NFL GDT: Week 11

[Mongo]

Travis Kelce is the greatest TE of all-time.

I know I’m biased as a Patriots fan but Gronk is still the better TE. Absolute monster gronk was before the injuries added up. Even a bigger nightmare matchup than Kelce and even though it’s been only about 8-10 years, the passing game has gotten easier and defending has gotten harder.

Gronk for the first half of his career was at a TD per game pace. He had roughly 60 TDS in 60 games. Kelce is at 68 in 137 games. Overall Kelce’s still 24 TDs shy of Gronk and Gronk only played in 6 more games.

Kelce has about 150 more catches and about 600 more yards at this point though. But Gronk was also one of the best blocking TEs as well.

Gronks crazy physical style made him a total monster but it also made him take a beating in the long run. Kelce is in a more pass happy offense and playing at his peak in a bit more of a pass happy period(not saying Gronk played in a dead ball era but it has progressively gotten easier to pass as years continue to go on).

Between Gronk and Kelce, both are amazing and both are near the top of the mountain for TEs. But I’d go with Gronk due to his nearly unstoppable physical gifts and he’s one of the best blocking TEs ever. Kelce will easily have a longer career and will probably end up eclipsing Gronks TD numbers for career and probably season TDs this year. Still think Gronk was better but Kelce is no joke. Dude is legit awesome.

 

[pockets]

Travis Kelce is the greatest TE of all-time.

He absolutely is not, as of today Gronk has played only 6 more games than Kelce but has 24 more TDs (92 to 68), 15 yards per reception compared to Kelce's 12.8, and 9.7 yards per target to Kelce's 9.1. And when you throw in Gronk's vastly superior blocking, which is a huge requirement for TEs, it's really not as close as people think.

The one thing that Kelce definitely has over Gronk though is durability and pretty soon career longevity.

 

[StreetHawk]

He absolutely is not, as of today Gronk has played only 6 more games than Kelce but has 24 more TDs (92 to 68), 15 yards per reception compared to Kelce's 12.8, and 9.7 yards per target to Kelce's 9.1. And when you throw in Gronk's vastly superior blocking, which is a huge requirement for TEs, it's really not as close as people think.

The one thing that Kelce definitely has over Gronk though is durability and pretty soon career longevity.

Gronk was just so physically imposing that DBs had to find a way to bring him down. 265 pounds. Gronk is the best all around TE. Kelce the better receiving TE. He's more a student of the game than Gronk.

 

[StreetHawk]

What an entitled little shit he is, my God.

You're the worst starting qb in football, the one thing holding your team back, and you take zero accountability after being basically the reason why your team loses important games. If the locker room hasn't turned on him yet they will very soon.

No one screams patience regarding young qbs more than I but this guy simply doesn't have it. Period. He doesn't have the attitude or the brain to do this in any market, to say the least in NY f***ing city.

This is a deep QB class, though I don't know if it's going to be good. Last 2 that they said were good were the Lawrence draft, which included Wilson, Lance, and I believe Jones can play, but look at his OC this season. The other was the Mayfield one with Darnold, and Rosen as well in it, which also had Allen and Jackson.

For the Jets, with Hooker's ACL tear he will drop unless there's a team that truly loves him and is prepared to redshirt him next season. And would have a HC who isn't in fear of losing his job. I don't think the Lions with Campbell going into year 3 has that luxury. Even the Texans, who will likely draft first, I don't know if Lovie Smith is going to be their HC in 2024 season. If Hooker is there for the Jets they probably need to consider taking him. Next year's off season, they have to decide to pick up the 5th year option on Wilson and currently, you shouldn't based on what we've seen from him so far.

 

[TheGreenTBer]

This is a deep QB class, though I don't know if it's going to be good. Last 2 that they said were good were the Lawrence draft, which included Wilson, Lance, and I believe Jones can play, but look at his OC this season. The other was the Mayfield one with Darnold, and Rosen as well in it, which also had Allen and Jackson.

For the Jets, with Hooker's ACL tear he will drop unless there's a team that truly loves him and is prepared to redshirt him next season. And would have a HC who isn't in fear of losing his job. I don't think the Lions with Campbell going into year 3 has that luxury. Even the Texans, who will likely draft first, I don't know if Lovie Smith is going to be their HC in 2024 season. If Hooker is there for the Jets they probably need to consider taking him. Next year's off season, they have to decide to pick up the 5th year option on Wilson and currently, you shouldn't based on what we've seen from him so far.

Jets won't take a QB high I don't think, if they make a move on a QB they're going to sign someone. The D is ready to win now, they're not going to sit through another rookie unless it's a mid-round project pick or something IMO.

Jets can't develop a QB to save their lives. They need a veteran.

 

[Unholy Diver]

Jets won't take a QB high I don't think, if they make a move on a QB they're going to sign someone. The D is ready to win now, they're not going to sit through another rookie unless it's a mid-round project pick or something IMO.

Jets can't develop a QB to save their lives. They need a veteran.

There's a guy in Tampa due for free agency

 

[StreetHawk]

Jets won't take a QB high I don't think, if they make a move on a QB they're going to sign someone. The D is ready to win now, they're not going to sit through another rookie unless it's a mid-round project pick or something IMO.

Jets can't develop a QB to save their lives. They need a veteran.

Vets like Jimmy G, I don’t foresee Brady going to NY. Not sure what Ten does with Tannehill as Willis looks really raw. Carr should be on the block. The Jets right now can get by with a game manager so long as that QB is paid appropriately.

 

[EpochLink]

Zach Wilson getting buried today

 

[Unholy Diver]

Vets like Jimmy G, I don’t foresee Brady going to NY. Not sure what Ten does with Tannehill as Willis looks really raw. Carr should be on the block. The Jets right now can get by with a game manager so long as that QB is paid appropriately.

The Steelers will trade them Trubisky for two 1sts, a 3rd, and conditional 5th

 

[DueDiligence]

Travis Kelce is the greatest TE of all-time.

No.

 

[The Note]

I'm not overly concerned in getting bogged down with Gronk vs. Kelce or anyone else. All I can say is that, as a Chiefs fan, it has been a joy to watch Kelce mature and become one of the best TEs ever. However you want to slice it, he's been a focal point of one of the most efficient offensive stretches in history. This year, in particular, the passing game is running through him and the attention he demands without Hill out there, and he opens so much up for JJSS, the other TEs, MVS, etc. while still producing at an elite level himself. What he's doing at 33 years old is pretty remarkable (also his blocking work isn't nearly as big a deal as people make it out to be he's fine at it). If you want to take Gronk I get it, but Kelce is right in the conversation.

 

[TheGreenTBer]

Vets like Jimmy G, I don’t foresee Brady going to NY. Not sure what Ten does with Tannehill as Willis looks really raw. Carr should be on the block. The Jets right now can get by with a game manager so long as that QB is paid appropriately.

Tom Brady ain't going to any NY team. It will absolutely not happen.

Carr is a good option. He's good enough to make the playoffs with this team. Can he handle the pressure in NY? No comment. Is he FAR better than Zach Wilson at this point in time? Yup.

Zach Wilson getting buried today

Good, he f***ing deserves it. His only possible hope is that he gets absolutely f***ing buried and uses that adversity going forward. That's his only chance and I don't see it happening.

I'm not overly concerned in getting bogged down with Gronk vs. Kelce or anyone else. All I can say is that, as a Chiefs fan, it has been a joy to watch Kelce mature and become one of the best TEs ever. However you want to slice it, he's been a focal point of one of the most efficient offensive stretches in history. This year, in particular, the passing game is running through him and the attention he demands without Hill out there, and he opens so much up for JJSS, the other TEs, MVS, etc. while still producing at an elite level himself. What he's doing at 33 years old is pretty remarkable (also his blocking work isn't nearly as big a deal as people make it out to be he's fine at it). If you want to take Gronk I get it, but Kelce is right in the conversation.

Both guys are elite in the passing game, and Kelce is a decent blocker...but Gronk was an elite blocker and I think that's what breaks the tie.

 

[StreetHawk]

Tom Brady ain't going to any NY team. It will absolutely not happen.

Carr is a good option. He's good enough to make the playoffs with this team. Can he handle the pressure in NY? No comment. Is he FAR better than Zach Wilson at this point in time? Yup.

Good, he f***ing deserves it. His only possible hope is that he gets absolutely f***ing buried and uses that adversity going forward. That's his only chance and I don't see it happening.


Both guys are elite in the passing game, and Kelce is a decent blocker...but Gronk was an elite blocker and I think that's what breaks the tie.

Carr, Jimmy, Tanny, all kind of the same level. Heck even Geno Smith is a free agent but he should stay in Seattle unless the Jets offer much more guaranteed money.

Ryan, Wentz, etc. group that’s done imo.
Bridgewater?

No to Baker. Would you take a year of Rodgers?

That’s kind of your options on the veteran market.

 

[BB88]

Zach Wilson getting buried today

He should be.

 

[Habsawce]

It's crazy how for 20 years when Brady was in NE, the AFC East was a laughing stock. Constant rebuilds and free passes to the playoffs. Now that Brady is gone, and it's Allen and Buffalo's time; the AFC East looks like a potential powerhouse.

Poor Buffalo.

 

[TheGreenTBer]

Carr, Jimmy, Tanny, all kind of the same level. Heck even Geno Smith is a free agent but he should stay in Seattle unless the Jets offer much more guaranteed money.

Ryan, Wentz, etc. group that’s done imo.
Bridgewater?

No to Baker. Would you take a year of Rodgers?

That’s kind of your options on the veteran market.

Agreed on basically all of this.

Carr, Jimmy GQ or Tannehill are stopgaps but they're better options than what the Jets have at the moment. None of the other guys really work for a variety of reasons.

 

[Reality Check]

Vikings were getting pounded on and off the field yesterday...

 

[BB88]

 

[Blitzkrug]

Tone changed real quick from yesterday's "Zach is still our guy" comment.

Realistically there was no way you could justify starting him if he caused that much of a problem in the locker room so good on Saleh for not being stubborn.

 

[GKJ]

Saleh is a defensive guy and he was on 49ers teams who had issues at QB, so he knows what it’s like to see a defense constantly get f***ed

 

[StreetHawk]

Saleh is a defensive guy and he was on 49ers teams who had issues at QB, so he knows what it’s like to see a defense constantly get f***ed

QB is supposed to take the bullets for the team. And in this case it wasn’t unjustified for him to absorb them.

Can’t be walking around with the attitude that you aren’t taking any blame when clearly you are not pulling your own weight.

Be interesting to hear how the game film session goes when the Jets review Wilson’s passes. How hard will Saleh and the OC come down in Wilson in front of the team and how is he going to respond to the criticism?

 

[GKJ]

 

[Halladay]

It is pouring there.

 

[Marc the Habs Fan]

What's with the huge tarps on what would be in theory high $ seats?

 

[Marc the Habs Fan]

Prater 40 yard FG is good.