Salary Cap: The Salary Cap Thread | Something Happened!

[Riptide]

Coles contract is up after this year.

Yes... and unless we want Hunwick/Ruhwedel as our 3rd pairing, we need to find a replacement for Cole (one that we can afford).

 

[Riptide]

Rust at 3 mil is praying. Kuhnhackl needs a new contract. That line-up above is ugly too.

Can't be too ugly - unless you think the same of our current group, as that's only missing 3 players from what we have today: Hornqvist, Cole and Reaves. Replaced with Archie, Sprong and Ruhwedel. And with 6m to find short term solutions if we want other guys.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I think this team is going to regret moving on from Hornqvist, if in fact JR can't find a way to re-sign him. At the risk of being sued by Jonathan Toews for trademark infringement, Hornqvist brings certain "intangibles" that will be hard to replace.

 

[NMK11]

Yes... and unless we want Hunwick/Ruhwedel as our 3rd pairing, we need to find a replacement for Cole (one that we can afford).

Nevermind, I actually read that as resigning Cole. My bad

 

[ColePens]

I think this team is going to regret moving on from Hornqvist, if in fact JR can't find a way to re-sign him. At the risk of being sued by Jonathan Toews for trademark infringement, Hornqvist brings certain "intangibles" that will be hard to replace.

I hate to sound like a broken record, but that Game 6 SCF GWG is the best way to describe what Horny does for this team. He's not the most skilled. He's not the best skater. That guy's heart and ability to do the dirty work is so important to a team filled with skill/speed. He's that guy who gets the dirty goal when one is needed. He's the guy who shows up in important games and lays it all on the line for his team in a way most NHLers don't do - literally sacrificing his body. In front of the net, blocking shots, etc. There is no better guy in the business at being a net front presence than Horny.

He will be the most difficult guy to replace on the Pens.

 

[Riptide]

I think this team is going to regret moving on from Hornqvist, if in fact JR can't find a way to re-sign him. At the risk of being sued by Jonathan Toews for trademark infringement, Hornqvist brings certain "intangibles" that will be hard to replace.

He'll be next to impossible to replace. And even then there should still be serious question marks about what sort of contract we should be giving him should we extend him.

 

[WayneSid9987]

Goal should be to eventually move on from Hags soon and keep Horny if it were me. I mean if you're throwing 5M at him now and him and his agent would be very satisfied with something between 5.5-6, then you make the room.

Theres lots of speedy, defensive minded potential LW'ers(had a post about them somewhere on here lately) down the pipe.
Next to nil Horny types.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Goal should be to eventually move on from Hags soon and keep Horny if it were me. I mean if you're throwing 5M at him now and him and his agent would be very satisfied with something between 5.5-6, then you make the room.

Theres lots of speedy, defensive minded potential LW'ers(had a post about them somewhere on here lately) down the pipe.
Next to nil Horny types.

Exactly. If cap space is the issue, Hagelin needs to be the one moved before Hornqvist.

What Hagelin currently brings can easily be replaced, at a fraction of the cost -- particularly at Hagelin's production rate for the past year and 11 games. What Hornqvist brings would be a lot more difficult to replace.

 

[WayneSid9987]

It'd be different if a guy like ZAR was killing it right now but i question if he'll turn into anything atm so i wouldn't wanna lose Horny anytime soon.

 

[Peat]

The major issue (imo) isn't cap space though, at least not next year. 3C pending, you should be able to fit Hags and Horny with a significant pay rise on the same roster anyway. The issue is roster space, and cap space post Guentzel raise, when Hags won't be around anyway. We have a glut of right wingers and while it would make sense to keep Horny and his skill set, it is a bit awkward keeping the one who's about to be the most overpaid in terms of raw production when he's also the one with the least fit in the top 6 going forwards.

In an ideal world, I'd wave a magic wand that gave Sid amnesia about Horny, then sign Horny to a fair contract and trade one of Kessel or Sheary to make space for Sprong when the time is right. But its not an ideal world and the bit about Horny and a fair contract might well be difficult enough, nevermind the other bits.

Edit: Now if your sole contention is the term argument, fair enough. Maybe he can get 3 years or whatever. But the bigger point I was making was more about salary, and that if the Pens offer some kind of term (2 years), he might be more inclined to take that with the same salary in a situation he's comfortable instead of opting for free agency and hope another team offers more than 1 year or more money.

Its both. Its mainly the term, but its also the cap hit. I don't see any particular point in discussing the cap hit in depth until we know what this year's production looks like for him, but I think there's enough rough comparables out there to suggest a modest pay increase. The term is the big one though. Thorburn is another guy getting 3 years at 31. 2 years isn't some kind of term, its a lowball offer. Combine that with no pay rise, and I don't see why on earth Reaves would be inclined to take that.

 

[JRS91]

Priorities are Hornqvist, Rust as a bridge and maybe Cole. Reaves. Kuhnackle, Sheahan are affordable. pens have 14 million to 16 million depending on the cap next year. Pens can move Hags and or Sheary with Sprong and Reese next year. Pens have plenty of room.

If the Penguins and Hornqvist can agree on a 5 year/$25M deal, then I'd be fine with keeping him.

I'd much rather have Hornqvist on the third line than Hagelin in the top-six. I like Hagelin, but if it means keeping Hornqvist, then I'm all for moving him. He can always be replaced by Sheary or Rust. That gives you incredible depth on the RW with Kessel, Hornqvist and hopefully Sprong. Moving Sheary and Rust over to LW helps balance the loss of Hagelin.

 

[Don'tcry4mejanhrdina]

How much do you guys think Cole would be worth? It would suck to lose him, especially since there's no immediate replacement for him within the organization.

I agree with moving Hags before losing Horny. His speed and defensive play are huge attributes to how the Pens want to play but he needs to be producing more. Archibald would be a guy who could step in and replace some of what Hags already does. We don't have that for Horny or Cole as of now.

 

[Talisman]

Please JR.

CROSBY
MALKIN
DUCHENE
SHEAHAN

 

[Fordy]

in no way does horny bring intangibles, he brings 100% tangibles every night and they need to keep him

 

[chethejet]

GMJR has to balance winning a cup with maintaining a talent flow. Who is replaceable with younger cheaper players is needed to keep the party going.

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

How much do you guys think Cole would be worth? It would suck to lose him, especially since there's no immediate replacement for him within the organization.

I agree with moving Hags before losing Horny. His speed and defensive play are huge attributes to how the Pens want to play but he needs to be producing more. Archibald would be a guy who could step in and replace some of what Hags already does. We don't have that for Horny or Cole as of now.

I think his absolute mininum that he will get is 4x4 and thats probably a hometown discount. Hes been a rock in the way that GMs love.

 

[Shockmaster]

Please JR.

CROSBY
MALKIN
DUCHENE
SHEAHAN

You really need to let go of the Duchene thing. He'd be a luxury the Penguins can't afford.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Sheahan is going to cause some issues for our cap with his extra year.

I don't understand this. What extra year are you referring to?

 

[Shaffer]

Please JR.

CROSBY
MALKIN
DUCHENE
SHEAHAN

Please JR.

CROSBY
MALKIN
DUCHENE
MCDAVID

 

[Ugene Magic]

As long as Hornqvist is on the team no matter where he is slotted is all that matters. He's the only one of his ilk. Remember 2009 when they had depth after additions.

Depth is never a bad thing when talking about trying to win cups.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Yes... and unless we want Hunwick/Ruhwedel as our 3rd pairing, we need to find a replacement for Cole (one that we can afford).

Love Cole, but I'm fine with Hunwick and Ruhwedel on the bottom pairing if they maintain their present standard. There's also the possibility of a guy like Bengtsson coming up.

 

[AjaxTelamon]

Yeah, they need to re-sign him. Sid might not enjoy playing with him, but we can and will have to go with PH on Sid's line for certain matchups, in case of injury, etc. I'd part with Hagelin way before PH.

 

[Shaffer]

Honestly if I was the coach I would only play Reaves against harder hitting teams with another grinder on the other team. ETC Oilers and Jets.

Guentzel-Crosby-Hornqvist
Rust-Malkin-Kessel/Sprong
Sheary-Sheahan-Sprong/Kessel
Hagelin-McKeeg-Archibald/Reaves

At the draft we should trade Hags. A mock trade would be around Hags to Avs for their fourth. Then Avs could retain 50% off of Hags and trade him at the 2019 deadline. Di Pauli is like a clone to Hags just a little slower though. He should be able to replace what Hags does. I don’t see a fit for ZAR next year unless we don’t sign Hornqvist or we have 3 guys hurt. Hornqvist NEEDS to be resigned. Rumored is cap is going up to 80m so we would have enough room to upgrade Horny by 750k-1.25m.

 

[Jacob]

Love Cole, but I'm fine with Hunwick and Ruhwedel on the bottom pairing if they maintain their present standard. There's also the possibility of a guy like Bengtsson coming up.

Don't like it.

Hunwick's a #6 and Ruhwedel's a #7.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Reaves should go to the highest bidder with the longest term. He's a guy surviving NHL 4th lines. The lifespan of the career is not guaranteed. It would be stupid to not go to the highest bidder and Reaves seems like a very intelligent guy. I think he can cash in with the perception to other GMs that he's protecting Sid/Geno each night, even if fans can see through it.

Btw - the game last night which had bad blood last year was very relaxed. Credit due? Meh probably not but I did like the fact it was very relaxed because a **** fest with the Jets is not what we need for our injured reserve list.

I don't know. Laraque went to the highest bidder and his career died right there and then because the team that he went to didn't even know how to use him. Sometimes, the grass isn't always greener on the other side. Eric Godard made out much better than BGL, and has a Cup ring to prove it.

If Reaves wins a Cup ring this year, I agree he could take the money and run. To which I'd say, thanks for the help and best wishes.

If he does not win the Cup this year, he may see Pittsburgh as his best shot.

Hornqvist scored the Cup winning goal not playing with Sid last I checked. This isn’t James Neal where if he’s removed from playing with an all world talent, he disappears.

I get being hesitant to keep him in terms of the cap and as he ages, but he’s still worth quite a bit to this team no matter where he plays.

I also have a feeling the same posters using this logic of linemates, will be *****ing if/when we lose a series because of “perimeter play”. “The goalie saw every shot”. Etc.

This is nonsense. Jake Guentzel alone will ensure that we don't play on the perimeter. Plus, guys like Rust and Sheary move from outside to the scoring areas and in front of the crease very regularly.

The whole narrative that led to the Neal-for-Hornqvist deal in the first place is no longer valid. We are not that team anymore.


And to be perfectly honest, if Sullivan were coaching us, then maybe James Neal has a Cup ring; maybe Jarome Iginla has one, too.


WAY too much credit has been given to Hornqvist for changing our fortunes from playoff failures to champions. It was mostly Sullivan's doing.

Hopefully they're scouting Erik Haula.

I'll never understand why people think we need Duchene or Galchenyuk. We need a good two-way center, not defensive liabilities. There's a reason they acquired Sheahan.

Duchene is not a defensive liability. He's a top player on a bad defensive team. There's a difference.

And, the reason why we acquired Sheahan is because he only cost us Scott Wilson and a pick downgrade.

If Galchenyuk were worth only Wilson and a pick downgrade, he would be wearing No. 27 and centering our third line tonight.

So out of curiosity, who would this board sign if you could only choose one?

Horny: the best in the league at what he does, near impossible to completely replace, but older, more expensive, and harder to fit into our lineup

-or-

Rust: younger, faster, easier to move around in the lineup, and cheaper, but not as unique of a player and not as proven of a 20g scorer and Horny

This is a fairly easy answer. You keep the younger, quicker, more versatile and CHEAPER player every day, all day.

Meh. I'd "settle" for Karlsson.

I'd settle for Oscar Lindberg, a legitimate playmaker who seems far more comfortable at center than at wing.

I think it really depends on what happens this playoffs. If we have another deep run and Rust puts up another 6 or 7 goals, I don't know if he is going to be worth what he is going to cost.

Like Hornqvist is clearly the better player, but at the same time we know for a fact he is going to be a 20 goal scorer most seasons and I don't think his game really "ages".

Hornqvist is not clearly the better player.