Thoughts on a postseason run?

[Kriss E]

Because I think people warp their memories as to who was a non-contender and who wasn't after the fact.

How bout doing this. List the first centers of every cup winning team since 2000. Compare that to ours.

 

[nhlfan9191]

explain me the L in OTL

Can't wait for this stupid loser point rule to be over with. Should have been accepted 5 years ago when they tried to vote on it.

Its a loss, but there’s a reward for it so it isn’t judged the same way. When you say we’ve been below .500 by adding our regulation losses and overtime losses, it doesn’t work because we received 9 points in those losses.

 

[No More Subban]

Still hoping for Ekholm. I think he'd fit in perfectly. He's a legit top pair dman and would put Chiarot/Edmunson on bottom 4 permanently.

Time to give Weber a better d-partner.

 

[salbutera]

How bout doing this. List the first centers of every cup winning team since 2000. Compare that to ours.

This seasons Habs team has been built on the depth, size, 5-on-5 domination, and strong goaltending duo philosophy of the 2011 Bruins team - albeit there’s a significant leap of faith Suzuki & KK would progress over the course of the season combined with continued play of Danault to emulate 2011 versions of Bergeron, Krejci, and Horton.

Iirc Lucic led that team in scoring and all three of their Cs scored 60 or less points.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I mean... The Habs have the best goaltender in the league, that alone can get you far.

Its not like this team is without its strength, really. Price has been the best goaltender in the league and he's been the best PO goaltender too.

Then you add in the fact that this roster is actually very talented up front, if the Habs were to add a defender, I don't see how Nashville and their 3rd line center line up can even be compared.

Problem is that we help to neutralize that strength by having such a poor D. And it absolutely kills us when shorthanded. Price can take us far but not when guys handle the puck like a grenade in our own zone.

The group we have now is better than what we've had but it's still not great.

Depends what you consider far. We've seen it twice, best we get is ECF, and even at that we still needed way more than just that to get there.

I will always say that we'd have made the finals if he doesn't get run. Anyways... it's a shoulda/coulda been.

 

[Runner77]

I'll start to feel confident in this team when Annakin Slayd drops another banger.

Sad to say, I met him and he acted like a complete self-absorbed, arrogant jerk who only cares about whether you can give him a follow on one of his multiple multimedia platforms.

I'll feel confident in this team when someone other than "Slayd" (aka Andrew Farrar, brother of Jay Farrar on CJAD), drops a banger.

 

[Mrb1p]

How bout doing this. List the first centers of every cup winning team since 2000. Compare that to ours.

Better than Dallas
Better than Vegas
More talented than STL
Better than NJD
Much, much better than Nashville

Off the top of my head without looking

 

[Kriss E]

This seasons Habs team has been built on the depth, size, 5-on-5 domination, and strong goaltending duo philosophy of the 2011 Bruins team - albeit there’s a significant leap of faith Suzuki & KK would progress over the course of the season combined with continued play of Danault to emulate 2011 versions of Bergeron, Krejci, and Horton.

Iirc Lucic led that team in scoring and all three of their Cs scored 60 or less points.

Our defense is also not where Boston's was, and as you said, Krejci-Bergeron was pretty much a ppg center duo during that PO run, so the kids will have to raise their games quite a bit.

 

[Kriss E]

Better than Dallas
Better than Vegas
More talented than STL
Better than NJD
Much, much better than Nashville

Off the top of my head without looking

Vegas didn't win a cup, but even then, Better than Marchessault during their run? Disagree.
Better than O'Reilly? Disagree. But hey, Chiarot and Edmundson in their top 4?
Yup, Jersey is your only example, and they didn't win.
RyanJo was playing better than any of our centers before he got injured and again their focus was an awesome defense, and Preds didn't win.

So three of your examples of the cup winning team top center I asked for are from the losing teams....

 

[Ozmodiar]

Sad to say, I met him and he acted like a complete self-absorbed, arrogant jerk who only cares about whether you can give him a follow on one of his multiple multimedia platforms.

I'll feel confident in this team when someone other than "Slayd" (aka Andrew Farrar, brother of Jay Farrar on CJAD), drops a banger.

Why doesn’t any of this surprise me? Lol

 

[JianYang]

This seasons Habs team has been built on the depth, size, 5-on-5 domination, and strong goaltending duo philosophy of the 2011 Bruins team - albeit there’s a significant leap of faith Suzuki & KK would progress over the course of the season combined with continued play of Danault to emulate 2011 versions of Bergeron, Krejci, and Horton.

Iirc Lucic led that team in scoring and all three of their Cs scored 60 or less points.

I mentioned that Cup winners have had an elite center, and usually a cornerstone dman. I consider Bergeron in that space, and Chara was at his peak.

Regardless, I'm not sure if thats a model for Montreal to follow. The bruins were bullying their opponents, and Colin Campbell's son was playing for the team. Those are some really specific stars that you would need aligned.

 

[Runner77]

Why doesn’t any of this surprise me? Lol

Maybe someone else will have a better account. That thing about not engaging with public figures or mostly risk disappointment is so true. I usually abstain and ignore these people but we were all stuck in a remote location over several hours and he just happened to be close by where I was standing. Piece of work.

 

[Chet-Nick]

With this unique COVID influenced format. I think the opportunity is there for any playoff team to reach the semi-finals.

To be honest, if the Canadiens are going to win their 25th Stanley Cup in the future. I don't want it be this season. Want no (warranted) debates. "What if this ..." "What if that ..." The asterisk argument.

My hope is they play well enough to regain some (lost) respectability around the league and further develop the skills/confidence of their younger core.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

With this unique COVID influenced format. I think the opportunity is there for any playoff team to reach the semi-finals.

To be honest, if the Canadiens are going to win their 25th Stanley Cup in the future. I don't want it be this season. Want no (warranted) debates. "What if this ..." "What if that ..." The asterisk argument.

My hope is they play well enough to regain some (lost) respectability around the league and further develop the skills/confidence of their younger core.

I will take it this season or any other. A cup's a cup. I don't want my son growing into his 20s and 30s not having seen a cup.

And it's not going to get easier. Price is getting older and Weber looks like he may already be over the hill. This is a good year to go for it, esp with us being in the Canadian division.

 

[Holystik]

With this unique COVID influenced format. I think the opportunity is there for any playoff team to reach the semi-finals.

To be honest, if the Canadiens are going to win their 25th Stanley Cup in the future. I don't want it be this season. Want no (warranted) debates. "What if this ..." "What if that ..." The asterisk argument.

My hope is they play well enough to regain some (lost) respectability around the league and further develop the skills/confidence of their younger core.

At this point I would be happy to win a cup during/post nuclear war. Winning is winning. Even if less satisfying I would still be proud nonetheless. I understand what you mean though as it makes sense.

 

[Runner77]

I will take it this season or any other. A cup's a cup. I don't want my son growing into his 20s and 30s not having seen a cup.

And it's not going to get easier. Price is getting older and Weber looks like he may already be over the hill. This is a good year to go for it, esp with us being in the Canadian division.

I've never seen so much quality depth on any edition of this club during the Bergevin years. An argument could also be made for the prior GM's tenure too.

We've made a jump from Ott, King, Martinsen, Brandon Davidson level players to no better fare like Weal and Weise types and more recently, to players I never thought would consider signing with us and/or accept to be traded to us, like Toffoli, Anderson and Perry and Staal. They're not elite level players but they are or can be very productive. Some of them bring in valuable playoff experience and some have played with Cup-winning teams, but most importantly, they can still bring it and make a difference.

It's quite unfortunate that we've had to settle for so many scrubs over the MB years, so many of them imposters and subpar, or in the least productive years of their careers. All of that makes this year's additions so much more appreciated and source of greater hope.

 

[salbutera]

I mentioned that Cup winners have had an elite center, and usually a cornerstone dman. I consider Bergeron in that space, and Chara was at his peak.

Regardless, I'm not sure if thats a model for Montreal to follow. The bruins were bullying their opponents, and Colin Campbell's son was playing for the team. Those are some really specific stars that you would need aligned.

Not saying I disagree w sentiment, but a couple of data points to keep in mind;

- 2011 era Bergeron was a 50-55 point C....very Danault-esque

- Chara turned 34 during that regular season

- Seidenberg & Ference were the only Dman to be considered PMD category, are Kulak & Romanov really that inferior in comparison?

 

[angusyoung]

I'll start to feel confident in this team when Annakin Slayd drops another banger.

What is that?

 

[Essenege]

How bout doing this. List the first centers of every cup winning team since 2000. Compare that to ours.

Most good teams have an elite first line center but you can be a good team without one. You confound correlation with causality.

 

[angusyoung]

I mean... The Habs have the best goaltender in the league, that alone can get you far.

Its not like this team is without its strength, really. Price has been the best goaltender in the league and he's been the best PO goaltender too.

Then you add in the fact that this roster is actually very talented up front, if the Habs were to add a defender, I don't see how Nashville and their 3rd line center line up can even be compared.

Best tandem goal-tending,best goalie? obviously debatable but there is handful I'd take ahead of Montreal's anointed #1

 

[Kriss E]

Most good teams have an elite first line center but you can be a good team without one. You confound correlation with causality.

Sure you can be a good team, just not one that will win the cup.
And those that can bypass this either have either a high elite winger or their defense is mindblowingly good.
I'm not confounding anything, it's an observation. You look at all the cup winning teams and realize the vast majority have elite centers leading their forwards. Even some where you can debate the skills of a top center like O'Reilly and Krejci, you're talking about two guys who still had to raise their games in the POs to where they were pretty much ppg centers.

So ya, good luck winning anything without that piece. Not impossible, but extremely unlikely to happen based on that.

I mean, are we actually debating this?

 

[Kriss E]

I've never seen so much quality depth on any edition of this club during the Bergevin years. An argument could also be made for the prior GM's tenure too.

We've made a jump from Ott, King, Martinsen, Brandon Davidson level players to no better fare like Weal and Weise types and more recently, to players I never thought would consider signing with us and/or accept to be traded to us, like Toffoli, Anderson and Perry and Staal. They're not elite level players but they are or can be very productive. Some of them bring in valuable playoff experience and some have played with Cup-winning teams, but most importantly, they can still bring it and make a difference.

It's quite unfortunate that we've had to settle for so many scrubs over the MB years, so many of them imposters and subpar, or in the least productive years of their careers. All of that makes this year's additions so much more appreciated and source of greater hope.

In 13-14 the forwards were close. Knock on Weise all you want but the guy was money in the POs.
Him and Briere on the bottom line, Eller-Bourque-Gionta was a great third line after we acquired Vanek.
So it's debatable if we're deeper today, but let's say we are. On defense, it ain't the case.

 

[Essenege]

Sure you can be a good team, just not one that will win the cup.
And those that can bypass this either have either a high elite winger or their defense is mindblowingly good.
I'm not confounding anything, it's an observation. You look at all the cup winning teams and realize the vast majority have elite centers leading their forwards. Even some where you can debate the skills of a top center like O'Reilly and Krejci, you're talking about two guys who still had to raise their games in the POs to where they were pretty much ppg centers.

So ya, good luck winning anything without that piece. Not impossible, but extremely unlikely to happen based on that.

I mean, are we actually debating this?

What about 2011 Bruins? 1c was 55pts Bergeron. In hindsight we treat them as a

2011 Bruins were very similar to the Habs. Every line was a scoring threat. I remember the 4th line was dominant every shift in the playoff...the best possession team in the league.

This year, every Habs line dominate possession, we have a top 15 goalscorer/60 min on our first 3 lines...the team plays a pretty consistent 5v5 game, good system not allowing a lot of quality chances...best 5v5 goal differential.

If it was any other team posting those stats, we would treat them as contenders.

 

[DAChampion]

What about 2011 Bruins? 1c was 55pts Bergeron. In hindsight we treat them as a

2011 Bruins were very similar to the Habs. Every line was a scoring threat. I remember the 4th line was dominant every shift in the playoff...the best possession team in the league.

This year, every Habs line dominate possession, we have a top 15 goalscorer/60 min on our first 3 lines...the team plays a pretty consistent 5v5 game, good system not allowing a lot of quality chances...best 5v5 goal differential.

If it was any other team posting those stats, we would treat them as contenders.

The 2011 Bruins won the cup by injuring a lot of players on the opposing teams, and by having gregory campbell on the roster.

They're hardly a model to follow.


That said there is no single path to victory,the only focus should be building a strong team, which the Habs have.

 

[salbutera]

In 13-14 the forwards were close. Knock on Weise all you want but the guy was money in the POs.
Him and Briere on the bottom line, Eller-Bourque-Gionta was a great third line after we acquired Vanek.
So it's debatable if we're deeper today, but let's say we are. On defense, it ain't the case.

13-14 team had nowhere close to the talent on 4th line or 3rd pairing D - unless Briere by himself is considered a line. This is the deepest Habs team since the 1986 Cup team, because truth be told the 93 team does nothing in the playoffs without that Cinderella run by DiPietro whose career