HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #85 - Offseason Editon

[The Gr8 Dane]

Huberdeau wouldn't last 4 games in this market

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Boeser with 12 goals, could have acquired him last January for nil. Most on this board didn't want him. Monahan our leading scorer with 6

Enjoy the wins don't be down when they do, but...

The Habs 100% need to lose. They need some high-end talent, otherwise this team is just the Medicority Canadiens.

If you want to see the Habs be dominant and only lose 20-25 games a year, then you gotta suffer and hope the management makes right picks.

And to be honest my confidence isn't there.

 

[26Mats]

To CLB: Primeau and/or Ylonen
To MTL: Boqvist

 

[jrom]

Boeser with 12 goals, could have acquired him last January for nil. Most on this board didn't want him. Monahan our leading scorer with 6

They don’t bundle Hugues & Peterson if you acquire Boeser

 

[Sterling Archer]

And how would you do that with no cap space?

You’re asking for a solution to a scenario you haven’t given. How could anyone possibly answer that question?

If you’re asking in general, there are several ways to accomplish it, again, depending on the scenarios, players and teams envolved.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

You’re asking for a solution to a scenario you haven’t given. How could anyone possibly answer that question?

If you’re asking in general, there are several ways to accomplish it, again, depending on the scenarios and players envolved.

They don’t have the cap space to get a top goalie. And top goalies are difficult to get to begin with. They will have to look at second tier options.

Nothing is impossible but it would be extremely difficult for them to do it. I really don’t see how they can do anything but a minor upgrade.

 

[Sterling Archer]

They don’t have the cap space to get a top goalie. And top goalies are difficult to get to begin with. They will have to look at second tier options.

Nothing is impossible but it would be extremely difficult for them to do it. I really don’t see how they can do anything but a minor upgrade.

Teams at the cap make trades all the time. 3 way deals are more and more popular and Oilers have said they’re all in this year so they’re willing to pay to move salary.

If you can trade Karlsson, you can create cap to get a goalie.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Teams at the cap make trades all the time. 3 way deals are more and more popular and Oilers have said they’re all in this year so they’re willing to pay to move salary.

If you can trade Karlsson, you can create cap to get a goalie.

Sure. But there aren’t that many tier one goalies in the league to begin with.

I’ll never say anything is impossible (they could give up their next ten number one picks for example) but realistically it’s not going to happen. Availability plus cap issues…

 

[Sterling Archer]

Sure. But there aren’t that many tier one goalies in the league to begin with.

I’ll never say anything is impossible (they could give up their next ten number one picks for example) but realistically it’s not going to happen. Availability plus cap issues…

I never said they needed to get a top tier goalie, so please don't put words in my mouth. I said they need a no. 1 goalie because they have three no. 2's now.

Just because you think trades are hard, doesn't mean it can't happen. There are several goalies that can be had that are better than Campbell, Skinner and Pickard. Some we know of like Hart, some we don't because we're not GMs talking to other GMs about player availability. Oilers already spoke with several teams about goaltending, they just didn't want to get raked over the coals, so they chose to fire the coach as other GMs smelled blood in the water. Price was just too high, at the moment.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I never said they needed to get a top tier goalie, so please don't put words in my mouth. I said they need a no. 1 goalie because they have three no. 2's now.

Okay. Give some examples of what you’re thinking and who they can target.

Just because you think trades are hard, doesn't mean it can't happen.

I’m pretty sure I just said that. But… it ain’t easy. They have to find a partner who can take on bad cap or they need to make a separate trade to be able to do it. It’s a mess.

There are several goalies that can be had that are better than Campbell, Skinner and Pickard. Some we know of like Hart, some we don't because we're not GMs talking to other GMs about player availability. Oilers already spoke with several teams about goaltending, they just didn't want to get raked over the coals, so they chose to fire the coach as other GMs smelled blood in the water. Price was just too high, at the moment.

The price is going to stay high on number one goalies. And they don’t have time to wait for some teams to fall out of the race.

 

[SakuKoivu11]

Josh Anderson and Jesse Ylonen for Kappo Kakko and Barclay Goodrow.

 

[Sterling Archer]

Okay. Give some examples of what you’re thinking and who they can target.

I’m pretty sure I just said that. But… it ain’t easy. They have to find a partner who can take on bad cap or they need to make a separate trade to be able to do it. It’s a mess.

The price is going to stay high on number one goalies. And they don’t have time to wait for some teams to fall out of the race.

I did give examples.

Good than we’re in agreement.

I’m pretty sure I said that.

 

[The Great Weal]

Would be nice if we could get a decent linemate for Suzuki. Newhook and Anderson aren't it. Maybe we can sign Kane before flipping him at the deadline lol.

 

[Miller Time]

Would be nice if we could get a decent linemate for Suzuki. Newhook and Anderson aren't it.

This is why, as crazy and risky as it seems, figuring out a deal with the Flames for Huberdeau could be exactly what the Dr. ordered...

he's got the skill, skating and vision to play with Suzuki/CC and form an incredibly dangerous line. Habs d activation is far better suited to JH's game, and MSL is the kind of coach who can get the most out of a talent like Huberdeau imo.

With the Flames quite likely nearing desperation in terms of moving him and competing now, I think we can leverage enough futures out of them to balance the risk of Huberdeau's term/hit.

3x2nd + conditional 1st as the "risk mitigation" cost works for me.

Something like

To Calgary
Anderson, Armia, Price LTIR

To Mtl
Huberdeau (2.5M retained - 8M$ cap hit)
'24, '25, '26 2nd
conditional "27 1st (conditions attached to Huberdeau's productivity in '24-'25 and '25-'26... ie under .7ppg = '27 1st, under .8ppg = 2nd, under .9ppg = 3rd, above .9ppg = nothing)

Flames move on from the contract/term (though carry 2.5M in dead cap for the duration), give up 3 picks, plus a 1st if Hubby fails to get his career back on track in the new enviroment... and take on Price's LTIR which makes them have to juggle with that in the offseason - but their ownership might not mind as much as it would alleviate some of the offseason pressure to spend big in UFA over the next few years). They add two players who might fit well in their current system and add some bottom-6 depth to their roster.

Habs roll dice on Huberdeau returning to top-line caliber impact. Shed two undesireable vet contracts and get out from under Price's LTIR summer handcuffs.
Get 3-4 quality picks for the risk. The conditional 1st being the big factor should Huberdeau continute to shit the bed (2-3 years from now, that 1st + a bit of retention dropping his cap hit further should make him more easy to move him if that's what is required)

Riverboat gambler mode activated

 

[Deus ex machina]

This is why, as crazy and risky as it seems, figuring out a deal with the Flames for Huberdeau could be exactly what the Dr. ordered...

he's got the skill, skating and vision to play with Suzuki/CC and form an incredibly dangerous line. Habs d activation is far better suited to JH's game, and MSL is the kind of coach who can get the most out of a talent like Huberdeau imo.

With the Flames quite likely nearing desperation in terms of moving him and competing now, I think we can leverage enough futures out of them to balance the risk of Huberdeau's term/hit.

3x2nd + conditional 1st as the "risk mitigation" cost works for me.

Something like

To Calgary
Anderson, Armia, Price LTIR

To Mtl
Huberdeau (2.5M retained - 8M$ cap hit)
'24, '25, '26 2nd
conditional "27 1st (conditions attached to Huberdeau's productivity in '24-'25 and '25-'26... ie under .7ppg = '27 1st, under .8ppg = 2nd, under .9ppg = 3rd, above .9ppg = nothing)

Flames move on from the contract/term (though carry 2.5M in dead cap for the duration), give up 3 picks, plus a 1st if Hubby fails to get his career back on track in the new enviroment... and take on Price's LTIR which makes them have to juggle with that in the offseason - but their ownership might not mind as much as it would alleviate some of the offseason pressure to spend big in UFA over the next few years). They add two players who might fit well in their current system and add some bottom-6 depth to their roster.

Habs roll dice on Huberdeau returning to top-line caliber impact. Shed two undesireable vet contracts and get out from under Price's LTIR summer handcuffs.
Get 3-4 quality picks for the risk. The conditional 1st being the big factor should Huberdeau continute to shit the bed (2-3 years from now, that 1st + a bit of retention dropping his cap hit further should make him more easy to move him if that's what is required)

Riverboat gambler mode activated

What you are proposing is not worth the risk IMO.

Huberdeau seems to already have lost a step at 30. He will be almost 38 when his contract end.
If he doesn't return to his Florida form, he will be an anchor for the next 8 years and likely prevent the team to be a contender for that period.
No amount of futures can make up for that.
And i don't think he fits at all with the culture the Habs want to have. They just finally got rid of Drouin and Hoffman, i don't think they want to get another unidimensional player.

The only way i see this happening is if Calgary retains more money. He will not have an AAV over 7.8M with the Habs, that's for sure.
And Calgary will have to give up more than a bunch of 2nds.
And they will have to take back Gallagher, not Anderson. I know Anderson is in a slump now, but that doesn't mean he has an undesirable contract.

So, Calgary will have to get very desperate for that to happen.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

This is why, as crazy and risky as it seems, figuring out a deal with the Flames for Huberdeau could be exactly what the Dr. ordered...

he's got the skill, skating and vision to play with Suzuki/CC and form an incredibly dangerous line. Habs d activation is far better suited to JH's game, and MSL is the kind of coach who can get the most out of a talent like Huberdeau imo.

With the Flames quite likely nearing desperation in terms of moving him and competing now, I think we can leverage enough futures out of them to balance the risk of Huberdeau's term/hit.

3x2nd + conditional 1st as the "risk mitigation" cost works for me.

Something like

To Calgary
Anderson, Armia, Price LTIR

To Mtl
Huberdeau (2.5M retained - 8M$ cap hit)
'24, '25, '26 2nd
conditional "27 1st (conditions attached to Huberdeau's productivity in '24-'25 and '25-'26... ie under .7ppg = '27 1st, under .8ppg = 2nd, under .9ppg = 3rd, above .9ppg = nothing)

Flames move on from the contract/term (though carry 2.5M in dead cap for the duration), give up 3 picks, plus a 1st if Hubby fails to get his career back on track in the new enviroment... and take on Price's LTIR which makes them have to juggle with that in the offseason - but their ownership might not mind as much as it would alleviate some of the offseason pressure to spend big in UFA over the next few years). They add two players who might fit well in their current system and add some bottom-6 depth to their roster.

Habs roll dice on Huberdeau returning to top-line caliber impact. Shed two undesireable vet contracts and get out from under Price's LTIR summer handcuffs.
Get 3-4 quality picks for the risk. The conditional 1st being the big factor should Huberdeau continute to shit the bed (2-3 years from now, that 1st + a bit of retention dropping his cap hit further should make him more easy to move him if that's what is required)

Riverboat gambler mode activated

I wouldn’t take this gamble. He just makes way too much and it’s such a long contract too. And he’s struggling - imagine if he came here and put in the same performance. It’d be such a huge sideshow.

 

[Miller Time]

What you are proposing is not worth the risk IMO.

Huberdeau seems to already have lost a step at 30. He will be almost 38 when his contract end.
If he doesn't return to his Florida form, he will be an anchor for the next 8 years and likely prevent the team to be a contender for that period.
No amount of futures can make up for that.
And i don't think he fits at all with the culture the Habs want to have. They just finally got rid of Drouin and Hoffman, i don't think they want to get another unidimensional player.

The only way i see this happening is if Calgary retains more money. He will not have an AAV over 7.8M with the Habs, that's for sure.
And Calgary will have to give up more than a bunch of 2nds.
And they will have to take back Gallagher, not Anderson. I know Anderson is in a slump now, but that doesn't mean he has an undesirable contract.

So, Calgary will have to get very desperate for that to happen.

Fair enough.

I think 3x 2nd (all quite likely to be top 1/2 of the round), plus getting rid of Anderson/Armia/Price LTIR is ample compensation to test Huberdeau out, at 8M$, for the next 3.5 seasons.

He's an immediate upgrade from Anderson in our top 6 (the Drouin/Hoffman comparisons are way off. While he has struggled in Calgary, he isn't a flat-out liability or player that needs to be sheltered. The recent benching in the 3rd was more about not getting the top line impact they are paying him for, than it was about him being a liability the way Drouin/Hoffman are. Plus he's continued to be well regarded in the room/off-ice... the issue is not with his work ethic, he's just not the 10.5M/100+pt player Treviling paid him to be, he's an elite compliment not a line driver.)


If he doesn't work out, the additional 1st in '27 gives us an asset that would be handy in trying to offload his remaining 4 years. With the cap increasing, and his cap hit at 8M, it's quite more feasible to explore either a retention trade or a buyout should it come to that.

but the other side being ignored is the potential positive... his game isn't predicated on physical talent alone, so if he did find his groove playing with an up/coming Habs group that is geared around an activated d, it's quite feasible for him to regain close to a ppg level of play for the next few seasons, and as he declines, the increasing salary cap should soften the blow, as would the influx of ELC/RFA talent from the picks we got with him.

risky, yes, but any attempt at adding a legit top-6 (let alone top-line) veteran talent to accompany our young core getting into their prime is going to involve risk... trading for a less risky contract will costs a ton of assets, signing a UFA will mean gambling similarly on handing out term/high salary to outbid the market... without any assets coming back (and still needing to do something with Anderson's growing anchor).

if we are to add elite level talent to the top-6 core we are building, Hughes will need to gamble somewhere. Hopefully there's a better option that he finds, but Huberdeau is one worth exploring imo

I wouldn’t take this gamble. He just makes way too much and it’s such a long contract too.

fair

Nylander as a UFA this summer (should he make it) is an interesting alternative... though i imagine he will cost a contract similar to what's remaining on Huberdeau's deal.

Out of curiosity, would you consider adding Nylander at 7yr/10.5M a better risk to take? (1:1 to Huberdeau at 8M$ until '31, i'd agree... but when you add in the Anderson/Armia/Price offloading and the 3-4 picks addition, i think the balance swings personally....)

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Fair enough.

I think 3x 2nd (all quite likely to be top 1/2 of the round), plus getting rid of Anderson/Armia/Price LTIR is ample compensation to test Huberdeau out, at 8M$, for the next 3.5 seasons.

He's an immediate upgrade from Anderson in our top 6 (the Drouin/Hoffman comparisons are way off. While he has struggled in Calgary, he isn't a flat-out liability or player that needs to be sheltered. The recent benching in the 3rd was more about not getting the top line impact they are paying him for, than it was about him being a liability the way Drouin/Hoffman are. Plus he's continued to be well regarded in the room/off-ice... the issue is not with his work ethic, he's just not the 10.5M/100+pt player Treviling paid him to be, he's an elite compliment not a line driver.)


If he doesn't work out, the additional 1st in '27 gives us an asset that would be handy in trying to offload his remaining 4 years. With the cap increasing, and his cap hit at 8M, it's quite more feasible to explore either a retention trade or a buyout should it come to that.

but the other side being ignored is the potential positive... his game isn't predicated on physical talent alone, so if he did find his groove playing with an up/coming Habs group that is geared around an activated d, it's quite feasible for him to regain close to a ppg level of play for the next few seasons, and as he declines, the increasing salary cap should soften the blow, as would the influx of ELC/RFA talent from the picks we got with him.

risky, yes, but any attempt at adding a legit top-6 (let alone top-line) veteran talent to accompany our young core getting into their prime is going to involve risk... trading for a less risky contract will costs a ton of assets, signing a UFA will mean gambling similarly on handing out term/high salary to outbid the market... without any assets coming back (and still needing to do something with Anderson's growing anchor).

if we are to add elite level talent to the top-6 core we are building, Hughes will need to gamble somewhere. Hopefully there's a better option that he finds, but Huberdeau is one worth exploring imo


fair

Nylander as a UFA this summer (should he make it) is an interesting alternative... though i imagine he will cost a contract similar to what's remaining on Huberdeau's deal.

Out of curiosity, would you consider adding Nylander at 7yr/10.5M a better risk to take? (1:1 to Huberdeau at 8M$ until '31, i'd agree... but when you add in the Anderson/Armia/Price offloading and the 3-4 picks addition, i think the balance swings personally....)

I mean, it could work. It’s not like he’s not a great player. But I’m shell shocked from the Drouin trade and moves like it. It’s a heck of a lot easier to deal away Anderson than it would be with Huberdeau. Feels like he could be another Gomez.

 

[domiwroze]

Fair enough.

I think 3x 2nd (all quite likely to be top 1/2 of the round), plus getting rid of Anderson/Armia/Price LTIR is ample compensation to test Huberdeau out, at 8M$, for the next 3.5 seasons.

He's an immediate upgrade from Anderson in our top 6 (the Drouin/Hoffman comparisons are way off. While he has struggled in Calgary, he isn't a flat-out liability or player that needs to be sheltered. The recent benching in the 3rd was more about not getting the top line impact they are paying him for, than it was about him being a liability the way Drouin/Hoffman are. Plus he's continued to be well regarded in the room/off-ice... the issue is not with his work ethic, he's just not the 10.5M/100+pt player Treviling paid him to be, he's an elite compliment not a line driver.)


If he doesn't work out, the additional 1st in '27 gives us an asset that would be handy in trying to offload his remaining 4 years. With the cap increasing, and his cap hit at 8M, it's quite more feasible to explore either a retention trade or a buyout should it come to that.

but the other side being ignored is the potential positive... his game isn't predicated on physical talent alone, so if he did find his groove playing with an up/coming Habs group that is geared around an activated d, it's quite feasible for him to regain close to a ppg level of play for the next few seasons, and as he declines, the increasing salary cap should soften the blow, as would the influx of ELC/RFA talent from the picks we got with him.

risky, yes, but any attempt at adding a legit top-6 (let alone top-line) veteran talent to accompany our young core getting into their prime is going to involve risk... trading for a less risky contract will costs a ton of assets, signing a UFA will mean gambling similarly on handing out term/high salary to outbid the market... without any assets coming back (and still needing to do something with Anderson's growing anchor).

if we are to add elite level talent to the top-6 core we are building, Hughes will need to gamble somewhere. Hopefully there's a better option that he finds, but Huberdeau is one worth exploring imo


fair

Nylander as a UFA this summer (should he make it) is an interesting alternative... though i imagine he will cost a contract similar to what's remaining on Huberdeau's deal.

Out of curiosity, would you consider adding Nylander at 7yr/10.5M a better risk to take? (1:1 to Huberdeau at 8M$ until '31, i'd agree... but when you add in the Anderson/Armia/Price offloading and the 3-4 picks addition, i think the balance swings personally....)

I'd take Nylander over Hubby without hesitation. For one, you can @ me if i'm wrong, but there's no way Nylander lands a 10.5M contract. He'll be around 8.0 to 9.5M. Nylander for max years (7) would put him at 35yo, which is already way better than hubby 10.5M at 38.

I'm hopeful that he will reach the FA status and we will be amongst the teams that will reach out for him. He would fit right in, our RW is trash.

Huberdeau is bad for a 2nd year in a row, I wouldn't bet big on him. While Nylander has been PPG for the past 3 years.

 

[therocket9]

I'd take Nylander over Hubby without hesitation. For one, you can @ me if i'm wrong, but there's no way Nylander lands a 10.5M contract. He'll be around 8.0 to 9.5M. Nylander for max years (7) would put him at 35yo, which is already way better than hubby 10.5M at 38.

I'm hopeful that he will reach the FA status and we will be amongst the teams that will reach out for him. He would fit right in, our RW is trash.

Huberdeau is bad for a 2nd year in a row, I wouldn't bet big on him. While Nylander has been PPG for the past 3 years.

Nylander gets 11 million per probably more.

 

[Miller Time]

I'd take Nylander over Hubby without hesitation. For one, you can @ me if i'm wrong, but there's no way Nylander lands a 10.5M contract. He'll be around 8.0 to 9.5M. Nylander for max years (7) would put him at 35yo, which is already way better than hubby 10.5M at 38.

I'm hopeful that he will reach the FA status and we will be amongst the teams that will reach out for him. He would fit right in, our RW is trash.

Huberdeau is bad for a 2nd year in a row, I wouldn't bet big on him. While Nylander has been PPG for the past 3 years.

Deal.

I think the only way Nylander doesn't hit 10M+ is if he chooses to take a discount to stay with the Laffs...

Look at his production.
Look at the available UFA's this summer.
Look at the rare/unique massive cap increase this summer.

Put all that together and I'd say there's no way he doesn't hit 10M+ on the open market... just look at the top UFA fwd contract this past summer (Killorn, 6.25M/4yrs)... even without the ~5M cap increase, Nylander easily attracts 3-4M$ more/year imo... the extra cap room available to every team will only increasing the potential bidders.

the same reason that you think Nylander is a worthwhile bet (PPG past 3 years) is the reason why he is going to break the bank if he chooses UFA. (my bet is that he lands in Chicago for 10-11M/year... they have more than enough room to pay the highest price and giving Bedard a running mate for next few years makes too much sense).

 

[sampollock]

Would be nice if we could get a decent linemate for Suzuki. Newhook and Anderson aren't it. Maybe we can sign Kane before flipping him at the deadline lol.

SURE would . Kent's main focus for me is have 2 top solid lines . that is how you start to win.

D is coming, now the scoring is a concern

 

[ReHabs]

Huberdeau with Suzuki would be killer

If Calgary retain 4m it’s a worthwhile gamble imo. 6m for a former 100pt scorer? High reward for medium risk.

Obviously Nylander and other fitter, younger players are preferred.

 

[Hannibal]

Huberdeau with Suzuki would be killer

If Calgary retain 4m it’s a worthwhile gamble imo. 6m for a former 100pt scorer? High reward for medium risk.

Obviously Nylander and other fitter, younger players are preferred.

Huberdeau would not survive a week here. Pass.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

Huberdeau with Suzuki would be killer

If Calgary retain 4m it’s a worthwhile gamble imo. 6m for a former 100pt scorer? High reward for medium risk.

Obviously Nylander and other fitter, younger players are preferred.

even if they retained 50% Huberdeau is too big a risk. And he is well outside the age range HuGo would be looking for.