker's winning goal 5:32 into overtime.
Montreal Gazette, October 6, 1988:
"He's going to be a star in this league," Sator said yesterday. "He worked very hard - both on and off the ice during the off-season. He has one more year of maturation and his command of English is much better now.
"He's got a year under his belt and he's grown into a leadership role. I think he's going to have a banner year this season."
"He's just a tremendous athlete and a tremendous competitor," Sator said.
Edmonton Journal, Feb 22, 1990:
"He's a very talented hockey player," said linemate Dave Andreychuk, who had helpers on both of Turgeon's goals. "He does things with the puck we just shake our heads at."
"People can see he's got great offensive skills. I know that from playing against him," said blueliner Doug Bodger, a former Pittsburgh Penguin.
"We call him Sneaky Pierre the way he goes out there and hides, but he leads out on the ice in other ways.
"He's playing with confidence. He leads out on the ice. …He's playing like a leader."
"He's putting in the work and getting back into the defensive end of the game," Andreychuk said.
"You can really see that from the first year. He knows he has to work hard and he's doing it night after night."
Montreal Gazette (Michael Farber), April 7, 1990:
“Turgeon is one of those players who makes everyone around him better.”
Toronto Star April 19, 1990:
(after Turgeon had 2 goals and an assist in win over Habs to tie series at 2):
"We had to get our big guns gunning but that's how it is on any winning team, your shooters must do the shooting," Dudley said. "But Pierre doesn't have to prove anything to me or anyone else. I know how good he is and how he's showed up in the big games all season."
Vancouver Sun, March 20, 1993
"He's not an outspoken guy. But in his own way, he's become a leader," coach Al Arbour, who has had some great ones, said Friday. "He's a silent leader.
"He has progressed and he's going to keep progressing. Everything we've asked him to do, he's done."
"He's a real team guy," Islander captain Patrick Flatley said. "He's still young, but he's starting to assume aleadership role. Even last year to this year he's taken on more of a leadership role, and I think that progression will continue."
"He's had an MVP season," Flatley said. "He has produced in big games, important games. He has come up big for us all season. He takes losing very hard."
Associated Press (May 6, 1993):
“One reason they didn’t [win] was the fact that their missing superstar, Pierre Turgeon, just might be more vital to the Islanders’ success in the short run than Lemieux is to the Penguins in the long run.”
Montreal Gazette (May 6, 1993):
“Pierre carried this team all year," said goaltender Glenn Healy, who stopped 22 shots Tuesday. "He's the big piece of the puzzle, no doubt. When Pierre scores, we usually win."
Don Maloney (September 16, 1993):
“Pierre is our Mario Lemieux, our Eric Lindros, our superstar," general manager Don Maloney said. "His on-ice accomplishments speak for themselves."
Jack Todd (Montreal Gazette, April 22, 1995):
“The implication, that he had no heart, is simply not borne out by the numbers. Turgeon’s playoff stats have been good throughout his career, including the '92-93 season when he had six goals and seven assists in 11 games despite being bushwhacked by Dale Hunter.”
Montreal Gazette (April 19, 1996):
"With the team dying around him, Turgeon all but loaded the Canadiens on his back and dragged them into the playoffs in `95."
Canadian Press, May 2, 1996 (quoting Tremblay):
“Pierre Turgeon is a great captain. Twice he took the whole team out for dinner on the road. When someone was having trouble, he would go talk to the player. I call that good leadership.”
Mike Keenan (Nov 3, 1996):
"A superstar centre doesn't come available that often. But he is a player you can build a franchise around."
"In my opinion, with all due respect to Bernie Federko and perhaps Red Berenson, I don't think there's ever been a better centreman in this organization, including Adam Oates.”
"Red Berenson and Bernie Federko had the numbers but not the speed. They were a different generation."
"He has to be considered at least among the best. He's 27, in the prime of his career. He's never had a winger to work with like Brett Hull. He's played with teams that never made the playoffs.”
“He's not the best centreman in the league - (Mario) Lemieux is the best, there's still Gretzky and Messier - but he's in the top group.''
Brett Hull (Nov. 6, 1996):
"He is your typical superstar centreman. He can handle the puck, he can shoot it, he can make the play late to guys. He does everything you want.”
Edmonton Journal, Nov 16, 1999
"It was a great effort," Quenneville said. "He beat the guy to the icing and pretty much got the job done on a second and third effort. It's nice to see him produce again, and he continues to provide a lot of determination."
"He's been great all year, and he's fun to watch out there," McAlpine said. "He's working hard, and he's so skilled. He's been big for us."
Globe and Mail, Nov. 18, 1999:
Simply put, there's an edge to Turgeon’s game now, one that emerged during the Stanley Cup playoffs last spring.
"Yeah, I think his play, particularly in that Phoenix series, showed a lot more leadership," said Quenneville
National Post, Jan 15, 2000:
On the eve of last year's NHL playoffs Turgeon asked for an audience with Blues coach Joel Quenneville. He told Quenneville that he wanted more responsibility, to be the guy on the ice in the last minute of the period or last minute of the game, to be the go-to guy.
"It showed that he felt that he had more to offer. And he delivered," Quenville said.
Midway through the Blues' first-round playoff series against the tough Phoenix Coyotes, Turgeon began to reinvent himself in front of his teammates' eyes.
He played tough along the boards. He took the big hits and, after being down 3-1 in the series, the Blues won the series in a heart- stopping seventh game in which Turgeon scored in overtime.
Turgeon continued his fine play in the next round against Dallas. He took a brutal slash from Pat Verbeek and kept the Blues alive in the series with critical playmaking. He added five more points (he had 13 in total), including an overtime winner in Game 4. If not for mediocre goaltending from Grant Fuhr, the Blues may well have upended the eventual Stanley Cup champions.
"He was determined to make the team win," Quenneville said. "That's a sign of the elite players."
You could always count on the points, said Quenneville, "but he raised his game to a higher level."
That brand of play did not disappear with the playoffs. Turgeon scored a handful of goals in one of the first training-camp scrimmages and has not backed off since. He has consistently been in the top three or four scorers this season and will return to the NHL All-Star Game on Feb. 6 in Toronto, his fifth all-star appearance.
His 23 goals and 55 points leads the Blues and marks the 12th consecutive season with at least 20 goals. More significantly, the 30-year-old continues to play the important minutes of St. Louis games. Where he was sometimes hidden from other team's top lines earlier in his career, he is now matched against them. He is a central figure on the power play, of course, but he also kills penalties. He has answered his detractors while becoming a complete player.
Big Phil
Registered User
- Nov 2, 2003
- 31,703
- 4,146
He is one of those guys that as time goes by his reputation seems to prosper. Almost like the Phil Housley of forwards.
Look, let's not try to forget how he was perceived during his career. A good center? Sure. Talented? Yes. Reliable when the chips were down? No. Soft? Yes. Ability to raise his game? No.
Honestly, those are the qualities of him and he left a lot to be desired. I don't know if there is any player in NHL history with so many empty points in his career. He scored a lot of goals and set up a lot of them but how many of them do you remember?
His best individual season ever and he was still 5th for the Hart, 6th in scoring and 6th best among centers in all-star voting. Yes it was a heavy year in 1993, but when else did he stand out, or come close to it? I know he played in an era with a logjam at center, but twice being 6th in all-star selections at center doesn't cut it and it ties into what he was in his career. A good center, but not one you'd win with and not one you considered among the cream of the crop.
Look, let's not try to forget how he was perceived during his career. A good center? Sure. Talented? Yes. Reliable when the chips were down? No. Soft? Yes. Ability to raise his game? No.
Honestly, those are the qualities of him and he left a lot to be desired. I don't know if there is any player in NHL history with so many empty points in his career. He scored a lot of goals and set up a lot of them but how many of them do you remember?
His best individual season ever and he was still 5th for the Hart, 6th in scoring and 6th best among centers in all-star voting. Yes it was a heavy year in 1993, but when else did he stand out, or come close to it? I know he played in an era with a logjam at center, but twice being 6th in all-star selections at center doesn't cut it and it ties into what he was in his career. A good center, but not one you'd win with and not one you considered among the cream of the crop.
Cursed Lemon
Registered Bruiser
I don't see why people think Turgeon should get in when the same people probably think Roenick doesn't deserve to.
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