Confirmed with Link: When Will Werenski Sign (UPDATE: 9 September 2019, apparently - $15m/3yr)

[EspenK]

I wouldn't. That'd be pretty dangerous spending considering he just lost his best winger. If there is very little to no dropoff from his production with Panarin (or, even better production) we will have to break the bank for PLD, but it will be justified. I wouldn't extend him now.

As for Anderson, I agree.

Not sure I understand your reasoning. Are you saying Panarin made PLD? PLD is not worth locking up at 6-7mm unless he puts up 70+ pts? I think he has Kopitar like skills and I want him signed up as soon as possible. At worse he is a solid 2c assuming we ever come up with a better 1c. Can you shed a bit more insight on your opinion. Thanks.

 

[Viqsi]

Not sure I understand your reasoning. Are you saying Panarin made PLD? PLD is not worth locking up at 6-7mm unless he puts up 70+ pts? I think he has Kopitar like skills and I want him signed up as soon as possible. At worse he is a solid 2c assuming we ever come up with a better 1c. Can you shed a bit more insight on your opinion. Thanks.

I think it's based mostly on the fact that "at worst he is a solid 2-3c" was what we used to presume about Wennberg when he was signed.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

I wouldn't. That'd be pretty dangerous spending considering he just lost his best winger. If there is very little to no dropoff from his production with Panarin (or, even better production) we will have to break the bank for PLD, but it will be justified. I wouldn't extend him now.

As for Anderson, I agree.

Signing a player like PLD to a 6 year/$6 million per deal is fairly risk free. Let's say his play drops off a bit next year from this year and he puts up 45 points. He's still only 21 years old. He's a former 3OA pick. Trading him would be easy.

If his play drops off the side of a mountain-a very, very slight possibility-then you buy him out at 1/3rd.

There's much more risk signing a 30 year old UFA like Nyquist than there is to signing a Dubois.

The sooner he is extended the cheaper he will come. If he puts up a 30g/40a season away from Panarin then you, as you said, would have to break the bank. The real risk is in not extending him now. He wouldn't require any bonuses now (outside of maybe a first year of deal one) whereas he probably would get a heavily bonus-laden deal if he performs to his peak ability next season.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Signing a player like PLD to a 6 year/$6 million per deal is fairly risk free. Let's say his play drops off a bit next year from this year and he puts up 45 points. He's still only 21 years old. He's a former 3OA pick. Trading him would be easy.

If his play drops off the side of a mountain-a very, very slight possibility-then you buy him out at 1/3rd.

There's much more risk signing a 30 year old UFA like Nyquist than there is to signing a Dubois.

The sooner he is extended the cheaper he will come. If he puts up a 30g/40a season away from Panarin then you, as you said, would have to break the bank. The real risk is in not extending him now. He wouldn't require any bonuses now (outside of maybe a first year of deal one) whereas he probably would get a heavily bonus-laden deal if he performs to his peak ability next season.

We support Columbus, not New York. Ownership is willing to do buyouts if we have to, and we have proof of that, but just throwing around buyouts isn't practical nor would ownership like/approve of that. There's risk.

 

[cslebn]

Signing a player like PLD to a 6 year/$6 million per deal is fairly risk free. Let's say his play drops off a bit next year from this year and he puts up 45 points. He's still only 21 years old. He's a former 3OA pick. Trading him would be easy.

If his play drops off the side of a mountain-a very, very slight possibility-then you buy him out at 1/3rd.

There's much more risk signing a 30 year old UFA like Nyquist than there is to signing a Dubois.

The sooner he is extended the cheaper he will come. If he puts up a 30g/40a season away from Panarin then you, as you said, would have to break the bank. The real risk is in not extending him now. He wouldn't require any bonuses now (outside of maybe a first year of deal one) whereas he probably would get a heavily bonus-laden deal if he performs to his peak ability next season.

It's almost like we've seen this movie before with a 2C somewhere....

 

[Cyclones Rock]

We support Columbus, not New York. Ownership is willing to do buyouts if we have to, and we have proof of that, but just throwing around buyouts isn't practical nor would ownership like/approve of that. There's risk.

A 1/3rd buyout on a PLD-type player is very minimal risk. The probability of a PLD buyout would be extremely low. Not extending him based on his real risk would not be a sound decision, imo.

I doubt there's a GM in the league who wouldn't try to sign him up long term. That includes Jarmo. I look for this one to get done.

Wennberg/Dubois comparisons aren't valid. Wennberg never brought anything near as good as Dubois does to the table. Not even close.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Whoops. Posted an offseason question in here because I guess I thought I was in that thread. So this is the Zach thread huh?

 

[DarkandStormy]

I don't follow these kinds of things too closely, but why is it just understood that all these Dmen are waiting for the Trouba comp to come in? He's arb. eligible, with a higher qualifying offer floor than guys like Werenski coming off their ELCs. Am I missing something?

I get the (slight) risk with going long term with Zach - he had the shoulder injury that kept him a bit more cautious two seasons ago and then wiped out his summer/camp training this past season. Some of the holes in his defensive game have also been exposed, imo. We also have no idea where Zach/Z's agent are wanting to land - do they want an Ekblad-esque 8 year, $66-67m deal? Eklbad signed a year early for 10.27% of the cap at the time. Or are they thinking 2-3 years, at $5ish m per in order to cash in later a la Subban? The FO might also say, "look, you're not as good as Seth but we'll offer you basically an identical (in % of cap terms) 6x6 contract."

I think term should be at least 6 years (they gave Wennberg freaking 6 years, I mean come on lol) but would be fine with 7 or 8 as well.

 

[thebus88]

Dubois > Anderson = Werenski >>>>>>>Wennberg

As usual, some ridiculous things being said or even THOUGT about in regards to Dubois.

Dubois will get and DESERVES the contract some of you think Anderson and Werenski "deserve".

 

[CBJWerenski8]

A 1/3rd buyout on a PLD-type player is very minimal risk. The probability of a PLD buyout would be extremely low. Not extending him based on his real risk would not be a sound decision, imo.

I doubt there's a GM in the league who wouldn't try to sign him up long term. That includes Jarmo. I look for this one to get done.

Wennberg/Dubois comparisons aren't valid. Wennberg never brought anything near as good as Dubois does to the table. Not even close.

I agree, I never said Dubois was the next Wennberg or anything close. I just think a drop off in production is inevitable, even if it is just slightly (which could be the best case scenario). Thus, we can get him cheaper next year with a "down" year than we would right now.

 

[blahblah]

Dubois > Anderson = Werenski >>>>>>>Wennberg

As usual, some ridiculous things being said or even THOUGT about in regards to Dubois.

Dubois will get and DESERVES the contract some of you think Anderson and Werenski "deserve".

A whole lot of weird in one post, to be sure. Randomly capitalizing words and formatting them differently doesn't make your position any more valuable.

This is a thread about Werenski. The market is pretty well baked in already on what he'll end up getting. What we think he deserves is laughably irrelevant. This smells of you assigning contacts to players based on your personal opinion on what you think of the player. Werenski is going to get paid and paid very well. I think he'll be worth the contract, you don't see to think so.

Probably the sillies thing I've seen is that you appear to be saying that Werenski and Anderson are equally valuable for their next contact. Market will place Werenski well above Anderson. Anderson is increasing in value, but he's not there yet (he could though, this is just as of today). That is not a knock on Anderson. What Werenski can do is more valued across the league, because there are less of them.

Cheers.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

I agree, I never said Dubois was the next Wennberg or anything close. I just think a drop off in production is inevitable, even if it is just slightly (which could be the best case scenario). Thus, we can get him cheaper next year with a "down" year than we would right now.

I was responding to multiple posts in one. My mistake on not making it clear that it wasn't your post(s) that made the comparisons.

I'd think that there's enough leverage for the FO now based on Dubois' late season troubles which could keep the price reasonable now. I'd think that a contract equal to Nathan MacKinnon's ($6.3m/year) would get the job done. If not, then other options would have to be considered.

 

[EspenK]

I agree, I never said Dubois was the next Wennberg or anything close. I just think a drop off in production is inevitable, even if it is just slightly (which could be the best case scenario). Thus, we can get him cheaper next year with a "down" year than we would right now.

But I think you are taking a big risk. I'd prefer doing what it takes to lock him up now and take my chances he is at a minimum the .667 ppg player he was for his first two years. He was also a plus player both years. He has the physical skills. He is as crucial to the long term success as Wennberg and they both need to be signed now for the best deal Jarmo can get for as long as he can get. Throw Andy in the mix too. We have the cap space (now and to sign Jones for 10 mm or more in a few years); to screw around and hope he has a down year so we can save $500k per year is dumb imo.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

But I think you are taking a big risk. I'd prefer doing what it takes to lock him up now and take my chances he is at a minimum the .667 ppg player he was for his first two years. He was also a plus player both years. He has the physical skills. He is as crucial to the long term success as Wennberg and they both need to be signed now for the best deal Jarmo can get for as long as he can get. Throw Andy in the mix too. We have the cap space (now and to sign Jones for 10 mm or more in a few years); to screw around and hope he has a down year so we can save $500k per year is dumb imo.

I can agree there.

 

[koteka]

I don't follow these kinds of things too closely, but why is it just understood that all these Dmen are waiting for the Trouba comp to come in? He's arb. eligible, with a higher qualifying offer floor than guys like Werenski coming off their ELCs. Am I missing something?

Why not wait a couple of weeks and see what he gets? There is no benefit to signing before him. Because Trouba filed for arbitration, you know he’ll have a signed contract very soon. If he gets crazy numbers, it will only help in negotiations.

 

[LoveCBJ]

Trade him for a center.

 

[Viqsi]

For the record, I agree with the "lock up Dubois long-term" suggestion. That said, this is the Werenski thread, not the Dubois/general offseason thread. Let's try and stay on-topic.

 

[EspenK]

Not trying to be difficult here, but a lot of times topics intertwine and separating the two becomes difficult,e.g. the locking up of Dubois & Werenski and other UFA's. That being said the redundant and annoying trait of hijacking every thread with some inane Player X>>>>>>player Y comment for the umpteenth time is totally annoying and could and should be stopped. Comment in appropriate thread >>>>>>than comment in every thread. (Sorry, couldn't resist the last sentence)

 

[Old Guy]

..... I just think a drop off in production is inevitable, even if it is just slightly (which could be the best case scenario). Thus, we can get him cheaper next year with a "down" year than we would right now.

The optimist in me thinks a drop off in production is NOT inevitable. I think the guy is just getting going. The entire league and cadre of sportswriters have already done their mea culpa for Jarmo NOT choosing Jesse Pool Party. The gap will only continue to widen, in my opinion.

It's not your opinion that surprises me. It's that you feel so certain, you almost sound like you are willing to bet on that occurring to get a cheaper contract than if he succeeds. As a fan, I have no control over negotiations or signings or development or coaching. I can't understand a fan of a team rooting for one of their players to regress.

Look......I'm not bashing you. It's your opinion. You are entitled. I just don't understand what you really...really hope the player accomplishes.

 

[Viqsi]

The optimist in me thinks a drop off in production is NOT inevitable. I think the guy is just getting going. The entire league and cadre of sportswriters have already done their mea culpa for Jarmo NOT choosing Jesse Pool Party. The gap will only continue to widen, in my opinion.

It's not your opinion that surprises me. It's that you feel so certain, you almost sound like you are willing to bet on that occurring to get a cheaper contract than if he succeeds. As a fan, I have no control over negotiations or signings or development or coaching. I can't understand a fan of a team rooting for one of their players to regress.

Look......I'm not bashing you. It's your opinion. You are entitled. I just don't understand what you really...really hope the player accomplishes.

There's a difference between what one hopes will happen and what one expects will happen. That read to me as more of a "well, here's a possible silver lining given [insert pessimistic expectation here]", rather than a particularly desirable scenario. Pretty sure CBJWennberg10 (like pretty much everyone else here) would be much happier with everyone on the team being badasses.

 

[Ice9]

PLD is basically a big kid. He's somewhat still growing into his body. He's just starting to put it all together. Sign him...sign him now.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

PLD is basically a big kid. He's somewhat still growing into his body. He's just starting to put it all together. Sign him...sign him now.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

The optimist in me thinks a drop off in production is NOT inevitable. I think the guy is just getting going. The entire league and cadre of sportswriters have already done their mea culpa for Jarmo NOT choosing Jesse Pool Party. The gap will only continue to widen, in my opinion.

It's not your opinion that surprises me. It's that you feel so certain, you almost sound like you are willing to bet on that occurring to get a cheaper contract than if he succeeds. As a fan, I have no control over negotiations or signings or development or coaching. I can't understand a fan of a team rooting for one of their players to regress.

Look......I'm not bashing you. It's your opinion. You are entitled. I just don't understand what you really...really hope the player accomplishes.

I can assure you I am not rooting for anything negative from him or anyone on this team. He's one of my favorite players.

 

[EspenK]

https://nypost.com/2019/07/13/where-curious-rangers-jacob-trouba-talks-could-go-from-here/

Interesting article that contains a bunch of salaries and contracts for comparison. Based on that I still believe a 7mmx8 deal is what the Jacks should strive for. Maybe not for Zach but unless he wants the 5 year deal I think that is the target range. Maybe 6.5 on the low end and 7.25 on the upper.

 

[CBJWerenski8]