Value of: Tyler Toffoli

[SFKingshomer]

The Coleman deal has nothing to do with Toffoli and his value is still a 2nd and decent prospect.

 

[tomd]

How do you know he wants to stay? Should the Kings risk losing Toffoli for nothing? What if he doesn't want to spend the next three years on a rebuilding team? What will a 30-year-old Toffoli be worth?

It's crazy that "the 27 year-old version of Toffoli is demonstrably worse than the 22 year-old version" given that the 27 year-old version has six more goals and five more points in four fewer games so far on a much, much worse team. This Kings team isn't even on pace to score 200 goals, fewer than last season's 202, good for second-worst in the league both years. Toffoli's on pace for 25 goals on a trash team with underachieving linemates. I wonder what he could do in an offensive-minded system with a pass-first center? Is it any surprise that playing with Kopitar instead of Carter has improved his goal totals? Until the new year, he was trying to carry guys like Michael Amadio and Matt Luff.

Toffoli was quoted very recently saying that he wants to stay. TM seems to want him to stay. Blake seems to have no interest in him staying.

It seems weird to me that if Toffoli wants to stay that fans wouldn’t want to keep him if he is still the player he was at 22. Imagine him next year with Vilardi or the year after with Turcotte. Yet I’ve not heard one Kings fan lobby to resign him instead of trade him. Why is that?

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Toffoli was quoted very recently saying that he wants to stay. TM seems to want him to stay. Blake seems to have no interest in him staying.

It seems weird to me that if Toffoli wants to stay that fans wouldn’t want to keep him if he is still the player he was at 22. Imagine him next year with Vilardi or the year after with Turcotte. Yet I’ve not heard one Kings fan lobby to resign him instead of trade him. Why is that?

Intentionally obtuse, or just ignorant? I can't tell which one, but...the reason why most Kings fan would rather trade him, is because the assets he can get back, will be more helpful to win the cup, than keeping Toffoli. The assets he can get back fit more in line with Vilardi, Turcotte, Kupari, Kalyiev etc. Toffoli as a player is absolutely fine, he can score, he kills penalties, his board work is fine. If he was 22, this isn't a discussion, Or if the Kings were less than 2 years away from competing, not a discussion, but the fact is, what he returns, can be worth more.

 

[Dbrownss]

Toffoli was quoted very recently saying that he wants to stay. TM seems to want him to stay. Blake seems to have no interest in him staying.

It seems weird to me that if Toffoli wants to stay that fans wouldn’t want to keep him if he is still the player he was at 22. Imagine him next year with Vilardi or the year after with Turcotte. Yet I’ve not heard one Kings fan lobby to resign him instead of trade him. Why is that?

That's player etiquette 101. They always want to stay....till they are gone.

 

[tomd]

Intentionally obtuse, or just ignorant? I can't tell which one, but...the reason why most Kings fan would rather trade him, is because the assets he can get back, will be more helpful to win the cup, than keeping Toffoli. The assets he can get back fit more in line with Vilardi, Turcotte, Kupari, Kalyiev etc. Toffoli as a player is absolutely fine, he can score, he kills penalties, his board work is fine. If he was 22, this isn't a discussion, Or if the Kings were less than 2 years away from competing, not a discussion, but the fact is, what he returns, can be worth more.

So you'd be happy with a pick in the 55-61 range and prospect that probably tops out as a 3rd liner? Because that is likely what you'll get in return for Toffoli. That draft pick has about of 30-40% chance of ever playing as a regular in the NHL.

Now, if you tell me that the Kings shouldn't trade Toffoli for less than a 1st or a really good NHL ready prospect then that makes more sense. If you tell me you'll be pissed if the return is only a late 2nd and a B prospect then that would make sense. But I'm not hearing that from anyone right now.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

So you'd be happy with a pick in the 55-61 range and prospect that probably tops out as a 3rd liner? Because that is likely what you'll get in return for Toffoli. That draft pick has about of 30-40% chance of ever playing as a regular in the NHL.

Now, if you tell me that the Kings shouldn't trade Toffoli for less than a 1st or a really good NHL ready prospect then that makes more sense. If you tell me you'll be pissed if the return is only a late 2nd and a B prospect then that would make sense. But I'm not hearing that from anyone right now.

I believe Toffoli returns a 1st plus.....

 

[KingCanadain1976]

So you'd be happy with a pick in the 55-61 range and prospect that probably tops out as a 3rd liner? Because that is likely what you'll get in return for Toffoli. That draft pick has about of 30-40% chance of ever playing as a regular in the NHL.

Now, if you tell me that the Kings shouldn't trade Toffoli for less than a 1st or a really good NHL ready prospect then that makes more sense. If you tell me you'll be pissed if the return is only a late 2nd and a B prospect then that would make sense. But I'm not hearing that from anyone right now.

The kings 2nd round pick around 33-35 and a pick in the 55 -61 range as u put it might be enough to move up to 27 or so in this years draft and get someone that has fallen a bit. The kings use extra picks every year to move up in the draft so get off your high horse and think a little before being a richard

 

[tomd]

I believe Toffoli returns a 1st plus.....

So you will be pissed if he doesn't get that return? I'm just trying to understand what a "good" or "bad" Toffoli trade looks like in the minds of Kings fans.

 

[tomd]

The kings 2nd round pick around 33-35 and a pick in the 55 -61 range as u put it might be enough to move up to 27 or so in this years draft and get someone that has fallen a bit. The kings use extra picks every year to move up in the draft so get off your high horse and think a little before being a richard

Those types of trade up deals don't happen very often and you certainly can't count on it to happen. So, again the question...if the Kings received a late 2nd round pick and a B prospect for Toffoli, is that enough? Or should they just resign him if the market for a 1st isn't there? It's an honest question.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

So you will be pissed if he doesn't get that return? I'm just trying to understand what a "good" or "bad" Toffoli trade looks like in the minds of Kings fans.

Pissed? No.....underwhelmed, probably, but it depends on the return, you want to view it in a vacuum, I view it in real life. I do believe Toffoli is worth a 1st plus, to contending teams, but I'm not the one trading for him etc. I do believe however what you see is 5-6 contending teams what want that winger, and when Kreider goes, the remaining teams will panic, and up their offer for Toffoli, I don't expect him to be traded until halfway through deadline day, unless Kreider is dealt ridiculously early.

A good Toffoli deal nets the team multiple assets that they can use to upgrade or develop their prospect base.

A bad Toffoli deal, doesn't.

 

[KingCanadain1976]

Those types of trade up deals don't happen very often and you certainly can't count on it to happen. So, again the question...if the Kings received a late 2nd round pick and a B prospect for Toffoli, is that enough? Or should they just resign him if the market for a 1st isn't there? It's an honest question.

the kings move up in the draft every year if u were any kinda king fan u would know this but u only want to put out negative bs Also this is supposed to be a strong draft. It is being compared to the 2003 draft so i will say there will a toffolish quality player there in the 50s if that is as high of a pick as we get for him However i believe we would move it to go higher or get a higher pick the in 50s

 

[tomd]

the kings move up in the draft every year if u were any kinda king fan u would know this but u only want to put out negative bs Also this is supposed to be a strong draft. It is being compared to the 2003 draft so i will say there will a toffolish quality player there in the 50s if that is as high of a pick as we get for him However i believe we would move it to go higher or get a higher pick the in 50s

When was the last time the Kings moved up into the FIRST round?

 

[bruins4thecup65]

Toffolli is not Wayne Gretzky

I doubt he fetches much for a non motivated UFA

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Toffolli is not Wayne Gretzky

I doubt he fetches much for a non motivated UFA

WTF is a non motivated UFA?

 

[bruins4thecup65]

WTF is a non motivated UFA?

Someone who is lazy as **** and doesn’t give a crap. His compete level is on the lower end. I wouldn’t touch him with a ten foot pole

 

[KingCanadain1976]

When was the last time the Kings moved up into the FIRST round?

when was the last time they had two 2nd rounds picks around what they will this year? Last year we moved up to get Fagemo extra picks in whatever round can be used to move up is and will always be my point . SO what about everything else i said nothing to whine about there

 

[tomd]

Pissed? No.....underwhelmed, probably, but it depends on the return, you want to view it in a vacuum, I view it in real life. I do believe Toffoli is worth a 1st plus, to contending teams, but I'm not the one trading for him etc. I do believe however what you see is 5-6 contending teams what want that winger, and when Kreider goes, the remaining teams will panic, and up their offer for Toffoli, I don't expect him to be traded until halfway through deadline day, unless Kreider is dealt ridiculously early.

A good Toffoli deal nets the team multiple assets that they can use to upgrade or develop their prospect base.

A bad Toffoli deal, doesn't.

Fair enough. I just find it strikingly odd that nowhere in the discussion is there any contemplation that the Kings should try to resign Toffoli to a long term deal. At 27 he is entering his prime and if (as Kings fan often tell me) he can still be counted on to score 25-30 goals per year, why not sign him? Especially when he could be playing with guys like Vilardi or Turcotte as soon as next year. The idea that Toffoli doesn't fit the next "window" is ridiculous because then that means Kopitar and Doughty don't either. I would hope that you have enough faith in Blake to get the Kings back into playoff contention in the next 2-3 years.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Someone who is lazy as **** and doesn’t give a crap. His compete level is on the lower end. I wouldn’t touch him with a ten foot pole

LMFAO well at least you clarified that you don't watch him......thank you for that.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Fair enough. I just find it strikingly odd that nowhere in the discussion is there any contemplation that the Kings should try to resign Toffoli to a long term deal. At 27 he is entering his prime and if (as Kings fan often tell me) he can still be counted on to score 25-30 goals per year, why not sign him? Especially when he could be playing with guys like Vilardi or Turcotte as soon as next year. The idea that Toffoli doesn't fit the next "window" is ridiculous because then that means Kopitar and Doughty don't either. I would hope that you have enough faith in Blake to get the Kings back into playoff contention in the next 2-3 years.

First of all, did you really just compare Toffoli to Kopitar and Doughty? Cmon, and you want people to take you seriously??

It's not just about playoff contention....

 

[tomd]

when was the last time they had two 2nd rounds picks around what they will this year? Last year we moved up to get Fagemo extra picks in whatever round can be used to move up is and will always be my point . SO what about everything else i said nothing to whine about there

But you'll be happy if the Kings can't move up and use the selection in the 55-61 range for Toffoli, right? The priority is to get assets even if it is a late 2nd and a B prospect. I get it.

 

[tomd]

First of all, did you really just compare Toffoli to Kopitar and Doughty? Cmon, and you want people to take you seriously??

It's not just about playoff contention....

LOL...no I didn't. But if Toffoli at 27 doesn't fit the next Kings window, what does that say about Kopitar at 32 and Doughty at 30?

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

LOL...no I didn't. But if Toffoli at 27 doesn't fit the next Kings window, what does that say about Kopitar at 32 and Doughty at 30?

It says that Doughty and Kopitar are in a completely different class of talent.....the fact that that needs to be explained to you, is somewhat daunting and scary at the same time.

Again, it's not that Toffoli doesn't fit the next window, is that what he can return, FITS BETTER. Pretty simple concept.

 

[tomd]

It says that Doughty and Kopitar are in a completely different class of talent.....the fact that that needs to be explained to you, is somewhat daunting and scary at the same time.

Again, it's not that Toffoli doesn't fit the next window, is that what he can return, FITS BETTER. Pretty simple concept.

That's fine but I just can't believe a late 2nd and a B prospect "fits better". To each his own though.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

That's fine but I just can't believe a late 2nd and a B prospect "fits better". To each his own though.

Can't help you there, you keep on this late 2nd and B prospect......I'm mostly positive that it's going to be a late 1st plus.....that might be the difference, you have no idea what it takes to score in the NHL.....I do.

 

[KingCanadain1976]

But you'll be happy if the Kings can't move up and use the selection in the 55-61 range for Toffoli, right? The priority is to get assets even if it is a late 2nd and a B prospect. I get it.

Late 2nd pick in one of the best drafts in this century and a B prospect yes i would be absolutely be happy to get this for B - player in Toffoli This club needs to get younger and faster and this trade would do it.