We have the Cap room!! 2019-20 UFA Targets??

[RememberTheRoar]

Then yeah, if they got a good offer I would hope they would move him.

Ya, I think I'd be willing to move him and Keith if they get good offers. Rebuild around DeBrincat and Jokijaru/Boqvist/Mitchell/Beaudin and keep Toews and Kane around to lead them.

I think I'd be okay if that were the new route.

 

[AmericanDream]

IMO, we just aren't ready to move Keith. We still need veterans to lead the kids, if you move out Keith, that means Seabs and Murph and.....Manning are the leaders defensively....Keith has tremendous value still, as his contract is solid, and his production is still top pairing level,..Keith sticks this out with Kane and Toews until their contracts end, I can't see him getting moved this year or even next year.

 

[Kurtosis]

IMO, we just aren't ready to move Keith. We still need veterans to lead the kids, if you move out Keith, that means Seabs and Murph and.....Manning are the leaders defensively....Keith has tremendous value still, as his contract is solid, and his production is still top pairing level,..Keith sticks this out with Kane and Toews until their contracts end, I can't see him getting moved this year or even next year.

That’s a fair point. If the deal for Keith is phenomenal I don’t think they can afford to pass it up though.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

IMO, we just aren't ready to move Keith. We still need veterans to lead the kids, if you move out Keith, that means Seabs and Murph and.....Manning are the leaders defensively....Keith has tremendous value still, as his contract is solid, and his production is still top pairing level,..Keith sticks this out with Kane and Toews until their contracts end, I can't see him getting moved this year or even next year.

Isn’t Seabrook alone enough of a leader to help bring along the kids? If there’s anything Seabrook is elite at, it’s supposedly being a leader.

I’m not too worried about the leadership element, I see heavier weight to your production argument. But that’s why you’d expect a really strong return for Keith, it would need to be something that makes it worth giving up a legit veteran first-pair

 

[AmericanDream]

That’s a fair point. If the deal for Keith is phenomenal I don’t think they can afford to pass it up though.

agreed, but those types of deals seem to be too few and far between when it comes to us. teams just never seem to want to "wow" us with an offer from what I have seen from the past 10 years trade wise.. there have been a few good ones, the Hartman trade in particular and the original Buff deal looked real good at first, just don't think teams are going to go all in for Keith and do us any favors and over pay lol...

 

[RememberTheRoar]

That’s a fair point. If the deal for Keith is phenomenal I don’t think they can afford to pass it up though.

I agree, it has to be a good offer.

Like first and a legit prospect or young guy who is ready to step into the NHL?

 

[AmericanDream]

Isn’t Seabrook alone enough of a leader to help bring along the kids? If there’s anything Seabrook is elite at, it’s supposedly being a leader.

I’m not too worried about the leadership element, I see heavier weight to your production argument. But that’s why you’d expect a really strong return for Keith, it would need to be something that makes it worth giving up a legit veteran first-pair

Keith still plays 25 minutes a night, being a leader on the ice as well as in the locker room is what I am talking about. We cannot move Keith yet until we are confident Joker can start eating up 25-27 minutes a night, or Mitchell/Boqvist are ready to step in, or the player(s) we get in return can eat significant minutes for us....and what do you think teams are going to offer for a 35 year old Keith?? I am asking just like you were...I am not sure what they would give up, a 1st rounder, and a real good prospect??? how is that going to help us now?

 

[RememberTheRoar]

agreed, but those types of deals seem to be too few and far between when it comes to us. teams just never seem to want to "wow" us with an offer from what I have seen from the past 10 years trade wise.. there have been a few good ones, the Hartman trade in particular and the original Buff deal looked real good at first, just don't think teams are going to go all in for Keith and do us any favors and over pay lol...

The history doesn’t show the potential for a great return. But think about it from a competing team’s perspective.

If you feel you’re a defensive upgrade away from becoming a legit Cup contender this year, is there anyone else you’d rather add than Keith?

Considering his playoff track-record, his leadership that you mentioned, his contract that shouldn’t be hard to fit.

I’m guessing he’d be most in demand if he became available, despite his age.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Keith still plays 25 minutes a night, being a leader on the ice as well as in the locker room is what I am talking about. We cannot move Keith yet until we are confident Joker can start eating up 25-27 minutes a night, or Mitchell/Boqvist are ready to step in, or the player(s) we get in return can eat significant minutes for us....and what do you think teams are going to offer for a 35 year old Keith?? I am asking just like you were...I am not sure what they would give up, a 1st rounder, and a real good prospect??? how is that going to help us now?

It’s not about helping us this season. As Kurt said, this would be in a all-in rebuild (keeping Kane and Toews) scenario.

The idea being it will take 2-3 years for Joker and Boqvist to be full-fledged top-pair defensemen. By then, Keith and Crawford will likely no longer be at the top of their games, but Kane and possibly Toews still will be.

So you sell high on the guys you know will decline by the time you’re ready to compete again, and keep the guys you think will still be elite or near elite.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

You will have to pry Keith from my cold dead hands if you want to trade him. I'm sorry, I can't be rational about this.

 

[AmericanDream]

The history doesn’t show the potential for a great return. But think about it from a competing team’s perspective.

If you feel you’re a defensive upgrade away from becoming a legit Cup contender this year, is there anyone else you’d rather add than Keith?

Considering his playoff track-record, his leadership that you mentioned, his contract that shouldn’t be hard to fit.

I’m guessing he’d be most in demand if he became available, despite his age.

I think the return will be fine on paper, but what the Hawks are trying to do right now, moving Keith likely isn't going to do that...I think a solid 1st round pick for 2019 and a top 50 prospect in the league is a nice add for a player with only a few years left...but that is not what McD, Rocky, and Stan are saying they want to do. Still trying to win now and rebuild/retool...I just don't see how moving Keith accomplishes that to be honest.

As Kurosis said, it would need to be a WOW move...2019 1st, 2019 2nd, and a kid playing in the NHL right now on defense....a player like Sanheim or Girard...young enough but not totally green. something like that makes sense for me to entertain a move.

 

[Robsker]

You will have to pry Keith from my cold dead hands if you want to trade him. I'm sorry, I can't be rational about this.

I would think that the probability of Keith getting traded is almost absolute zero. Worry not.

 

[hawksfan50]

Dream scenario:

1.Get #1 2019via lotto win.

2.Trade (Jack Highes) this #1 to TB for Brayden Point (will cost TB $8.0 to sign and they will be up the creek because they have 3 starting dmen all going Ufa and if they let them go to spend on Point for that cap hit they have got to basically fill the 3 starting d replacements at probably NHL minimums AND THEN their D is screwed.

Include Keith in the deal and we retain $1 million per ..so he only cap hits them at justvover $4 million per ..

Throw in Schnaltzwho they can bridge cheap for 2-3 years since he is struggling this season for us but still flashes potential to do well on a better team.

Throw-in Murphy or Forsli.ng ...whichever their cap cam handle ..
Or both if they can handle it. .

Give us back Point ,Taylor Raddysh ,Elvis Mirzlikins and a 2020 first rounder (likely late first but in an exceptionally deep draft).


Trade CC for another 2020 first and some other good prospect from a team wanting goaltending.


We must re-allocate and re-build..Let us use what we can to find the right trade partners and full our needs and cap space going forward with the correct allocations .

 

[BK]

Dream scenario:

1.Get #1 2019via lotto win.

2.Trade (Jack Highes) this #1 to TB for Brayden Point (will cost TB $8.0 to sign and they will be up the creek because they have 3 starting dmen all going Ufa and if they let them go to spend on Point for that cap hit they have got to basically fill the 3 starting d replacements at probably NHL minimums AND THEN their D is screwed.

Include Keith in the deal and we retain $1 million per ..so he only cap hits them at justvover $4 million per ..

Throw in Schnaltzwho they can bridge cheap for 2-3 years since he is struggling this season for us but still flashes potential to do well on a better team.

Throw-in Murphy or Forsli.ng ...whichever their cap cam handle ..
Or both if they can handle it. .

Give us back Point ,Taylor Raddysh ,Elvis Mirzlikins and a 2020 first rounder (likely late first but in an exceptionally deep draft).


Trade CC for another 2020 first and some other good prospect from a team wanting goaltending.


We must re-allocate and re-build..Let us use what we can to find the right trade partners and full our needs and cap space going forward with the correct allocations .

WTF...this is your worst take....ever.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

I think the return will be fine on paper, but what the Hawks are trying to do right now, moving Keith likely isn't going to do that...I think a solid 1st round pick for 2019 and a top 50 prospect in the league is a nice add for a player with only a few years left...but that is not what McD, Rocky, and Stan are saying they want to do. Still trying to win now and rebuild/retool...I just don't see how moving Keith accomplishes that to be honest.

As Kurosis said, it would need to be a WOW move...2019 1st, 2019 2nd, and a kid playing in the NHL right now on defense....a player like Sanheim or Girard...young enough but not totally green. something like that makes sense for me to entertain a move.

Ya, I agree with your bottom part.

Also, do we believe Stan and McD are making the right call at the moment?

I feel like they keep citing the “just get in and anything can happen” rationale, and isn’t that a bit flawed? Like the 8th seed Predators were obviously much better than a typical 8, same with the Kings that were an 8 a few years back.

We usually know the most talented and deep teams, and in most cases those are the teams that end up advancing in the playoffs.

 

[AmericanDream]

WTF...this is your worst take....ever.

I just....I mean.....I really can't even type anymore....just shaking...need therapy....rubber room...playdoh level shit here..

Fiddy wants to win the #1 OV pick and trade it out for Brayden Point....Point is a solid player, but I am losing faith in humanity again, I truly am....

 

[RememberTheRoar]

I just....I mean.....I really can't even type anymore....just shaking...need therapy....rubber room...playdoh level **** here..

Fiddy wants to win the #1 OV pick and trade it out for Brayden Point....Point is a solid player, but I am losing faith in humanity again, I truly am....

I don’t understand how he could think that’s a “dream scenario”

 

[BK]

I don’t understand how he could think that’s a “dream scenario”

 

[Callidusblackhawk]

I don’t understand how he could think that’s a “dream scenario”

Nightmares are dreams too....

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Nightmares are dreams too....

Haha I guess that is true.

 

[AmericanDream]

Nightmares are dreams too....

I guess I keep "waking" up to nightmares on HF of late....

 

[No Fun Shogun]

More like a fever dream scenario.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Ya, I agree with your bottom part.

Also, do we believe Stan and McD are making the right call at the moment?

I feel like they keep citing the “just get in and anything can happen” rationale, and isn’t that a bit flawed? Like the 8th seed Predators were obviously much better than a typical 8, same with the Kings that were an 8 a few years back.

We usually know the most talented and deep teams, and in most cases those are the teams that end up advancing in the playoffs.

Its to hold over the casual fan and get people to show up to games. They can’t fire Q and then admit the transition to JC is because they anticipate getting a lot younger and want him to coach the next wave. They might expect to compete for a playoff spot but if they were all in on it then last year’s first would have been gone along with that cap space.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Its to hold over the casual fan and get people to show up to games. They can’t fire Q and then admit the transition to JC is because they anticipate getting a lot younger and want him to coach the next wave. They might expect to compete for a playoff spot but if they were all in on it then last year’s first would have been gone along with that cap space.

Exactly, I don’t believe them when they say they’re trying to complete right now.

They’re trying to hide the fact that they’re doing a soft rebuild for the long term health of the franchise.

If they’re hanging onto players that they could move to make this team more competitive two to three years from now just so they can have a short-term marketing win, it’s a bad call.

If teams come to you offering a 1st, 2nd and a good young player for Keith and Crawford, I think you have to listen despite the potential short term hit.

This team can be very very good in 2-3 years the defense is loaded with young studs who can skate, and the forward group is a bunch of young guys plus still elite Kane.

If you’re not going all-in this offseason, I think I’d rather see them do this than stand pat and just wait for Keith and Crawford to break down.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Exactly, I don’t believe them when they say they’re trying to complete right now.

They’re trying to hide the fact that they’re doing a soft rebuild for the long term health of the franchise.

If they’re hanging onto players that they could move to make this team more competitive two to three years from now just so they can have a short-term marketing win, it’s a bad call.

If teams come to you offering a 1st, 2nd and a good young player for Keith and Crawford, I think you have to listen despite the potential short term hit.

This team can be very very good in 2-3 years the defense is loaded with young studs who can skate, and the forward group is a bunch of young guys plus still elite Kane.

If you’re not going all-in this offseason, I think I’d rather see them do this than stand pat and just wait for Keith and Crawford to break down.

Exactly. In an ideal world they can do a proper retool and be really good again in a few years but unfortunately this city has a hard time embracing change and in the case of the Hawks prioritizes nostalgia over winning. Remember how many people criticized Theo a year or two into their rebuild when it was the right decision 10 out of 10 times regardless if it worked.

This team doesn’t need a teardown though. They need to spend their abundance of cap effectively at forward and inject some more talented youth on D