When can we start blaming scouting?

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Did Stu pick Petry? I don't believe so.

And Peckham...for what that's worth, you got NHL time out him (rightly or wrongly)

 

[Hockey Buddha]

If the worst mistake we've made at the draft in the past 5 years is taking Musil over Jenner then I can live with that.

Example: I'm sure Carolina would rather have Erik Karlsson over Zach Boychuck.

For sure. There tend to be lots of experts three years after the draft, who would have drafted so-and-so over so-and-so. Hindsight and all that. I really don't perceive the current scouting to be a major issue within the organization. As frustrated as I have been lately with the team as a whole, I have to say that I think that it is headed in the right direction. Finally.

 

[McDoused]

Is this post for real?

Actually read the OP again and feel free to edit your post.

I wouldn't reply if I didn't read the OP. If you think we should start firing everyone because of later picks then go ahead, you are entitled to your opinion.

I doubt this thread is here if we were 4-2-0.

 

[MinnesotaFats]

The biggest problem with this is the timing of the RNH pick. We didn't know we would be drafting 1st overall again in 2013. We needed a center and RNH fills that bill. I don't think anyone could argue that.

As far as Galchenyuk goes, lets not get too carried away after 6 games. Yakupov had the better rookie season and lead his team in goals.

Either way, we are losing games because of Goaltending. Not because we didn't draft Galchenyuk.

I'm not even looking at point totals from this year or last. Galchenyuk plays a much more complete game than Yak. And at the end of the day, keeping the puck out of your net is just as important as scoring goals. Galy may never put up 40 goals like Yak likely will, but Yak is never going to play the kind of 200 ft game Galy does.

I like Yak, but this team is too easy to beat. There are too many 90 lbs weaklings that aren't committed to playing a complete game.

 

[Soundwave]

I'm not even looking at point totals from this year or last. Galchenyuk plays a much more complete game than Yak. And at the end of the day, keeping the puck out of your net is just as important as scoring goals. Galy may never put up 40 goals like Yak likely will, but Yak is never going to play the kind of 200 ft game Galy does.

I like Yak, but this team is too easy to beat. There are too many 90 lbs weaklings that aren't committed to playing a complete game.

It was a tough spot to draft someone no.1 overall when he played like what? 5 games in his entire draft year?

I think we should have gone *hard* after Seguin though as the Bruins were shopping him last summer though.

 

[Moose Coleman]

I'm not even looking at point totals from this year or last. Galchenyuk plays a much more complete game than Yak. And at the end of the day, keeping the puck out of your net is just as important as scoring goals. Galy may never put up 40 goals like Yak likely will, but Yak is never going to play the kind of 200 ft game Galy does.

I like Yak, but this team is too easy to beat. There are too many 90 lbs weaklings that aren't committed to playing a complete game.

Neither of these kids have played a full NHL season yet. Maybe keep that in mind before saying what one or the other will never do, hey? SMFH.

 

[Wheathead]

Scouting in general has been pretty poor. It needs to be re-evaluated as a whole.

It's not the first round that determines the talent of your scouting staff... It's the rounds after that. What do we have to show? Some decent prospects, sure, but who knows how they'll pan out?

Our pro scouting is horrendous though. Tambellini leaned on them a lot... and well... How did free agency work under Tambellini?

 

[Fixed to Ruin]

You cant tell a year and a half after the draft but you expect the scouts to get it right at the draft. Hindsight IS 2020... Look who was picked right after Moroz, Musil and how many other teams also passed up on Jenner\Saad\Zucker..

The scouts work with the info they have.. EDM's scouts have been as un psychic as any other team.
Scouting IMO is not an issue... developing these kids properly sometimes is.

What I am saying is with most of these picks in the 30-45th range overall that the success rate at this point should be better than what the results show as of today.

Drafting is only the first step of the process. Development is the next and most important step. We need to stop playing 30 somethings in the AHL over 20 year olds fresh out of junior. Yes they need to earn their place but you can't bench a guy the second he has a couple bad games.

Hopefully that will turn guys like Lander, Pitlick and Hamilton from duds into guys that can play in the NHL.

 

[Asher]

And Peckham...for what that's worth, you got NHL time out him (rightly or wrongly)

Petry was drafted in 2006. Stu took over in 2007.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

I'm not even looking at point totals from this year or last. Galchenyuk plays a much more complete game than Yak. And at the end of the day, keeping the puck out of your net is just as important as scoring goals. Galy may never put up 40 goals like Yak likely will, but Yak is never going to play the kind of 200 ft game Galy does.

I like Yak, but this team is too easy to beat. There are too many 90 lbs weaklings that aren't committed to playing a complete game.

Mysterybox-chenyuk's legend continues to grow, first he's a "big center" (who plays the wing and is the same size as the Nuge) and now he's a two-way player?

What's next, he'll have invented the concept of scoring on the PP or something, geez.

 

[Seachd]

I find it hilarious this thread pops up quite regularly, and the only names that come up are the 'pie-in-the-sky' players drafted in the latter rounds that make impacts... that EVERY team passed on multiple times.

Teemu Pulkkinen! Teemu Pulkkinen!!!

 

[Moose Coleman]

What I am saying is with most of these picks in the 30-45th range overall that the success rate at this point should be better than what the results show as of today.

Again, the chances of drafting a NHLer in those spots is between 26 and 32%. So where do you get the idea that we should be better than the rest of the league?

 

[thadd]

Is this thread for real? Scouting is the furthest thing from being a problem.

I'm not sure Seguin, Larsson, and Murray make us any better then Hall, RNH and Yakupov.

Eberle and Petry were astute picks. Gagner was a decent pick as well.

Our scouting has been great in the first round. Any time our picks didn't turn out (Paajarvi and Plante) they turned it into something (Perron and Marincin).

It's not about 1st rounders.

It's about getting something GOOD out of those mid rounds now and then.

Once in a while you can get away with your 1st rounder not turning out, but once in a while you need a 3rd-6th rounder to turn into a very important player too.

 

[Moose Coleman]

It's not about 1st rounders.

It's about getting something GOOD out of those mid rounds now and then.

Once in a while you can get away with your 1st rounder not turning out, but once in a while you need a 3rd-6th rounder to turn into a very important player too.

That's not about scouting, necessarily. Just dumb luck.

 

[MinnesotaFats]

Mysterybox-chenyuk's legend continues to grow, first he's a "big center" (who plays the wing and is the same size as the Nuge) and now he's a two-way player?

What's next, he'll have invented the concept of scoring on the PP or something, geez.

Watch many Habs games? He isnt PKing and hes barely getting PP time, but he's over a point a game and a +5 while playing less than 12 minutes a night. He's a very good 5-on-5 player. The stats bear it, and if you have watched the Habs with regularity you'd know that he plays a good 200 ft game.

Not saying he is better than Yak, or that we should have drafted him (particularly given the small sample size of games in his draft year), just saying he'd make us a harder team to play against than Yak does at the moment.

 

[thadd]

Again, the chances of drafting a NHLer in those spots is between 26 and 32%. So where do you get the idea that we should be better than the rest of the league?

1: It's not that we SHOULD be drafting better than the rest of the league. It's that the majority of the league shouldn't be drafting and developing this much better than us.
2: If we're drafting earlier than 90% of the other teams year after year we should be picking up the better players more often than the other teams when drafting outside of the first round. That's not happening.

 

[MinnesotaFats]

That's not about scouting, necessarily. Just dumb luck.

Its also about scouting. Last year's draft was brutal. Too many reaches and too much trading down for an extra lotto ticket on late picks.

 

[thadd]

That's not about scouting, necessarily. Just dumb luck.

Jersey and Detroit must have a ton of that. They must have had it for a long time. If that's not the case it's all on the executives of our team to not have caught onto what they've been doing by now.

 

[tiger_80]

He took over in 2008, so judgement is still out on most of his drafts. I would say 2008 is the only one we can evaluate now.
Eberle was a great pick at 22. Hartikainen would be have been a great value in the 6th round, had he been willing to stick around in NA.


2009 is shaping to be pretty disappointing. Paajarvi is no longer part of the organization--and in either case, it does not look like he will amount to much more than 3rd liner.
Lander etching dangerously close to the bust territory. I expect he's one year away from bolting to Sweden. The rest will never see NHL ice.

2010 could still work out--Marincin is tracking well, Pitlick still has potential to turn into a good bottom 6 forward. Martindale and Hamilton not so much, but Davidsom might continue to surprise.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Jersey and Detroit must have a ton of that. They must have had it for a long time. If that's not the case it's all on the executives of our team to not have caught onto what they've been doing by now.

To get Datsyuk in the 7th Round is as much dumb luck as skill.

Also, to get Lidstrom in the 2nd round, have him play like an all-time great for 20 years without serious injury at any point is beyond dumb luck into miracle territory.

 

[Moose Coleman]

1: It's not that we SHOULD be drafting better than the rest of the league. It's that the majority of the league shouldn't be drafting and developing this much better than us.

But they aren't. That's the point.

2: If we're drafting earlier than 90% of the other teams year after year we should be picking up the better players more often than the other teams when drafting outside of the first round. That's not happening.

Nope. Basically the odds of picking an NHLer at 31-35 are about the same as picking one at 56-60.

 

[tiger_80]

But they aren't. That's the point.



Nope. Basically the odds of picking an NHLer at 31-35 are about the same as picking one at 56-60.

Yes, but the problem the Oilers hardly ever find serviceable NHL guys between 30 and 60. Who was the last second rounder who made the big club in the past 10 years? other than Petry, there is none.

 

[Moose Coleman]

Jersey and Detroit must have a ton of that. They must have had it for a long time. If that's not the case it's all on the executives of our team to not have caught onto what they've been doing by now.

Is there any real evidence that Jersey and Detroit have more success finding late picks than other teams?

 

[Maxxed Out]

Its beyond pathetic that we haven't been able to produce a NHL caliber goalie from our system. Those scouts are not doing their job well, specially while in europe, Anaheim has Fasth, Chicago has Raanta, we poorly missed out on Bishop and now stranded in middle of nowhere.

 

[Maxxed Out]

Its also about scouting. Last year's draft was brutal. Too many reaches and too much trading down for an extra lotto ticket on late picks.

This