What could greatly improve this team?

[BrindamoursNose]

You legit posted this same thing last year lol

Why is that funny? I don't get it.

I'm not a wishy-washy person when it comes to building an organization in sports-- I understand my beliefs and know that Hextall's direction is the right one for this team. Even if Hakstol is a bad coach (which he is) and there's dead weight vets on the roster (which there are), the positive is a million times greater than the negative long-term. The vets and Hak are such short-term issues that can be dealt with at any time, really. I know the response then is "Then why don't they do it!!!!!"...

Simple answer: I don't know. Perhaps management wants it that way (not Hexy, but ownership). We're not about to pretend the Flyers all of a sudden became a "boys club" when it comes to being loyal to players/former players under Hextall/Hak. It's been going on for ages.

What I do know is that Hextall is giving us the best chance to win a Cup for a sustained period of time. No more shooting our wads for a 3 year window...this will be open for a while.

 

[WIP CALLER]

Why is that funny? I don't get it.

I'm not a wishy-washy person when it comes to building an organization in sports-- I understand my beliefs and know that Hextall's direction is the right one for this team. Even if Hakstol is a bad coach (which he is) and there's dead weight vets on the roster (which there are), the positive is a million times greater than the negative long-term.

Because you talked about how they'd be greatly improved this year when doing this same schtick last year. Does this team looks greatly improved? The blind faith in "next year will be better" is a defeatist attitude especially when it isn't occurring. This team is only slightly better than it was 5 years ago but overall it's in the same exact position at the NHL level. An absolutely elite mediocre team.

 

[deadhead]

We saw Leier last year, awful on the PK, meh at 5x5, why does anyone think he's an improvement over Lehtera? Because he can skate? Let's draft some men from the Ice Capades then!

It's MacDonald v Folin, Myers looks lost in LHV, the idea that he'd be an improvement right now is wishful thinking, Friedman is more likely to be called up this fall.

Twarynski, Rubtsov and Kase have NHL upside but need seasoning.

NAK, I don't know what to think, preseason he struck me as a more physical version of Leier, good skater with bad hands. In some ways he's Rinaldo's mini-me (high motor with speed, bad penalties, some brain dead plays) with more hope that he can grow into a real player.

The players are there, but anyone who thinks adding a bunch of these kids and letting them play would help this team hasn't watch the struggles of PP2, far more talented players who are just learning how to play together, or the Lindblom - Patrick - TK line. If you want to flood the team with young players who aren't NHL ready, be prepared for a 85 point season.

 

[Petr Svoboda Mullet]

Fire Lappy, scrap the PK system, demote Farmer Andy back down to the farm, promote Friedman/Myers.

Profit.

 

[hatcher]

Am I correct for assuming most of that should happen by the end of the year besides Hart and the LHV kids?

Who are the LHV kids replacing? Most of the roster at least forward wise looks pretty good and personally Hagg isn't bad for a bottom defending pair if MacDonald could get blasted off in the moon.

If Trouba could be acquired (without losing much currently) I'd be fine with hearing people complain since I think the roster would be greatly improved.

Trouba would be the best dman we have by a mile.

 

[deadhead]

Because you talked about how they'd be greatly improved this year when doing this same schtick last year. Does this team looks greatly improved? The blind faith in "next year will be better" is a defeatist attitude especially when it isn't occurring. This team is only slightly better than it was 5 years ago but overall it's in the same exact position at the NHL level. An absolutely elite mediocre team.

This team is working in young players year by year. Some have taken a little longer than expected, but that's why Hextall likes to marinate them as much as possible, let them struggle at LHV, not in the NHL.

Five years ago they had a core at its peak (G, V, Simmonds, Raffl, Read), two young players (Couts, B Schenn) and only a couple quality prospects (Ghost, Laughton, Morin). The defense was on its last legs, the bottom six was bleech, and there was no hope in the pipeline - had they stayed the course they'd be one of the five worst teams in the NHL.

The under 25 players on that 2013-14 team:
Voracek (24), B Schenn (22), Couts (21), L Schenn (24), Tye McGinn (23), Rinaldo (23), Akeson (23).

 

[BrindamoursNose]

Because you talked about how they'd be greatly improved this year when doing this same schtick last year. Does this team looks greatly improved? The blind faith in "next year will be better" is a defeatist attitude especially when it isn't occurring. This team is only slightly better than it was 5 years ago but overall it's in the same exact position at the NHL level. An absolutely elite mediocre team.

Well two things:

1) I can't believe I said we'd be greatly improved (meaning in serious contention) this year. I've routinely said two years in the last little bit, but of course that's all based on trajectory of prospect development. I currently believe next year is the real window opening for us to contend. If you can accurately quote me from last year, I'd love to see that (just so you're not putting words in my mouth).

Of course, this trajectory can be screwed up depending on trades/signings/injuries, etc. but based on everything Hextall has shown us, he believes in a long-term plan of success. He doesn't hit panic buttons and isn't impressed by shiny, new toys on the trade/UFA market.

2) It's defeatist to say we will keep getting better? Isn't that the exact opposite?

 

[deadhead]

We're not going to be a serious contender without solid goaltending.
Penguins fell back to the pack when Murray fell to earth, and they're far more talented and experienced than the Flyers (or most NHL teams).

You need talent and experience to win, even the best players often take 2-3 years to hit their stride, especially in playoff hockey.
When the Flyers have a goaltender (i.e. when Hart is ready) and the core young players are 22-24 years old, they'll be ready to make a move.

I want to keep the Lindblom - Patrick - TK line together, because in a year or so, they could be a top line, just need time playing together.

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

Imagine if Lavi was here and had Ghost, Provy, Sanheim, Gudas, Myers and Hagg at his disposal. And we would be playing with some jam!

 

[deadhead]

Imagine if Lavi was here and had Ghost, Provy, Sanheim, Gudas, Myers and Hagg at his disposal. And we would be playing with some jam!

This mythology ignores that Lavi hasn't won without a hot goalie and a deep, veteran team.
When Lavi took over in Nashville, Ellis (24), Weber (29), Josi (24), Ekholm (24), Jones (20).
Weber for Subban was a salary move, but notice it's the 20 year old talented defenseman who gets traded.
Doubt Lavi would have the patience to deal with Sanheim and Myers' growing pains.

 

[Curufinwe]

And there'd be even more jam if Lavi brought the Zac-attack with him.

He's played every game for Nashville so far this season.

NHL.com - Stats

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

This mythology ignores that Lavi hasn't won without a hot goalie and a deep, veteran team.
When Lavi took over in Nashville, Ellis (24), Weber (29), Josi (24), Ekholm (24), Jones (20).
Weber for Subban was a salary move, but notice it's the 20 year old talented defenseman who gets traded.
Doubt Lavi would have the patience to deal with Sanheim and Myers' growing pains.

You mean unlike jeff?

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

And there'd be even more jam if Lavi brought the Zac-attack with him.

He's played every game for Nashville so far this season.

NHL.com - Stats

Look at that +- though.

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

Doubt Jeff would have the patience to deal with ... I don't know, I'm out of ideas. Fire Hakstok.

 

[Curufinwe]

Nashville only have one skater younger than 24 - Fiala, who is 22. The Flyers have seven.

Nashville Predators - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Huh, I didn't even know they signed 35 year old Dan Hamhuis to a 2-year deal.

 

[Lindberg]

This mythology ignores that Lavi hasn't won without a hot goalie and a deep, veteran team.
When Lavi took over in Nashville, Ellis (24), Weber (29), Josi (24), Ekholm (24), Jones (20).
Weber for Subban was a salary move, but notice it's the 20 year old talented defenseman who gets traded.
Doubt Lavi would have the patience to deal with Sanheim and Myers' growing pains.

Always been a fan of Weber (from years back) so I wonder what it would take to pry him away from Montreal if they ever did blow up that team.

That contract is scary and from what I remember reading here a year ago or so his play has steadily fallen off.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Always been a fan of Weber (from years back) so I wonder what it would take to pry him away from Montreal if they ever did blow up that team.

That contract is scary and from what I remember reading here a year ago or so his play has steadily fallen off.

His play has been falling off since 2012ish, you wouldn't be able to get full value out of him with Gostisbehere locked into PP1, and you'd be paying $7,857,143 per year for 8 more years, encompassing his Age 33 through 40 seasons. Not for all the tea in China.

 

[flyershockey]

If Hextall says "I made a mistake hiring Hakstol" today, would the team be better?



Well there's the problem -- you don't understand his philosophy. Even this statement alone is silly -- we're a playoff team, not exactly in the basement. That's just right now -- in a year, we'll be even above that.

I'm still stunned folks don't understand what's happening with the Flyers long-term. Even if Hextall is fired at the end of this season and we win a Cup within 5 years, Hextall gets the credit for that win based on what he's been doing with the roster since he stepped foot into the role.

Dude, you were on here pushing this same "next year" narrative last year. Shocker, they look as mediocre as they did last year, since you know, the roster and coaching flaws still have not been addressed.

This organization is entirely too complacent right now. Hextall's in no hurry to be any better than they were five years ago, and he's got a coach behind the bench who saps the life out of his hockey team. Hakstol literally goes out of his way to publicly criticize his team for playing with too much aggression.

 

[hatcher]

Why is that funny? I don't get it.

I'm not a wishy-washy person when it comes to building an organization in sports-- I understand my beliefs and know that Hextall's direction is the right one for this team. Even if Hakstol is a bad coach (which he is) and there's dead weight vets on the roster (which there are), the positive is a million times greater than the negative long-term. The vets and Hak are such short-term issues that can be dealt with at any time, really. I know the response then is "Then why don't they do it!!!!!"...

Simple answer: I don't know. Perhaps management wants it that way (not Hexy, but ownership). We're not about to pretend the Flyers all of a sudden became a "boys club" when it comes to being loyal to players/former players under Hextall/Hak. It's been going on for ages.

What I do know is that Hextall is giving us the best chance to win a Cup for a sustained period of time. No more shooting our wads for a 3 year window...this will be open for a while.

What do we have next to ghost and Provy that are a surething?

 

[hatcher]

Dude, you were on here pushing this same "next year" narrative last year. Shocker, they look as mediocre as they did last year, since you know, the roster and coaching flaws still have not been addressed.

This organization is entirely too complacent right now. Hextall's in no hurry to be any better than they were five years ago, and he's got a coach behind the bench who saps the life out of his hockey team. Hakstol literally goes out of his way to publicly criticize his team for playing with too much aggression.

TO is so far ahead now of the flyers its crazy and the bruins and a host of others. Hexy needs to get going.

 

[Curufinwe]

I do think Hextall expects to start winning playoff rounds this year. He didn't give JVR $35,000,000 just to miss the playoffs or be an easy first round exit again. However, he must still believe that Hakstol is capable of getting the team to that position, and only a lot more ticks in the L column will convince him that he was wrong.

 

[Lord Defect]

Fire lappy, introduce a more aggressive PK.
Change the second line PP scheme up.
A legit goalie, that can stay healthy, that is not a head case.
Time for the 43 injured players this year to heal.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

Dude, you were on here pushing this same "next year" narrative last year. Shocker, they look as mediocre as they did last year, since you know, the roster and coaching flaws still have not been addressed.

Can you quote me saying they'd be genuinely contending this year? Or do you just want to make it up because someone else said I said we'd be legitimate contenders? (or whatever you're trying to say I said).

 

[BrindamoursNose]

What do we have next to ghost and Provy that are a surething?

What? Can you re-phrase this question for me?

 

[OrangeAndBlackMetal]

Coaching change, for sure. Legitimate goaltender, and another top 4 defenseman.