Why are there currently no Belarusian, Kazakh, or Ukrainian NHL players, and only one Latvian?

[Kamus]

That is what YOU say.

I say the Belarussians and Ukarainians(by passport) are just fleeing sinking ships in different states of sunk. In Belarus there is a still hockey. The state of affairs in the Ukraine is just scorched earth. You can't blame the players.

Kazachstan though again is a special case. Any kazakh names on your list? Too few ethnic Kazakhs playing hockey still.

Why are ypu spewing political propaganda? This is about the third post you bring up nationalities and question thier legitimacy in your eyes. If you want to discuss identity and nationhood politics use another forum. I know for you it wouldbe difficult as you obviosly have an agenda

 

[Atas2000]

Why are ypu spewing political propaganda? This is about the third post you bring up nationalities and question thier legitimacy in your eyes. If you want to discuss identity and nationhood politics use another forum. I know for you it wouldbe difficult as you obviosly have an agenda

LOL only a brain completely fogged with political propaganda could possibly find any politics in my post.

OMG I bring up nationalities up in a thread with a thread title naming three nationalities. How dare I!

And if you haven't noticed this is a hockey board. I was writing about the state of hockey in different countries. No more, no less. If you try so hard to find anything else in my posts you will proably succeed, but it's YOUR wishful thinking then.

Try not looking for a black cat in a dark room. Especially if the room is empty.

 

[su24]

Didn't know someone would care about Belarusian hockey.
20 years ago Belarus had like 3 ice rinks in the whole country, now they've built them everywhere and kids are coming from all over the country. That 2002 Olympic team grew up not just in one city, but at the only one ice rink. They didn't have any more. But now the new "kids of the ice rinks" who were inspired by that 2002 win are coming.
Right now Belarus has 13 players in the CHL, they have more WHL players than any other European country (10).
They also changed the developing system. Now the best U20 kids at home are playing against men in Extraleague-1, their U18 team is playing in Extraleague-2 also against men and U17 team is playing in Extraleague-3 against older guys.
Belarus is gonna be top-14 in the world again in 3-4 years even though the greedy neighbors from Russia keep stealing their talent. Daniil Misyul, Oleg Karnaukhov and Kirill Ustimenko are all from Belarus, but already played for Russia at the WJC.

Glachenyuk is half Belarusian...

Galchenyuk is 100% Belarusian. All his grandparents live in Belarus and he spends there every summer.
Also Gretzky is a very common last name for Belarus, there's even a hockey player from Grodno (this is the city where Wayne's grandpa came from):
Vyacheslav Gretsky at eliteprospects.com

 

[Kamus]

LOL only a brain completely fogged with political propaganda could possibly find any politics in my post.

OMG I bring up nationalities up in a thread with a thread title naming three nationalities. How dare I!

And if you haven't noticed this is a hockey board. I was writing about the state of hockey in different countries. No more, no less. If you try so hard to find anything else in my posts you will proably succeed, but it's YOUR wishful thinking then.

Try not looking for a black cat in a dark room. Especially if the room is empty.

Speak about nationalities and hockey all you want. Hence why i didnt call anybody else out. ......
I find it comical that your comment about gretzky speaking at a ukrainian forum was either deleted by you (cowardly) or the mods (proves my point about political trolling) questioning him that he was associating himself with "nationalists revolutionaries, putting it kindly" abd then writing about how "belorussians and ukrainians "by passport" are leaving.....i wonder why you added the "by passport" to ukrainians but not belorussians.....hbelorussians.....hmmm...
You might think you are clever....but you are not.... I dont care what others think about our discussion i just wanted to let you know i see through your posts.
And by the deletion of your post...you also see it or the mods agree with me

 

[Zamuz]

How the **** is that weird? he's born and raised in Finland.

Are you also saying Galchenyuk considering himself American is weird because his parents are from Belarus?

Sorry some of us have immigrant parents but adapted to the country we were born and raised in?

Is Zherdev not born and raised in Ukraine? or just born there?

In my logic a country where player grows is their home.

 

[teravaineSAROS]

Is Zherdev not born and raised in Ukraine? or just born there?

In my logic a country where player grows is their home.

Oh I misread your comment as it being weird that Barkov considered himself Finnish, my bad.

 

[CauZuki]

Didn't know someone would care about Belarusian hockey.
20 years ago Belarus had like 3 ice rinks in the whole country, now they've built them everywhere and kids are coming from all over the country. That 2002 Olympic team grew up not just in one city, but at the only one ice rink. They didn't have any more. But now the new "kids of the ice rinks" who were inspired by that 2002 win are coming.
Right now Belarus has 13 players in the CHL, they have more WHL players than any other European country (10).
They also changed the developing system. Now the best U20 kids at home are playing against men in Extraleague-1, their U18 team is playing in Extraleague-2 also against men and U17 team is playing in Extraleague-3 against older guys.
Belarus is gonna be top-14 in the world again in 3-4 years even though the greedy neighbors from Russia keep stealing their talent. Daniil Misyul, Oleg Karnaukhov and Kirill Ustimenko are all from Belarus, but already played for Russia at the WJC.


Galchenyuk is 100% Belarusian. All his grandparents live in Belarus and he spends there every summer.
Also Gretzky is a very common last name for Belarus, there's even a hockey player from Grodno (this is the city where Wayne's grandpa came from):
Vyacheslav Gretsky at eliteprospects.com

See what I mentioned above , the Belarusian system didn't produce him , he was a product of the US and Canadian programs. He even plays for team USA for all international tourneys. I don't doubt he has Belarusian roots , it's just to the point of OP Belarusian system hasn't produced any recent NHL players.

 

[su24]

How the **** is that weird? he's born and raised in Finland.
Are you also saying Galchenyuk considering himself American is weird because his parents are from Belarus?
Sorry some of us have immigrant parents but adapted to the country we were born and raised in?

See what I mentioned above , the Belarusian system didn't produce him , he was a product of the US and Canadian programs. He even plays for team USA for all international tourneys.

Barkov and Gally are different situations. Barkov was born and raised in Finland. Galchenyuk was born in the USA, but he left the country when he was 3 and came back for only one year when he was already 15. A year later he moved to Sarnia, which is Canada. He wasn't raised in the USA. Actually he grew up in Belarus more than in any other country, following his father who was playing and coaching in his home country for many years. So yes, that's weird he considers himself American since he didn't grow up there at all, he was just born there!
You can call Galchenyuk a product of many countries (he played for Moscow school in Russia, he played in Swetzerland, his 1st professional team actually was Belarusian Superleague club where his father was a head coach), but he can't be called a "product of the US and Canadian programs". He came to North America as one of the most talented prospects in hockey when he was 15!
I'm pretty sure he just chose US citizenship not because he feels somehow connected to the country, but because that makes his life easier.

 

[Avelanche]

probably harder for the good kids to play quality competition with such small population sizes.

 

[Zamuz]

Oh I misread your comment as it being weird that Barkov considered himself Finnish, my bad.

yeah lol. I know Barkov is full finnish and I think he is

thought that since Zherdev is born in Ukraine why isn't he feeling similarly

 

[Atas2000]

Speak about nationalities and hockey all you want. Hence why i didnt call anybody else out. ......
I find it comical that your comment about gretzky speaking at a ukrainian forum was either deleted by you (cowardly) or the mods (proves my point about political trolling) questioning him that he was associating himself with "nationalists revolutionaries, putting it kindly" abd then writing about how "belorussians and ukrainians "by passport" are leaving.....i wonder why you added the "by passport" to ukrainians but not belorussians.....hbelorussians.....hmmm...
You might think you are clever....but you are not.... I dont care what others think about our discussion i just wanted to let you know i see through your posts.
And by the deletion of your post...you also see it or the mods agree with me

How old are you? Your talk is quite immature.

This is a NA board. It has a somewhat political agenda by definition. Every society has an agenda. Of course they can't have posts that speak a different mind. I am okay with it. Myths about free speech are for kids and grown up kids.

My general opinion that athletes active or retired should stay away from politics remains firm though. For many reasons, one of which is they lack qualification. It's like hearing a politician talk about particle physics. Waste of time.

The by passport part is specifically directed to North Americans who live in countries of immigrants. There is a different culture regarding nationalities. It is more or less defined by the passport in a person's pocket. They have a hard time understanding what a Russian with a belarussian passport or a Ukrainian with a russian one is.

Notes for you:

If you are so obsessed with defending some windmills of political correctness here I have bad news for you. Belarussians(especially the BH nationalist ones) would be exteremely pi....ed by you calling them "Belorussians". I specifically use the spelling Belarussians prefer themselves out of OMG political correctness. But you might think you are clever.

The Gretzky case if we call it that is a good example of the double-think some people happily apply. As mentioned specifically in the US and Canada there is a very logical culture of defining nationality by the legal affiliation as most citizens of those countries are descendants of immigrants from all over the world or even first generation immigrants. By that logic Gretzkys are Canadians(I think noone would argue that Gretzky is not a canadian hockey player). Their ethnic heritage is more complicated though than what would be comfortable for many people. Just like many people out of Russia(OMG they emigrated out of the Russian Empire and were it's citizens once) they have different ethnic roots, probably both belarussian and ukrainian. That makes for an ever hilarious fight over The Great Ones coattails by SOME people who want him associated with specifically one nationality. It is not only ordinary hockey fans. I remember one certain belarussian politician being very insistent about Gretzkys belarussian heritage. Again, those are just hilarious fights over a non-issue. As I wrote he is of mixed heritage, just as so many others who are from here, including myself, but you would not understand. What matters to you are some useless political faceoffs it seems.

 

[Atas2000]

yeah lol. I know Barkov is full finnish and I think he is

thought that since Zherdev is born in Ukraine why isn't he feeling similarly

Because Zherdev is russian. Being born somewhere doesn't make you anything yet. Just as pointed out in my previous post people in NA have a hard time understanding what it is at times. A Ukrainian can be born in Russia and have a russian citizenship. A Rusdian can be born in the Ukraine and have a ukrainian passport.

Barkov is a different case. He can feel like whatever he wants to feel like. He is still a strange one.

 

[Atas2000]

I'm pretty sure he just chose US citizenship not because he feels somehow connected to the country, but because that makes his life easier.

I agree on that one, but their cases are very similar still. Both kids to hockey parents. There are quite a few by now, just not all of them reach that level. But if you look at their CVs they are sometimes born and raised in all the different places. Just where dad used to play or coach at the time. Every one of them obviously chooses for which country to play in the end. I have my strong opinion on that too. And for me Barkov is a true Finn and I would not adress him in Russian. He has to practice what he preaches turning his back on his heritage. But that is not at all hockey related though. At that he is a great hockey player. At least one thing his dad could give him on the road while I didn't like his dad as coach.

 

[Rcknrollkillnmachine]

Didn't know someone would care about Belarusian hockey.
20 years ago Belarus had like 3 ice rinks in the whole country, now they've built them everywhere and kids are coming from all over the country. That 2002 Olympic team grew up not just in one city, but at the only one ice rink. They didn't have any more. But now the new "kids of the ice rinks" who were inspired by that 2002 win are coming.
Right now Belarus has 13 players in the CHL, they have more WHL players than any other European country (10).
They also changed the developing system. Now the best U20 kids at home are playing against men in Extraleague-1, their U18 team is playing in Extraleague-2 also against men and U17 team is playing in Extraleague-3 against older guys.
Belarus is gonna be top-14 in the world again in 3-4 years even though the greedy neighbors from Russia keep stealing their talent. Daniil Misyul, Oleg Karnaukhov and Kirill Ustimenko are all from Belarus, but already played for Russia at the WJC.


Galchenyuk is 100% Belarusian. All his grandparents live in Belarus and he spends there every summer.
Also Gretzky is a very common last name for Belarus, there's even a hockey player from Grodno (this is the city where Wayne's grandpa came from):
Vyacheslav Gretsky at eliteprospects.com

Good post and nice to read.

 

[BalticWarrior]

It's in the eastern part of Europe, according to maps.

Uh not its not? Check out U.N. classification. Latvia is in Northern Europe.

 

[kabidjan18]

Because they're part of the KHL satellite system. Each has one KHL team, then imports and older athletes. Young athletes are hard-pressed to get good opportunities to transition to senior hockey. It's the same argument for prospects who people say should be sent down to the AHL to develop or loaned back to Europe. Why? Because it's better for the development of q young player to play strong minutes in Europe or the AHL than to perpetually be in some 3rd or 4th line role in the NHL. Now imagine if an NHL team had no D-league, no Euro loan option. The only option was to perpetually play in juniors, even when you're far too old to gain anything from that, or play bottom 6 roles with the big team.

 

[GeeoffBrown]

Those countries are small and poor. The expected number of NHL players must be extremely low.

 

[Elvs]

This shows how many registered players and rinks each country has, which is far more important numbers than a country's population. For instance, you will find that Romania only has 10 rinks and Ukraine 27. Meanwhile Canada has 8 300.

Ice hockey by country - Wikipedia

 

[Sugi21]

Belarus don’t need hockey when they have “Rusev Day”!!!!

 

[end]

That's Bulgaria.

I notice a lot of Eastern European ex-Soviet states have really fallen off in terms of NHLers. The Slovaks were competitive and the Czechs were legit and they have fallen way off. We're getting more NHLers from smaller Euro states but definitely not as many Czechs as back in the 90s and oughts.

 

[Ingvar]

Uh not its not? Check out U.N. classification. Latvia is in Northern Europe.

U.N. classification changed in 2017 and it is hilarious. There is nothing in common between British Isles, Scandinavia (and Finland) and Baltic states.

Unlike their neighbour Estonia (and their claims are dubious at best), Latvia has nothing in common with Nothern Europe. Latvians belong to the territory between Germany and Russia historically, economically, culturally and ethnically. The closest they ever were to Nothern Europe was during 200 years they were a part of Swedish Empire - but unlike in Finland Swedish influence didn’t last.

 

[BalticWarrior]

U.N. classification changed in 2017 and it is hilarious. There is nothing in common between British Isles, Scandinavia (and Finland) and Baltic states.

Unlike their neighbour Estonia (and their claims are dubious at best), Latvia has nothing in common with Nothern Europe. Latvians belong to the territory between Germany and Russia historically, economically, culturally and ethnically. The closest they ever were to Nothern Europe was during 200 years they were a part of Swedish Empire - but unlike in Finland Swedish influence didn’t last.

Lets see. Shared history especially shared ancient history? Check. Shared mentality and introvertness? Check. Shared architecture? Check. How about the fact we are part of Nordic-Baltic 8? Not to mention Northern Europe is a geogrpahic designation as far as im f***ing aware, why the hell would you ever bring up culture, economy OR ethnicity is beyond me. Please dont speak on matters you have no buisness discussing.

 

[Kamus]

How old are you? Your talk is quite immature.

This is a NA board. It has a somewhat political agenda by definition. Every society has an agenda. Of course they can't have posts that speak a different mind. I am okay with it. Myths about free speech are for kids and grown up kids.

My general opinion that athletes active or retired should stay away from politics remains firm though. For many reasons, one of which is they lack qualification. It's like hearing a politician talk about particle physics. Waste of time.

The by passport part is specifically directed to North Americans who live in countries of immigrants. There is a different culture regarding nationalities. It is more or less defined by the passport in a person's pocket. They have a hard time understanding what a Russian with a belarussian passport or a Ukrainian with a russian one is.

Notes for you:

If you are so obsessed with defending some windmills of political correctness here I have bad news for you. Belarussians(especially the BH nationalist ones) would be exteremely pi....ed by you calling them "Belorussians". I specifically use the spelling Belarussians prefer themselves out of OMG political correctness. But you might think you are clever.

The Gretzky case if we call it that is a good example of the double-think some people happily apply. As mentioned specifically in the US and Canada there is a very logical culture of defining nationality by the legal affiliation as most citizens of those countries are descendants of immigrants from all over the world or even first generation immigrants. By that logic Gretzkys are Canadians(I think noone would argue that Gretzky is not a canadian hockey player). Their ethnic heritage is more complicated though than what would be comfortable for many people. Just like many people out of Russia(OMG they emigrated out of the Russian Empire and were it's citizens once) they have different ethnic roots, probably both belarussian and ukrainian. That makes for an ever hilarious fight over The Great Ones coattails by SOME people who want him associated with specifically one nationality. It is not only ordinary hockey fans. I remember one certain belarussian politician being very insistent about Gretzkys belarussian heritage. Again, those are just hilarious fights over a non-issue. As I wrote he is of mixed heritage, just as so many others who are from here, including myself, but you would not understand. What matters to you are some useless political faceoffs it seems.

Again... You completely disregard the post thay now has been deleted. I do understand the complexities of national identity specifically in places like eastern europe, because i am from that area. My point is that you crossed a line by that comment in a hockey forumn, as proven by it being deleted. If you want to reply, reply to that statement that you made. Dont now pretend that you only want athletes to stay away from politics because that is not how you stated it. If you did i would have no problem as i tend to agree. Secondly, i dont care which athlete considers himself which nationality, hence why i am not weighing on the discussion about who is what.

Again, respond to your statement as written. It is obvious by your words, nobody elses, you have a political agenda. If not, then there is no use for me to continue as i stated before you have an agenda and refuse to acknowledge it.

 

[Cotton]

The majority of the world doesn't give a **** about hockey. Imagine the WORLD CUP OF HOCKEY only had 6 countries. It's actually laughable.

And that is okay, the people overly concerned about its place and popularity in the world tend to only care about how much money can be made off of it. Its much like lacrosse, not only in origin, but in that its audience will always be limited and its growth can only go so far, so in an attempt to exceed these limitations the powers that be have changed and deformed the game into something different... something trying to be more family friendly, and gimmicky.

In unison with the above the costs of equipment, training, and participation have grown to such proportions that it's become a rich mans game, which will only price-out a ton of kids from ever getting a shot, quite possibly preventing there from ever being another Wayne Gretzky or Mario Lemieux.

Kenya has a hockey team

Which is fantastic, imo that is real growth. Vegas wasn't growing the game, Kenya is growing the game.

 

[Cotton]

Because Zherdev is russian. Being born somewhere doesn't make you anything yet. Just as pointed out in my previous post people in NA have a hard time understanding what it is at times. A Ukrainian can be born in Russia and have a russian citizenship. A Rusdian can be born in the Ukraine and have a ukrainian passport.

Barkov is a different case. He can feel like whatever he wants to feel like. He is still a strange one.

This topic interests me, and I'd like to understand your point of view on it.

You've said the US and Canada are mostly countries of immigrants, which is obviously true, but wouldnt this also be true for other countries?

The US and Canada are both "New" nations, though they've had numerous indigenous tribes for tens of thousands of years, themselves migrating from another continent over a long ago melted ice bridge. My point being that even though timespans vary, inevitably everyone came from somewhere else going back to our species first leaving Africa.