Maximizing assets to shorten the rebuild by dealing off a guy unlikely to play a significant role when the Wings are good again. Mantha turns 26 this september. I think we're looking at, a bare minimum, 3 years to turn it around. Which would make it close to workable with Mantha as a 29 yr old, main contributor. If it takes 5 years? We're looking at a likely declining 31 year old Mantha. He might not be a bad player, but what if by trading him we could grab....I don't know, Holtz and Askarov? If the Wings walk out of this draft with something like Perfetti, Holtz, and Askarov I think they would be setting themselves up really well going forward.
It really just comes down to when everyone expects the Wings to be good again.
Agreed.Yes, but the #8 overall pick could be anything. It could even be someone as good as Anthony Mantha!
The fact is, Mantha looked awesome last year when he was on the ice. Just hang onto him. He won't be dead at 30. We'll need guys like him to actually start winning games in a few years.
I mean if you create a scenario where we get 2 top 10 draft picks for Mantha, then sure, it's on the table. But I don't think that offer will ever be on the table. And as a result, you're just punting on the hope you get someone as good as Mantha in a few years.
I don't see any reason to believe Mantha should dramatically lose his scoring over age 30. The skills he relies on aren't particularly related to speed or quickness. His skating should maintain, he has nice fundamentals.
I may be in the minority, but I'd absolutely build around Mantha. I think he's good enough to maintain a spot on the top PP and first line for any champion caliber team. He showed a ton last year with literally no support around him.
I get that and not saying I 100% disagree with it, I just hope (as a fan) if that is the route that Yzerman thinks yields the best longer term outlook, he signs Hoffman and Dadonov to replace lost offense
I still care about the team being involved in games at least a little bit, and hope for our young players that they are still hanging around in games in the later part of next regular season
IMO going into next season down Mantha after 17 wins would be a tough pill to swallow
If I'm Bertuzzi, Larkin, etc. I'm thinking "I need to hit UFA"
In five years is Mantha going to be as good as Mantha is now? Not just goal scoring, but his ability to occasionally take over games and move them to his will? And are the Wings going to need a player to do that in Mantha's spot to be a legit good team?
In five years, I think Mantha can probably still put points on the board (if he can stay healthy), but Shanny led the Wings in scoring in 02. Was he nearly as dominant a player on the ice as he was in 97? I don't think it was even close. So, yeah, we're definitely hoping to get someone as good as Mantha, but the key is those three or four years in age difference between them and when they are likely to be at their highest impact on the ice.
I'm also not sold on him aging as well as you are. While I think he'll still be able to get his points, big guys really don't seem to age well in the NHL. And with the direction the league has gone, that spells a lot of trouble if Mantha does lose any foot speed.
Has tremendous size and reach for the wing position, as well as good wheels for a big guy. Controls the puck effectively in the corners and possesses a good scoring touch. Is at his best when driving through traffic areas. At times, he stops moving his feet and becomes a little lazy on the ice. Should also use his massive size more frequently so as to become more intimidating to play against. Can go through important scoring slumps.
This won't be popular here but I think they should be looking at that anyway. Larkin might be, considering his current deal allows him to step straight into his UFA years.
I'm against a Mantha trade, but I'd entertain solid offers. Konecky level F & Dprospect/Dman+ 7&8th + cap dump.nah I would want a better return than the 8th or 9th best 18 year old not yet in the NHL.
The red wings have a big problem though. Becasue the wings waited so long to officially rebuild there is a pretty significant age gap between players like Seider and Hronik and Mantha and Larkin
Mantha and Larkin are going to hit their pay days before Sider and Hronik even hit their max potential stride. Mantha and Larkin could actually be veteran depth by the time this team actually has a stanley cup core.
I am not completely opposed to the thought of moving Mantha, however it needs to be a significant piece to our core that is more in line with the rebuilding time frame of 18-20 year olds.
Maybe I give it to you with Mantha, but not with Larkin. Zadina is 20 years old, Larkin is 23. We're not talking an 18 year old and a 28 year old here. You can't get too cute and hope that all your players are the exact same age, its never going to happen.
I agree but there is also kind of a weird generation gap in our core. But its not outlandish if my statement came off that way. Kane and Towes are 4 years apart so its not a bad spread. When rebuilding its nice to have cap in the bank for the restricted free agent days but we are likely going to have our top 2 paid players also be our oldest. Again not the end of the world just something to note.
unrelated to core/ age talk but Kane and Toews are both 88s
Buffalo picks 8th and New Jersey picks 7th. Both teams are further along in their rebuild than Detroit, but still have significant holes to fill.
Mantha would likely be the best winger on either team (I would say for sure on NJ). He carries some risk with his injury history, but that could be presented as an opportunity to sign him long term at potentially a significant discount. For Detroit, you wouldn't get to maximize his best years as you won't be competing as a top team in the league for quite a few seasons yet. For either of those franchises, you already have some young, elite talent and could benefit from a player like Mantha right away AND during a highly competitive window.
So, who says no if Mantha is offered for either of those picks? How much more would you add if you're Yzerman?
Mantha is a nice player to have in our core for the next 7-8 years. If we ever want to get out of a rebuild we should avoid trading our good players.
But, yzerman traded Athanasiou for a couple bags of pucks. So who knows?
I think we would have to do a really bad job for Larkin to leave. I can see it happening, less so with Yzerman in town who will have a lot of equity with Larkin, his family, friends and the dressing room.
We will see, he is the one I have the hardest time believing will go. But he is one of the most competitive people on earth so if he doesn't believe the plan well... Keep in mind they are slapping the C on him this fall.
I think Mantha will age well. I think if we cannot turn it around quickly we are wasting a player that will play his best hockey in the post-season in Bertuzzi. He is a guy that if I am a contender I go hard after if he is available. We will have to see what Mantha and Bertuzzi do contract wise though.
Are we talking about the same Kane and Toews? Kane is a late 88 birthday, hence going in 07. Where as Toews is an earlier birthdate, hence 06 draft.I agree but there is also kind of a weird generation gap in our core. But its not outlandish if my statement came off that way. Kane and Towes are 4 years apart so its not a bad spread. When rebuilding its nice to have cap in the bank for the restricted free agent days but we are likely going to have our top 2 paid players also be our oldest. Again not the end of the world just something to note.