TSN 690 & Other Montreal sports media Thread V

[Kriss E]

Marinaro with the character assassination over Price not saluting the fans?

Who gives a flying ****.

Jesus christ.

I don't really care, but I can see his point.

You just signed for 84M, ya, your season was tough, but fans have absolutely f***ing nothing to cheer for this year. They still show up to watch this pathetic excuse of hockey display dishing out big cash for tickets and expensive cheap nasty food. The least you can do is throw your hand in the air and salute the fans. Even if they are booing as you are saluting them, this is the only way fans get to showcase their discontent with a player or a team. Suck it up. You're off to 4-6 weeks vacation, on a bed of money, doing whatever you damn well please to do, buying whatever you want to buy, a luxury very few people in this world have....so really...Just give a fan salute. It's not that hard.

Personally, as I said, I don't care. But I can see the point.

 

[Laurentide]

Is he doing this again today? He was making a much bigger deal out of that yesterday than it really is since I don't think anyone really cares. Yesterday while trying to make this a big deal he said I don't want to drive Carey Price out of town. Well then just shut up about it Tony.

It seems like it's the PK thing all over again with Tony who did a 180 on PK and didn't have much good to say about PK in the 3 or 4 months before he was traded along with his buddy Nilan.

I don't think they crapped on PK, they merely told it like it was. He had friends in the room and he had plenty of, perhaps not "enemies" as that's too strong a word, but non-fans of his antics let's say. But anyone who thinks that PK was an innocent bystander to events happening in his own life is naïve. PK didn't get traded; PK got PK traded. He knew exactly what he was doing and exactly which pin to pull on which grenade to get it done. And in some respects I can't say I blame him for wanting out. And kudos to him for figuring out a way to get what he wanted without having to take the heat from fans or media. He was able to get out of Montreal and leave the Habs holding the public relations nightmare. Well played on his part, although Habs management are easy to play because they are so predictably reactionary.

 

[Kriss E]

I don't think they crapped on PK, they merely told it like it was. He had friends in the room and he had plenty of, perhaps not "enemies" as that's too strong a word, but non-fans of his antics let's say. But anyone who thinks that PK was an innocent bystander to events happening in his own life is naïve. PK didn't get traded; PK got PK traded. He knew exactly what he was doing and exactly which pin to pull on which grenade to get it done. And in some respects I can't say I blame him for wanting out. And kudos to him for figuring out a way to get what he wanted without having to take the heat from fans or media. He was able to get out of Montreal and leave the Habs holding the public relations nightmare. Well played on his part, although Habs management are easy to play because they are so predictably reactionary.

That is complete BS.
Therrien is probably the only one who really had an issue with him. From there, you have guys who follow the coach and probably got frustrated PK didn't simply follow suit. You had some other guys that probably believed Subban was right, and you also have some that didn't give two craps.
But at the end of the day, I do not believe for one second that there was a player on the team who was so annoyed by PK they wished for him to be traded.
It makes no sense at all.

 

[PhysicX]

I don't think they crapped on PK, they merely told it like it was. He had friends in the room and he had plenty of, perhaps not "enemies" as that's too strong a word, but non-fans of his antics let's say. But anyone who thinks that PK was an innocent bystander to events happening in his own life is naïve. PK didn't get traded; PK got PK traded. He knew exactly what he was doing and exactly which pin to pull on which grenade to get it done. And in some respects I can't say I blame him for wanting out. And kudos to him for figuring out a way to get what he wanted without having to take the heat from fans or media. He was able to get out of Montreal and leave the Habs holding the public relations nightmare. Well played on his part, although Habs management are easy to play because they are so predictably reactionary.

Complete and utter bullshit.

PK didn't get PK traded. MB and GM (we have to add Molson in the mix now) thought the Stanley Cup window was open (MB even said so, before backtracking a year or so later) and once they got the phone call from Poile, they decided Man Mountain Weber would be the perfect return for Subban, as he is a great defenceman and supposedly a great leader. Instead of waiting for Subban to mature and accept his on- and off-ice antics, they pulled the trigger.

This, among other things, led us to where we are now.

 

[Laurentide]

Believe what you want but I refuse to believe that Subban is just some hapless victim here. He was smarter than the guys who traded him. They did exactly what he wanted them to do.

Don't come and tell me that PK could do what he did with that hospital donation (without telling anyone ahead of time and basically doing an end run around the Habs organization which has a charitable foundation with an entire bureaucracy set up to handle such things) and be dumb/naïve enough to think that it would be cool with his bosses. It was a provocation, pure and simple. A provocation designed to elicit a certain response, like showing a red cape to a bull. Subban knew exactly and precisely what would happen when he did it and that's why he did it. The second he showed up for that photo op at the children's hospital his fate was sealed and he knew it.

 

[417]

Believe what you want but I refuse to believe that Subban is just some hapless victim here. He was smarter than the guys who traded him. They did exactly what he wanted them to do.

Don't come and tell me that PK could do what he did with that hospital donation (without telling anyone ahead of time and basically doing an end run around the Habs organization which has a charitable foundation with an entire bureaucracy set up to handle such things) and be dumb/naïve enough to think that it would be cool with his bosses. It was a provocation, pure and simple. A provocation designed to elicit a certain response, like showing a red cape to a bull. Subban knew exactly and precisely what would happen when he did it and that's why he did it. The second he showed up for that photo op at the children's hospital his fate was sealed and he knew it.

I applaud your courage for posting this

 

[Captain Mountain]

Believe what you want but I refuse to believe that Subban is just some hapless victim here. He was smarter than the guys who traded him. They did exactly what he wanted them to do.

Don't come and tell me that PK could do what he did with that hospital donation (without telling anyone ahead of time and basically doing an end run around the Habs organization which has a charitable foundation with an entire bureaucracy set up to handle such things) and be dumb/naïve enough to think that it would be cool with his bosses. It was a provocation, pure and simple. A provocation designed to elicit a certain response, like showing a red cape to a bull. Subban knew exactly and precisely what would happen when he did it and that's why he did it. The second he showed up for that photo op at the children's hospital his fate was sealed and he knew it.

There's a yawning chasm between "Subban is some hapless victim" and Subban making them do "exactly what he wanted them to do".

There are a variety of reasons why someone like Subban would want to set up his own charity instead of going through the Canadiens ranging from altruistic (control over direction of the use of funds) to selfish (tax incentives and brand management). If the Habs issue was that he made his contribution through their Charitable foundation, then they better punt Gallagher out of town, since he has own Charitable Foundation that operates independently too.

 

[WeThreeKings]

I heard Subban showed up late to 18 meetings with sick kids.

 

[417]

There's a yawning chasm between "Subban is some hapless victim" and Subban making them do "exactly what he wanted them to do".

There are a variety of reasons why someone like Subban would want to set up his own charity instead of going through the Canadiens ranging from altruistic (control over direction of the use of funds) to selfish (tax incentives and brand management). If the Habs issue was that he made his contribution through their Charitable foundation, then they better punt Gallagher out of town, since he has own Charitable Foundation that operates independently too.

While this is true...

Are there also many reasons why he wouldn't tell them he was doing it?

 

[Captain Mountain]

While this is true...

Are there also many reasons why he wouldn't tell them he was doing it?

First of all, he's under absolutely no obligation to tell them of what causes he chooses to donate too. And typically, NHL players don't disclose their charitable activities unless they would involve the team.

And even if that wasn't the case, reasons could range from intentional to incidental.

We can refrain from casting Subban as an innocent AND some machiavellian schemer.

 

[Laurentide]

I applaud your courage for posting this

It shouldn't take courage to post something so obvious. Some people feel it necessary to have heroes and villains in every narrative. If they don't paint Subban as pure and virtuous in thought, word and deed then they feel as though they are somehow legitimizing Bergevin's actions. One doesn't have to mean the other. It is possible to admit that Subban engineered his own ouster and still hate Bergevin/Molson for doing the deed. Subban's actions don't excuse Bergevin's. But for some people the Subban trade is a zero-sum game. Subban must be pure and Bergevin must be dirty and Weber must be the fruit of a poisonous tree. It becomes a purity test for some posters. You say that PK has shortcomings or that Weber is elite and it makes you a Bergevin apologist in the eyes of some.

 

[gunnerdom]

Deleted - Just realized I was answering a very old post.

 

[417]

First of all, he's under absolutely no obligation to tell them of what causes he chooses to donate too. And typically, NHL players don't disclose their charitable activities unless they would involve the team.

Are you sure about that?

I'm not, sure, but you seem sure, so I just want to confirm...because there are a TON of "charitable" causes out there that any individual could contribute too. Some of them, the NHL and it's clubs, may not want to have a member of their team affiliated with (talking generally here, not specifically for Subban).

So I would find it odd that players, aren't required to divulge to their teams or at least run it by them, who they're making charitable donations too. Not to mention, that this isn't the typical 'donation'...

But if you're right, then OK, he's under no obligation.....but I can see why, it would cause friction with the team, if that's the way it went down.

And even if that wasn't the case, reasons could range from intentional to incidental.

I never said it was intentional or incidental...I didn't qualify it any way, it was just a question in response to your post.

We can refrain from casting Subban as an innocent AND some machiavellian schemer.

I haven't casted him as anything - but as usual, with ANYTHING related to PK Subban, i'm sure it's going to turn into something bigger.

 

[417]

It shouldn't take courage to post something so obvious. Some people feel it necessary to have heroes and villains in every narrative. If they don't paint Subban as pure and virtuous in thought, word and deed then they feel as though they are somehow legitimizing Bergevin's actions. One doesn't have to mean the other. It is possible to admit that Subban engineered his own ouster and still hate Bergevin/Molson for doing the deed. Subban's actions don't excuse Bergevin's. But for some people the Subban trade is a zero-sum game. Subban must be pure and Bergevin must be dirty and Weber must be the fruit of a poisonous tree. It becomes a purity test for some posters. You say that PK has shortcomings or that Weber is elite and it makes you a Bergevin apologist in the eyes of some.

PREACH!

 

[Genesis76]

I don't think they crapped on PK, they merely told it like it was. He had friends in the room and he had plenty of, perhaps not "enemies" as that's too strong a word, but non-fans of his antics let's say. But anyone who thinks that PK was an innocent bystander to events happening in his own life is naïve. PK didn't get traded; PK got PK traded. He knew exactly what he was doing and exactly which pin to pull on which grenade to get it done. And in some respects I can't say I blame him for wanting out. And kudos to him for figuring out a way to get what he wanted without having to take the heat from fans or media. He was able to get out of Montreal and leave the Habs holding the public relations nightmare. Well played on his part, although Habs management are easy to play because they are so predictably reactionary.

Are you bryan wilde? Because hes a moron who seeks attention.

What a bunch of BS

All you’re doing is spewing garbage, you have zero sources. Gtfo

 

[Genesis76]

That is complete BS.
Therrien is probably the only one who really had an issue with him. From there, you have guys who follow the coach and probably got frustrated PK didn't simply follow suit. You had some other guys that probably believed Subban was right, and you also have some that didn't give two craps.
But at the end of the day, I do not believe for one second that there was a player on the team who was so annoyed by PK they wished for him to be traded.
It makes no sense at all.

When Markov wants to make love to your helmet publicly, you’re good.

 

[Laurentide]

Perhaps there was nothing written down mandating that players go through the auspices of the club whenever doing public charity work (although I'm sure it's written down now!) the point is that Subban knew, or ought to have known, that making such a move, seemingly out of the blue and with no prior notification to the club by which he was employed, was going to cause a problem from a public relations standpoint if nothing else. It made the Habs look foolish because they were the last to know. Instead of PK telling the Habs what he wanted to do ahead of time, he let them read about it in the papers. If you don't think that equates to a clear provocation on his part, or that PK was just naïve about how these things work then I'm sorry but you're just too far gone to argue with.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Pk got pk traded

We have the worst management group in the Nhl but of course pk got himself traded

 

[Genesis76]

Believe what you want but I refuse to believe that Subban is just some hapless victim here. He was smarter than the guys who traded him. They did exactly what he wanted them to do.

Don't come and tell me that PK could do what he did with that hospital donation (without telling anyone ahead of time and basically doing an end run around the Habs organization which has a charitable foundation with an entire bureaucracy set up to handle such things) and be dumb/naïve enough to think that it would be cool with his bosses. It was a provocation, pure and simple. A provocation designed to elicit a certain response, like showing a red cape to a bull. Subban knew exactly and precisely what would happen when he did it and that's why he did it. The second he showed up for that photo op at the children's hospital his fate was sealed and he knew it.

Where are your sources Brian Wylde?

 

[417]

Perhaps there was nothing written down mandating that players go through the auspices of the club whenever doing public charity work (although I'm sure it's written down now!) the point is that Subban knew, or ought to have known, that making such a move, seemingly out of the blue and with no prior notification to the club by which he was employed, was going to cause a problem from a public relations standpoint if nothing else. It made the Habs look foolish because they were the last to know. Instead of PK telling the Habs what he wanted to do ahead of time, he let them read about it in the papers. If you don't think that equates to a clear provocation on his part, or that PK was just naïve about how these things work then I'm sorry but you're just too far gone to argue with.

This could of all been avoided had PK just pledged to raise 10M for the Human Fund

 

[Laurentide]

Are you bryan wilde? Because hes a moron who seeks attention.

What a bunch of BS

All you’re doing is spewing garbage, you have zero sources. Gtfo

It's as credible a view as yours. More credible, in fact because my thesis presumes that Subban is not some clueless rube who didn't know that what he was doing would cause a problem. I give him more credit for knowing how things work than you do, apparently.

 

[Genesis76]

I heard Subban showed up late to 18 meetings with sick kids.

Oh noooooo everyone call 911!!!

 

[Laurentide]

This could of all been avoided had PK just pledged to raise 10M for the Human Fund

Or "La Societe Pour la Prevention des Mauvaises Attitudes

 

[Captain Mountain]

Are you sure about that?

I'm not, sure, but you seem sure, so I just want to confirm...because there are a TON of "charitable" causes out there that any individual could contribute too. Some of them, the NHL and it's clubs, may not want to have a member of their team affiliated with (talking generally here, not specifically for Subban).

So I would find it odd that players, aren't required to divulge to their teams or at least run it by them, who they're making charitable donations too. Not to mention, that this isn't the typical 'donation'...

But if you're right, then OK, he's under no obligation.....but I can see why, it would cause friction with the team, if that's the way it went down.

I'm certain of Subban not needing to disclose charitable contributions. He may be contractually notified to tell them who he represents (i.e. that he was planning to appear at the hospital and speak in support of it), but the Habs could get into a sticky legal situation if they compelled him to disclose more than that.

I never said it was intentional or incidental...I didn't qualify it any way, it was just a question in response to your post.

Ok? I wasn't implying anything.

I haven't casted him as anything - but as usual, with ANYTHING related to PK Subban, i'm sure it's going to turn into something bigger.

I never said you were casting him as anything.

 

[optimus2861]

Perhaps there was nothing written down mandating that players go through the auspices of the club whenever doing public charity work (although I'm sure it's written down now!)

If it's not part of the CBA, it can't be written down in any enforceable form. And the word "charity" appears precisely once in the entire text of the CBA, in reference to fines levied against a player in violation of Club Rules. Club Rules do not include directing players to engage or not engage in specific charitable activities.

The Canadiens are not empowered under the CBA to require that players under contract engage in charitable work only through their foundation. Any such requirement would be null & void.

But the Canadiens are a vindictive and petty organization and I've no doubt that Subban's donation did ruffle some feathers and start him on the road to being traded.