Trade and Free Agency Discussion Thread - Don't Expect More Augmenting

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Fogelhund

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Sep 15, 2007
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if there is a Canadian division and not just regular season and playoffs too, does that mean only Canadian teams can trade with each other too?

No, it shouldn't be a problem to trade outside of your country, but quarantine rules would apply... you wouldn't get that player for two weeks, and several tests. It's also why there will be a Canadian AHL division this year, with all affiliates playing in Canada.

I think it's all but confirmed at this point, that there will be a Canadian division.
 
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Gabriel426

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Just wondering, do you think the players even want to play this season?
Just curious that’s all. We heard from the medias that some owners don’t want to have a season due to revenue but do the players want to play at all? I know a lot of them won’t get paid if there is no season. Understand the lowest contract is 700K and highest is 12.5mil but should they have a Choice? Like if someone with huge signing bonuses decided not to play bc of COVID....we should respect that instead of saying he doesn’t care bc he already got paid.
 

Fogelhund

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Sep 15, 2007
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Just wondering, do you think the players even want to play this season?
Just curious that’s all. We heard from the medias that some owners don’t want to have a season due to revenue but do the players want to play at all? I know a lot of them won’t get paid if there is no season. Understand the lowest contract is 700K and highest is 12.5mil but should they have a Choice? Like if someone with huge signing bonuses decided not to play bc of COVID....we should respect that instead of saying he doesn’t care bc he already got paid.

Very few players will opt out. Seven players opted out of the play-ins. List of NHL players to opt out of Return to Play - TSN.ca

You might assume, that the rest wanted to play, and would likely want to play going forward.
 

Gabriel426

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Very few players will opt out. Seven players opted out of the play-ins. List of NHL players to opt out of Return to Play - TSN.ca

You might assume, that the rest wanted to play, and would likely want to play going forward.

Different now, since this is the regular season and that was playins/playoffs. Also what if you play on a team that pretty much going nowhere.
I think players want to play but it is also their choice if they want to opt out.
 

The Podium

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You don't think Tampa matches and then deals with the cap issues later?

Not if they go unsigned by the time the season starts with a hard cap compliance requirement and the team can no longer be 10% over the cap. They literally would not be able to match until they dump the salary and would have a week to do so.
 

Dreakmur

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Not if they go unsigned by the time the season starts with a hard cap compliance requirement and the team can no longer be 10% over the cap. They literally would not be able to match until they dump the salary and would have a week to do so.

Think they have 14 days to match or not, so they'd still have two weeks to deal with it.
 

The Podium

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Think they have 14 days to match or not, so they'd still have two weeks to deal with it.

7 days to match and would have to clear essentially 8 mill which for them means losing a couple good players for next to nothing. Maybe they clear the space for Cirelli, but they likely dont for Cernak.
 

Fogelhund

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You don't think Tampa matches and then deals with the cap issues later?

At this point they haven't found a taker for cap relief. There just aren't many teams willing to spend that much, nor are there many teams with the cap space to help them out.

With a roster size of 18 guys, they've got ~$2.9 in cap space left. Even adding one non roster guys gets you to around $2.1 mil left. Sergachev is $4 mil approx, Cernak $2.5-3 mil, Cirelli projections were $5.8 million. Capped: Salary Predictions for the Top 200 Free Agent Skaters

Even at discounts, and somehow they get Cirelli and Sergachev signed at $9 mil combined, run a 21 man roster, they are at a deficit of $7 mil.

They basically have to give away Killorn, who has a 16 team NTC, and find someone to take one of Johnson, Gourde or Palat (who all have forms of NTC as well), with some hefty incentives to take them... perhaps Cernak and a couple of picks, a first and second might do that.

Or, if they want to keep Killorn, they will have to pay two teams, to take two of Johnson, Gourde or Palat, which would cost them a ton.

An offersheet isn't the biggest deal for them, as they could afford to match, if they moved two of Johnson, Gourde or Palat... is finding the people to take two of... not going to be easy.
 
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Dreakmur

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7 days to match and would have to clear essentially 8 mill which for them means losing a couple good players for next to nothing. Maybe they clear the space for Cirelli, but they likely dont for Cernak.

There are 9 teams with the cap space to make that 4.2 million dollar offer. 3 of those teams don't have the required pick (New York, Columbus, New Jersey)

Chicago, Florida, Detroit, Ottawa, Nashville, and Los Angeles.

That's who could make an offer. Which of those teams want to spend closer to the cap? Florida is openly shedding money. Ottawa is famously cheap.

Which teams would a player want to leave Tampa Bay to join?

Yes, it's possible for an offer sheet, but there's so much that goes into them that they rarely make sense.
 

Fogelhund

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There are 9 teams with the cap space to make that 4.2 million dollar offer. 3 of those teams don't have the required pick (New York, Columbus, New Jersey)

Chicago, Florida, Detroit, Ottawa, Nashville, and Los Angeles.

That's who could make an offer. Which of those teams want to spend closer to the cap? Florida is openly shedding money. Ottawa is famously cheap.

Which teams would a player want to leave Tampa Bay to join?

Yes, it's possible for an offer sheet, but there's so much that goes into them that they rarely make sense.

I think Boston could make it work too. Both Pastrank and Marchand are going to be on the IR for some time.
 

SeaOfBlue

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I had no idea where to post this junk, but here it is. Tavares contract is the worst, unless they win, then it's the best... umm.. ya.



All that tells me is the Leafs don't have any bad contracts, and they had to pick one for the exercise.

I would have picked Marner personally, but I can see why they pick Tavares given he just turned 30 years old and Marner is only going to be turning 24. At least Marner can be considered overpaid.
 

hamzarocks

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Jul 22, 2012
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All that tells me is the Leafs don't have any bad contracts, and they had to pick one for the exercise.

I would have picked Marner personally, but I can see why they pick Tavares given he just turned 30 years old and Marner is only going to be turning 24. At least Marner can be considered overpaid.

Tavares pure on ice impact wise is
overpaid. He is not a 11 million dollar player right now.

For him though his valuation needs to be looked differently, with him having signed as a UFA and ufas always getting a premium paid off for them having taken discounted 2nd deals. JT I view as a 9-9.5 million dollar player and I expect his in game impact are that range with production being 85 pts and up along with his continued excellent at driving abilities.

The 1.5-2.0 payment when viewed from a UFA contract lenses is his premium and as such even if he only produces 85-90 points he is worth the deal while Matthews+marner if they in the future years have that production point will be overpaid by the UFA premium amount as they got paid comparable to JT right away
 

stickty111

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That was an awful title, but all that means is Leafs don't have a terrible contract. Tavares is more then fine at 11 million. Matthews is great at his value, and Nylander could be a steal. The only issue is Marner but at most it's an overpay by 1-2 million.
 

Buds17

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Tavares has a big contract comprised entirely of UFA years. We're approaching December without any NHL games having been played. That contract isn't getting any worse right now. No team is going to be winning much of anything at the moment.
 

Dreakmur

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All that tells me is the Leafs don't have any bad contracts, and they had to pick one for the exercise.

I would have picked Marner personally, but I can see why they pick Tavares given he just turned 30 years old and Marner is only going to be turning 24. At least Marner can be considered overpaid.

They don’t have a single bad contract? Why did they have to unload salary after missing the playoffs?
 

Fogelhund

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They don’t have a single bad contract? Why did they have to unload salary after missing the playoffs?

Covid flat cap mostly. They would have only had to move one contract, to move that money to the D, if the cap had gone up. We all knew, we had to improve the D, by subtracting up front... Covid flat cap made it worse.
 

Magic Man

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They don’t have a single bad contract? Why did they have to unload salary after missing the playoffs?
To be fair.

They were in the playoffs at the time of the stoppage. They were very likely to make it to the playoffs had it played out naturally. They went to game #5 of a special 5 game play-in with Columbus while coming in cold and out of shape in the summer months. The same team that swept Tampa, this years champion in the very first round the year before. They were a tough play-in opponent and the play-in is not how that usually works.

They signed Muzzin, Holl, Mikheyev and Engvall to fairly significant raises. The cap didn't go up and they had to find a top pairing defenseman to replace Barrie, their top FA who came in last season with 50% of his salary retained. They needed to also replace Cody Ceci and did with Bogosian.

They needed to cut from the middle of the lineup, which turned out to be Kapanen and Johnsson, which is very common even when the cap doesn't stay flat for two years. They got plenty of futures for them and the necessary extra cap. They also had a mission to change the make-up of players coming in this season. Trading Kapanen and Johnsson opened up cap and roster room to sign Simmonds, Thornton, Vesey and Bogosian to bring some jam to the lower half of the lineup. The only issue really was that Kapanen, Johnsson and Clifford, all players lost this summer were players that played gritty. So, they more or less replaced the toughness they lost. Maybe, gained a bit.

Holl's contract doesn't look that appealing. He's been a depth player for a while and has worked his way into the lineup. The 3 year term initially surprised me. 2 years would have been fine at the same dollar amount. But, I still think he could end up being roughly worth 3.5M-4M per year during the duration of the contract, but he has signed for a fraction of that. He would be my choice for worst contract. I think he is lost to expansion.
 
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Antropovsky

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Jun 2, 2007
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To be fair.

They were in the playoffs at the time of the stoppage. They were very likely to make it to the playoffs had it played out naturally. They went to game #5 of a special 5 game play-in with Columbus while coming in cold and out of shape in the summer months. The same team that swept Tampa, this years champion in the very first round the year before. They were a tough play-in opponent and the play-in is not how that usually works.

They signed Muzzin, Holl, Mikheyev and Engvall to fairly significant raises. The cap didn't go up and they had to find a top pairing defenseman to replace Barrie, their top FA who came in last season with 50% of his salary retained. They needed to also replace Cody Ceci and did with Bogosian.

They needed to cut from the middle of the lineup, which turned out to be Kapanen and Johnsson, which is very common even when the cap doesn't stay flat for two years. They got plenty of futures for them and the necessary extra cap. They also had a mission to change the make-up of players coming in this season. Trading Kapanen and Johnsson opened up cap and roster room to sign Simmonds, Thornton, Vesey and Bogosian to bring some jam to the lower half of the lineup. The only issue really was that Kapanen, Johnsson and Clifford, all players lost this summer were players that played gritty. So, they more or less replaced the toughness they lost. Maybe, gained a bit.

Holl's contract doesn't look that appealing. He's been a depth player for a while and has worked his way into the lineup. The 3 year term initially surprised me. 2 years would have been fine at the same dollar amount. But, I still think he could end up being roughly worth 3.5M-4M per year during the duration of the contract, but he has signed for a fraction of that. He would be my choice for worst contract. I think he is lost to expansion.
Columbus had Panarin, Josh Anderson and Brobrovsky when they swept Tampa a year ago. They didn't have these players when we played them.

Panarin alone couldve ment a sweep for Columbus over the Leafs.
 
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