Prospect Info: Top 20 Prospects

joe89 · Jun 4, 2013

Henkka said:
I want to see Athanasiou first in AHL, before doing any rankings. He could the next Datsyuk if everything goes right. And that's a BIG IF.

That's why you do new rankings once in a while.

AA2 is 16 months away from the AHL..

ChadS · Jun 5, 2013

Lots of good lists posted already but I might as well add mine. It's quite similar to the others but a couple of differences...

I didn't include: Nyquist, Smith, Andersson, Lashoff, Raedeke, Pearce and McCollum (because I don't want him re-signed... :p:

)

Calle JÃ¤rnkrok, C
Tomas Tatar, LW
Tomas Jurco, RW
Petr Mrazek, G
Ryan Sproul, D
Dan DeKeyser, D
Xavier Ouellet, D
Mattias BÃ¤ckman, D
Landon Ferraro, C
Riley Sheahan, C
Nick Jensen, D
Martin Frk, RW
Andreas Athanasiou, LW/C
Alexei Marchenko, D
Teemu Pulkkinen, RW
Marek Tvrdon, LW
Adam Almqvist, D
Jake Paterson, G
Mitchell Callahan, RW
Louis-Marc Aubry, C
-------------------------
Max Nicastro, D
Mike McKee, D
Richard Nedomlel, D
Trevor Parkes, RW
James De Haas, D
Jared Coreau, G
Willie Coetzee, RW
Andrej Nestrasil, C/W
Gleason Fournier, D
Ben Marshall, D
Rasmus Bodin, LW

Couldn't stop at 20... Here's a few notes:
- Risers (compared to my last list): Sproul, BÃ¤ckman, Ferraro, Athanasiou, Almqvist, Paterson
- Fallers: Sheahan (had him at 7 with Nyquist/Smith etc. on the list), Pulkkinen, Tvrdon, Aubry.
- Ferraro vs Sheahan was a tough choice, as was Ouellet vs BÃ¤ckman and Jensen vs Marchenko. Putting DeKeyser in the right place wasn't easy either.
- Some expectations/guesses for 13-14:
* Sproul will have a big year offensively
* BÃ¤ckman will continue taking big steps in Sweden
* Marchenko will make an easy transition to NA hockey
* At least one of McKee/De Haas will be a positive surprise in their first year of college
* JÃ¤rnkrok & Jurco will be a dynamic duo with GR
* Big year for Athanasiou, not so big for Pulkkinen and Frk
* Breakout players of the year: Andreas Athanasiou, Alexei Marchenko & James De Haas.

Can't wait for the 30th...

sully6one · Jun 5, 2013

1. DeKeyser
2. Nyquist
3. Tatar
4. Jarnkrok
5. Mrazek
6. Sproul
7. Jurco
8. Ouellet
9. Andersson
10. Backman
11. Pulkkinen
12. Sheahan
13. Frk
14. Ferraro
15. Athanasiou
16. Callahan
17. Marchenko
18. Tvrdon
19. Jensen
20. Paterson

Based of chance of making it to NHL and potential.

JimLaheyprobert · Jun 5, 2013

does this go by potential or most nhl ready?

The Zetterberg Era · Jun 5, 2013

JimLaheyprobert said:
does this go by potential or most nhl ready?

Usually kind of a mix and match of both, but however you want to look at it.

Flowah · Jun 5, 2013

ProPAIN said:
Is he highly rated for his defensive game though? I've seen comparisons to Helm with better hands, but nothing more. And yeah, I agree, I want to see some of these players at the next level. A lot of players haven't even made the NHL but still put up decent numbers in junior.

I've only seen some highlight videos, but he seemed more like Datsyuk style-wise. Obviously the speed is higher, but one of Datsyuk's strength is his ability to take a hit but roll on it so he doesn't stop moving to where he wants to go. I see that with Athanasiou in the video. I also see how he gets by defenders. Very much Datsyuk-like. The creativity/hands are not the same level, but the style certainly is. And while a great deal of it is speed, I'd say he's closer to Dats than Helm in terms of play.

Rewatching the draft reel right now. Looks like he uses a really long stick. Just like Datsyuk.

I'd love to catch some videos of him when he gets to Grand Rapids.

Big year for Athanasiou, not so big for Pulkkinen and Frk

I thought Frk had a monster year?

The Zetterberg Era · Jun 5, 2013

Flowah said:
I've only seen some highlight videos, but he seemed more like Datsyuk style-wise. Obviously the speed is higher, but one of Datsyuk's strength is his ability to take a hit but roll on it so he doesn't stop moving to where he wants to go. I see that with Athanasiou in the video. I also see how he gets by defenders. Very much Datsyuk-like. The creativity/hands are not the same level, but the style certainly is. And while a great deal of it is speed, I'd say he's closer to Dats than Helm in terms of play.

Rewatching the draft reel right now. Looks like he uses a really long stick. Just like Datsyuk.

I'd love to catch some videos of him when he gets to Grand Rapids.

Reminds me a heck of a lot more of a Viktor Stalberg than Datsyuk. He drives wide an awful lot and just bursts around people, has a nice big long stride and shields well with his frame. He probably has a little better hands, but nowhere near Datsyuk level. He also doesn't use his teammates an awful lot.

jaster · Jun 5, 2013

sarcastro said:
DeKeyser, Nyquist, and Lashoff are still eligible based on the HF criteria:

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/whatmakesaprospect/

Since there needs to be some criteria, I'll use HF's as well.

Also, my list is more accurate than any of yours.

1. Nyquist
2. Dekeyser
3. Jarnkrok
4. Mrazek
5. Tatar
6. Sproul
7. Sheahan
8. Ouellet
9. Backman
10. Jurco
11. Andersson
12. Ferraro
13. Lashoff
14. Frk
15. Marchenko
16. Jensen
17. Pulkkinen
18. Athanasiou
19. Paterson
20. Tvrdon

HM: Almqvist

No one else interests me.

BeerLeagueAllStar · Jun 5, 2013

jaster said:
1. Nyquist
2. Dekeyser
3. Jarnkrok
4. Mrazek
5. Tatar
6. Sproul
7. Sheahan
8. Ouellet
9. Backman
10. Jurco

Not a fan of Jurco? Or do you just think everyone ahead of him is a safer bet?
I'd maybe swap him and Sheahan, but that's just my opinion.

jaster · Jun 5, 2013

BeerLeagueAllStar said:
Not a fan of Jurco? Or do you just think everyone ahead of him is a safer bet?
I'd maybe swap him and Sheahan, but that's just my opinion.

My view is perhaps a little skewed by the two Griffins games I attended in person this year. It's entirely possible they were Jurco's two worst games of the year. He was simply awful. I love the upside though, which is certainly higher than Sheahan's, and he finished this year strong. Hell, his GWG tonight in game 7 of the WCF was effing awesome. Honestly, I see my #6-10 as a pretty tight group, that could go in several different orders. In the end, I just want to see more development from Jurco, more consistency, more effort, and a more well-rounded game, before I rank him much higher.

joe89 · Jun 5, 2013

^ Depends on when you watched him really. He wasn't much before New Year's. When the lockout ended he got a bigger role and slowly but surely he's improved almost every game since.

It's not to be overlooked that Jurco was AHL eligible by three days this season. He's one of the youngest in the league.

jaster · Jun 5, 2013

joe89 said:
^ Depends on when you watched him really. He wasn't much before New Year's. When the lockout ended he got a bigger role and slowly but surely he's improved almost every game since.

It's not to be overlooked that Jurco was AHL eligible by three days this season. He's one of the youngest in the league.

All true, of course. And the two games I saw were both in the first half.

OK, I'LL CONSIDER REVISING MY RANKINGS YOU JERKWADS :cry:

BeerLeagueAllStar · Jun 5, 2013

jaster said:
My view is perhaps a little skewed by the two Griffins games I attended in person this year. It's entirely possible they were Jurco's two worst games of the year. He was simply awful. I love the upside though, which is certainly higher than Sheahan's, and he finished this year strong. Hell, his GWG tonight in game 7 of the WCF was effing awesome. Honestly, I see my #6-10 as a pretty tight group, that could go in several different orders. In the end, I just want to see more development from Jurco, more consistency, more effort, and a more well-rounded game, before I rank him much higher.

Understandable for sure. I'm in love with the upside personally, I think his offensive potential is highest among our forward prospects even including Nyquist/Tatar/Jarnkrok.

BeerLeagueAllStar · Jun 5, 2013

jaster said:
OK, I'LL CONSIDER REVISING MY RANKINGS YOU JERKWADS

joe89 · Jun 5, 2013

jaster said:
All true, of course. And the two games I saw were both in the first half.

OK, I'LL CONSIDER REVISING MY RANKINGS YOU JERKWADS

It's still just a couple months of good play but I'd hate to think he'd start to regress :p:

jaster · Jun 5, 2013

joe89 said:
It's still just a couple months of good play but I'd hate to think he'd start to regress

Me too. I'd love for him to be our #1/2 prospect at the end of next year. Would mean he's on the fast track to reaching his potential.

The Zetterberg Era · Jun 5, 2013

Saw Jurco in person during the lockout and he was unimpressive, probably the worst Griffin on the ice. The guy that is playing now, knows his assignments and is skating worlds better. His confidence is through the roof and he gets what being a pro is about. Blashill already talks about his hunger and Babs favorite every dayer label. He works out after games, works skating drills in the morning, and studies film constantly. It is really that report that made me think this guy is going to be special. Those reviews are a big deal, he has talent, but the confirmation of his desire to be the best he can be by his coach is a big deal on how I view him along with that big second half.

Money GWG tonight from him too.

Vladdy84 · Jun 6, 2013

I'm not gonna do a top 20. I've only seen a handful of these guys play and just read about the rest and really to lazy to rank 20 prospects. It's all subjective anyways. I'll rank what I feel are our top 6. I don't consider Tatar or DD prospects because they are NHL players right now IMO.

1. Jarnkrok
2. Mrazek
3. Sproul
4. XO
5. Jurco
6. Sheahan

HM: Ferraro and Backman

jaster · Jun 6, 2013

sarcastro said:
I'll pile on while the piling is good.

Andersson's not eligible, since he turned 24.

Cool. Everybody on my list moves up one and Almqvist is #20 then.

And you undervalue Jurco. Hell, I feel like I undervalued him and I had him at 5. I've said repeatedly that I think he is the most important prospect in the Wings' pipeline (although I'd say he's been recently replaced by DeKeyser in that regard). If he reaches his potential, the Wings have a big, fast, 40 goal winger that can play the body - they'd essentially have Marian Hossa 2.0. It's a big IF, but it would be such a huge win for the franchise and he made such huge strides this year in GR. Really exciting.

Jurco may possibly have the highest upside in the system. But my rankings are more than just total upside. How close they are to that upside and how likely they are to reach that upside count too. You say it yourself.... it's a big if. At this point, I don't think he belongs in the top-5, it we're counting Nyquist and Dekeyser. But I can see him being as high as #6.

And you undervalue Jarnkrok :naughty:

ChadS · Jun 6, 2013

Here's RWC's final ranking: http://www.redwingscentral.com/2013/06/06/3816/jarnkrok-mrazek-top-final-rwc-ranking/
Did a quick comparison to my list and it looks like he has 6 out of 25 guys farther than +/- 2 spots compared to my list (Sheahan +4, Pulkkinen +3, Jensen -3, Coreau +7, Tvrdon -4, Marshall +5).

01 Calle Jarnkrok (–) C
02 Petr Mrazek (–) G
03 Tomas Tatar (–) LW
04 Tomas Jurco (+2) RW
05 Riley Sheahan (-1) C
06 Ryan Sproul (-1) D
07 Mattias Backman (+1) D
08 Xavier Ouellet (-1) D
09 Landon Ferraro (–) C
10 Martin Frk (+3) RW
11 Teemu Pulkkinen (+1) RW
12 Andreas Athanasiou (+5) LW/C
13 Nick Jensen (+7) D
14 Alexei Marchenko (+1) D
15 Adam Almquist (+1) D
16 Jake Paterson (-2) G
17 Mitchell Callahan (NR) RW
18 Jared Coreau (NR) G
19 Marek Tvrdon (-1) LW
20 Louis-Marc Aubry (NR) C
21 Max Nicastro (NR) D
22 Trevor Parkes (NR) RW
23 Richard Nedomlel (NR) D
24 Ben Marshall (NR) D
25 James De Haas (NR) D

Others:
Rasmus Bodin LW
Willie Coetzee RW
Gleason Fournier D
Thomas McCollum G
Mike McKee D
Andrej Nestrasil RW
Jordan Pearce G
Brent Raedeke C

Henkka · Jun 6, 2013

Unfriendly Ghost · Jun 6, 2013

Interesting to see them talk about Tatar and then Nyquist. Martin (at least) is WAY higher on Nyquist than Tatar. He puts Nyquist as potentially a first line guy, while he sees Tatar as somewhere between second to third line.

It sort of comes across like: Nyquist is ready to go and has monster potential. Tatar is potentially ready to go and has good but not top end potential.

The Zetterberg Era · Jun 6, 2013

Guru Meditation said:
Interesting to see them talk about Tatar and then Nyquist. Martin (at least) is WAY higher on Nyquist than Tatar. He puts Nyquist as potentially a first line guy, while he sees Tatar as somewhere between second to third line.

It sort of comes across like: Nyquist is ready to go and has monster potential. Tatar is potentially ready to go and has good but not top end potential.

Which I pretty much agree with in terms of the next level. It really isn't a secret that the organization sees more in Nyquist than they do Tatar.

GoAwayDanCleary · Jun 6, 2013

The Zetterberg Era said:
Which I pretty much agree with in terms of the next level. It really isn't a secret that the organization sees more in Nyquist than they do Tatar.

That wasn't the case earlier in the year.

sarcastro · Jun 6, 2013

ChadS said:
Here's RWC's final ranking: http://www.redwingscentral.com/2013/06/06/3816/jarnkrok-mrazek-top-final-rwc-ranking/
Did a quick comparison to my list and it looks like he has 6 out of 25 guys farther than +/- 2 spots compared to my list (Sheahan +4, Pulkkinen +3, Jensen -3, Coreau +7, Tvrdon -4, Marshall +5).

They don't count Nyquist or DK or Lashoff as prospects, so here's how my rankings match up if you take them out (RWC ranking in parenthesis):

1. Tatar (3)
2. Mrazek (2) - our only match!
3. Jurco (4) - they like him too!
4. Sproul (6)
5. Jarnkrok (1)
6. Frk (10)
7. Ouellet (8)
8. Jensen (13)
9. Sheahan (5)
10. Ferraro (9)
11. Backman (7)
12. Marchenko (14)
13. Tvrdon (19)
14. Coreau (18)
15. Athanasiou (12)
16. De Haas (25)
17. Pulkkinen (11)

I would have gone Nedomlel (23), Pulkkinen (11), and maybe Paterson (16) if I had to round out the top 20 without the guys RWC excluded.

I think RWC has Backman and Pulkkinen WAY too high, and I think ranking Sheahan ahead of Sproul is silly.

Prospect Info: Top 20 Prospects

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