The Sedins Were Stars at Best Who had Each Other. Not HHOF Worthy.

[PavelBure10]

The Sedin's like them or not, brought a element to the game that I've never seen before. You've seen players with chemistry before, but not to this degree, there chemistry is uncanny and may not ever be witnessed to this degree again. The Sedin's may not be favorites league wide, but you can't deny their on ice skill. Off the ice, their contributions to society go unmatched. I have no problems whatsoever if these two class acts get a hall of fame nod.

 

[Crow]

Ask and you shall receive

Well my prediction then is fleury, alfie, zetterberg and a dark horse who has been waiting and has better numbers than the sedins get in that year.

 

[ItWasJustified]

Basically every linemate the played with had career years. The definitely didn't only have each other.

 

[RageQuit77]

Was there ever any serious locker room issues during twin's resume?

If there were nobody ever heard about them.

Someone with better insight could shed some light about them as captains of the team.

 

[MXD]

Now look at guys:

Hart records
Point records
Point per game records
Adjusted career points/P/GP

Which takes out Parise, Pavelski and Perry from equation really. And arguably Benn (basically 5 high-end seasons) unless rebounds.

Marchand (though guess he might end up with resume worthy if can clock another ~2-3 years like last 4), Kessel, Spezza, Staal and Kovalchuk are borderline for one reason or another... not long enough primes, not high enough peak.

Backstrom, Tavares, Getzlaf, Kopitar, Zetterberg, Giroux and Toews... they should all get in, most of them are pretty much locks...

And even then, Backstrom has received the grand total of exactly three Top-3 votes for the Hart during his whole career. That's... VERY slim pickings.

 

[MXD]

Basically every linemate the played with had career years. The definitely didn't only have each other.

... It seems to me that the logical conclusion is that they made their linemates better.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

The OP prob lost a really big Proline ticket because the Sedin's single handed destroyed his big pay day.
May the hate live on forever my friend

 

[Appleyard]

And even then, Backstrom has received the grand total of exactly three Top-3 votes for the Hart during his whole career. That's... VERY slim pickings.

Yeh, but I think his point and point per game finishes alongside longevity and consistency mean he should likely be in... he is better than a lot of guys in there. Basically a Bernie Federko resume with a better peak... and Federko is not one of the weakest 10-15 guys in really.

 

[Leksand]

Well my prediction then is fleury, alfie, zetterberg and a dark horse who has been waiting and has better numbers than the sedins get in that year.

Which numbers are you referring to?

So far almost all the discussion has been about points? Then a little bit about number of and ranking in voting for individual trophies and number of Stanley Cups.

The players who will get in will they have better shots for / against stat? What about WAR? The Sedins won an Olympic gold, does that count in those numbers (very few have won a best-on-best Olympic gold, and even fewer non-Canadiens have done that)?

 

[Leksand]

Even the much loathed (and for reason) stat +/- tells the same story. They played big part of their career in the first line against the toughest competition their era could assemble against them, and when they then started "decline" it wasn't like they became the liability to their team.

Henrik +165

Daniel +147

Yes, but shots for / against and +/- are flawed stats, unlike points per game, which is a great overall metric. So this is really superfluous.

 

[MXD]

Yeh, but I think his point and point per game finishes alongside longevity and consistency mean he should likely be in... he is better than a lot of guys in there. Basically a Bernie Federko resume with a better peak... and Federko is not one of the weakest 10-15 guys in really.

But then you look at the forwards that made it and his Hart share support is just a tad above Clark Gillies, so...
(Andreychuk getting in really mixed up everything)

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

Sedins get in easily...

lock this.

 

[MXD]

Yes, but shots for / against and +/- are flawed stats, unlike points per game, which is a great overall metric. So this is really superfluous.

PPG penalizes players who were not productive for a reason or another during a certain stretch of their career.

Like, no one thinks the Sedins case is better if they're beginning their career in 03-04 (or even 05-06) instead of 00-01, but a strict PPG reading would tell you so.

 

[RageQuit77]

Which numbers are you referring to?

So far almost all the discussion has been about points? Then a little bit about number of and ranking in voting for individual trophies and number of Stanley Cups.

The players who will get in will they have better shots for / against stat? What about WAR? The Sedins won an Olympic gold, does that count in those numbers (very few have won a best-on-best Olympic gold, and even fewer non-Canadiens have done that)?

Good point.

Then, I assume it is very hard to win The Player of The Year -award in Sweden same year if being two players in a team sport, when there are dudes like Slatan in competition. There are lot of mysterious things in Swedish sports, but Sedins future induction to the HHOF isn't one of them.

 

[Appleyard]

But then you look at the forwards that made it and his Hart share support is just a tad above Clark Gillies, so...
(Andreychuk getting in really mixed up everything)

Yeh, but while Ovechkin has ofc helped his numbers having the greatest goalscorer ever on his team has likely not helped with Hart votes. I think on another team would be potentially in the Giroux/Getzlaf kind of tier... maybe not and ofc cannot know... but I think he is a similar level player to them even if not quite their peaks.

 

[Jacob]

I think Henrik should get in but not Daniel.

 

[Leksand]

Good point.

Then, I assume it is very hard to win The Player of The Year -award in Sweden same year if being two players in a team sport, when there are dudes like Slatan in competition. There are lot of mysterious things in Swedish sports, but Sedins future induction to the HHOF isn't one of them.

Just to digress very briefly. Yes harder to definitively stand out in team sport, especially for “more responsible” players. All time athlete would be Björn Borg, in a non-team sport (in fairness he was clearly the best in the world for several years, which no other male Swedish athlete has been in a sport with global reach, and Helene Alfredsson just does not have the status of the very top male athletes - unfair as it is)

 

[Connor McConnor]

Embarrassing take but what do you expect from a Calgary fan.

 

[SK13]

Both have Art Ross', one has a Hart, the other a Lindsay. 1000+ career points each.

They belong.

 

[Crow]

Sedins get in easily...

lock this.

Lol lock it? It’s 12 pages of mostly reasonable discussion.

 

[FreeMcdavid]

They won scoring titles in prime Crosby, Malkin, Kane, Era.


Turned water into wine by making the following players look better than they were: Trent Klatt, Mikael Samuelsson, Anson Carter, Taylor Pyatt, Radim Vrbata, Alex Burrows, Jason King,

Ya they Hall of Famers

 

[Crow]

Which numbers are you referring to?

So far almost all the discussion has been about points? Then a little bit about number of and ranking in voting for individual trophies and number of Stanley Cups.

The players who will get in will they have better shots for / against stat? What about WAR? The Sedins won an Olympic gold, does that count in those numbers (very few have won a best-on-best Olympic gold, and even fewer non-Canadiens have done that)?

PPG, goals and even overall points are a glaring weakness compared to some players who have been retired for longer.

I’m not saying these guys won’t get in, just that it might not be on the first go.

While voters certainly consider WAR in baseball, I don’t think voters pay much attention to WAR yet in hockey. Of course the gold counts and also helps many other players cases.

 

[Leksand]

PPG penalizes players who were not productive for a reason or another during a certain stretch of their career.

Like, no one thinks the Sedins case is better if they're beginning their career in 03-04 (or even 05-06) instead of 00-01, but a strict PPG reading would tell you so.

Agree 100% and it’s a good point. Just like point total accumulation should not be weighed highly, neither should having long careers be a minus.

 

[DarthProbert]

All boils down to whether it's the Hall of FAME or the Hall of STATS. Lots of extremely famous players won't make the Hall because they don't have the stats. Lots of players who quietly put up the stats and got in but make you say "who?"

 

[Kevin27NYI]

Both have Art Ross', one has a Hart, the other a Lindsay. 1000+ career points each.

They belong.

Agreed, I do like the discussion though.

Be interesting to hear everyones baselines/criteria.