The NJ Devils Goaltender Thread

[None Shall Pass]

I don't know how you could, with a straight-face, say anything definitive about either of our goalies after the past two weeks. They're both giving up like 4+ goals a game. That goes beyond goaltending. That's a team issue.

I'm not saying either is great, good, average, poor, or awful. I'm just saying that right now, it is nearly impossible to come to a fair conclusion.

 

[AfroThunder396]

It ends this June.

Really confident that it's gonna happen.

Maybe August (or whatever the second buyout window is) at the latest.

If he does win one more game, they should just shut him down after that and let him go out on a high note, but he's early 2010's Ricky DiPietro bad at this point. And since I'm supposed to disregard his save percentage since 2016 since he's been injured, even with that Islanders game, he's an .897% the last 3 games since coming back.

Buying out Cory this offseason means $2M in dead cap space for the next SIX years. Between that, Kovalchuk's recapture, and Cammalleri's buyout (which we're still going to have for 2 more years) that's nearly 5% of our cap space tied up in buyouts.

There's no way out of his contract that doesn't hurt the team just as much as playing him.

 

[Bleedred]

Buying out Cory this offseason means $2M in dead cap space for the next SIX years. Between that, Kovalchuk's recapture, and Cammalleri's buyout (which we're still going to have for 2 more years) that's nearly 5% of our cap space tied up in buyouts.

There's no way out of his contract that doesn't hurt the team just as much as playing him.

It hurts more to play him.

Once again, he’s the worst player at the most important position in the game. We’d need the Marty of old to be able to absorb the blow of having to have him on the roster. Like when Marty would play 73-77 games and we didn’t care who the backup was because we’d never see him.

It wouldn’t even be the biggest buyout. Yashin’s was almost identical and that was 12 years ago when the cap was much lower. It will likely be the last buyout for a while and Cannalleri’s ends in two more years. Kovalchuk’s is peanuts.

Other than LTIR (which doesn’t look like it’s happebing as of now) there is no other solution other than to throw him in Binghamton. I’d personally be okay with carrying his cap hit for at least one year just to not play here at all, as it’s his spot on the team that hurts much more than his current salary. It’s about getting rid of a net negative who plays the most important position in the game. Not freeing up money.

The cap will probably be $95-$100 million by the last year or two of his $2 million buyout hit. It’s went up about $15 million in the last 6 years.

 

[MadDevil]

That’s funny. Because I’m almost as tired of having to read every excuse for him. From “He’s not Vezina level but he’s fine” to “The defense is bad” to “He’s been injured” and everything else.

He plays the most important position in the game and he’s arguably the worst in the league at that position. He’s a net negative at this stage.

Who is actually saying that anymore? Just because somebody doesn't post his stats for the last 100 games every time he gives up a goal doesn't mean they're making excuses for him.

 

[Nubmer6]

Buying out Cory this offseason means $2M in dead cap space for the next SIX years. Between that, Kovalchuk's recapture, and Cammalleri's buyout (which we're still going to have for 2 more years) that's nearly 5% of our cap space tied up in buyouts.

There's no way out of his contract that doesn't hurt the team just as much as playing him.

We have the cap space. I'd rather be eating his full salary the next 3 years than to be partially on the hook 6 years down the line when we could possibly need the cap space.

Does he have a no movement clause, and would that prevent us from demoting him? Maybe we can somehow end up LTIRing him.

 

[Bleedred]

Who is actually saying that anymore? Just because somebody doesn't post his stats for the last 100 games every time he gives up a goal doesn't mean they're making excuses for him.

Just the fact that people are afraid to take a buyout on him like we’re actually barely clearing the cap ceiling.

This is what you gotta ask. Do you want his dead cap hit on the books? Or do you want him to hurt our chances of being competitive next year or god forbid in future years? It would be one thing if he were plateauing in decline but he’s not. He’s not hurting us anymore this year, that’s done and over. The damage was done in November. And not only was he unplayable, he also caused Kinkaid to have to play more games than he should be playing because of it.

He’s gotta go. It would be different if he was a guy you can shelter, but you can’t shelter a player at position unless 1997-2010 Marty is coming back to play 72-77 games every year.

 

[Bleedred]

We have the cap space. I'd rather be eating his full salary the next 3 years than to be partially on the hook 6 years down the line when we could possibly need the cap space.

Does he have a no movement clause, and would that prevent us from demoting him? Maybe we can somehow end up LTIRing him.

I wouldn’t be opposed to eating his salary for at least a year, maybe two and see if we can amnesty buyout him. There’s really no way to do that without burying him in the AHL though. Which I don’t agree with either. I think that’s more humiliating than just buying him out and giving him a chance to continue elsewhere. I think he gets a one year deal at league minimum to back up, but even the chances of that are going down. Especially the longer he goes without a two point decision and other teams have access to his play over the last 25-30 games and will likely be 40 games by then, if he doesn’t hit a major hot streak.

For me, I’m more interested in shedding a bad player from the team than getting rid of his salary. That’s the bigger deal here. Much like when we eliminated Zubrus before th 15-16 season and carried his full cap hit than year.

 

[Bleedred]

Since I talk enough about Cory's save percentage over the last however many games, Keith's have been dropped into a minefield since about the second week of December. They've been pretty bad since around Thanksgiving actually, but he was still at a league average save percentage through December 15th after 26 games. It was a .906% and the league average was .907% on that date. His save percentage is .865% over his last 14 games since that date. His season save percentage seems to sink a point or two almost every game, outside of a couple 1 and 2 goal games since then. It even came up with the Pittsburgh and Carolina games, then went right back down.

It seems while there's a group of people who believe Cory will be useful again, there's possibly an even bigger (or at least more vocal) group that use the defense as an excuse to absolve Kinkaid of blame.

And I do think it's perfectly reasonable to cut him a bigger break than Cory. He's paid much less, he's actually had an extended streak of good hockey in the last year, where Cory really hasn't. We're probably in Cory's best 4 game regular season streak since December of 2017 right now. And he didn't sign up for this job. When he got his deal it was to be the backup, but this run is just proving that a backup is all he is and we need to be happy that we didn't prematurely jump the shark by giving him a 2-3 year extension for $2.5 million (or more) per year after how hot he was from February of 2018 until about November or December of 2018.

I personally think we cooked him. He's not a goalie that you can get favorable results with while using 30-40 games in a season two years in a row. I do think he could be a decent to even a strong backup for a few more years in the league after this, but this season really is gonna stain his resume and lessen the benefit of the doubt if he has another poor season a couple years down the road, which could lead to the shortening of his shelf life and lack of interest from suitors around the league as he gets into his 30's. It's also cost him a good contract after this year. I can't see anyone going two years for him after this or a raise from his current deal.

 

[haak84]

Since I talk enough about Cory's save percentage over the last however many games, Keith's have been dropped into a minefield since about the second week of December. They've been pretty bad since around Thanksgiving actually, but he was still at a league average save percentage through December 15th after 26 games. It was a .906% and the league average was .907% on that date. His save percentage is .865% over his last 14 games since that date. His season save percentage seems to sink a point or two almost every game, outside of a couple 1 and 2 goal games since then. It even came up with the Pittsburgh and Carolina games, then went right back down.

It seems while there's a group of people who believe Cory will be useful again, there's possibly an even bigger (or at least more vocal) group that use the defense as an excuse to absolve Kinkaid of blame.

And I do think it's perfectly reasonable to cut him a bigger break than Cory. He's paid much less, he's actually had an extended streak of good hockey in the last year, where Cory really hasn't. We're probably in Cory's best 4 game regular season streak since December of 2017 right now. And he didn't sign up for this job. When he got his deal it was to be the backup, but this run is just proving that a backup is all he is and we need to be happy that we didn't prematurely jump the shark by giving him a 2-3 year extension for $2.5 million (or more) per year after how hot he was from February of 2018 until about November or December of 2018.

I personally think we cooked him. He's not a goalie that you can get favorable results with while using 30-40 games in a season two years in a row. I do think he could be a decent to even a strong backup for a few more years in the league after this, but this season really is gonna stain his resume and lessen the benefit of the doubt if he has another poor season a couple years down the road, which could lead to the shortening of his shelf life and lack of interest from suitors around the league as he gets into his 30's. It's also cost him a good contract after this year. I can't see anyone going two years for him after this or a raise from his current deal.

This is fair. I think Kinkaid had a shot at being a starter if this team was good. He played fine until they were just outmatched by better and more talented teams. Unfortunately it didn’t pan out and I think his confidence is shot and it may take a while to have another shot at being a starter. Wherever that may be. It may not even occur. Given the state of goaltending across the league, I wouldn’t be surprised if it happens within the next couple years though. It’s a lost season, my take is, Kinkaid played well when the team was competitive. Thats all he should have been asked to do.

 

[Wingman77]

Even if it is just 2 in a row, for this team and more importantly Cory, a nice stepping stone and it is great to see.

Hopefully he finds more of his groove and comfort level because it would be really nice to continue to see him regain some form and be a reliable option on this team again.

Keep battling Cory!

 

[Emperoreddy]

Even if it is just 2 in a row, for this team and more importantly Cory, a nice stepping stone and it is great to see.

Hopefully he finds more of his groove and comfort level because it would be really nice to continue to see him regain some form and be a reliable option on this team again.

Keep battling Cory!

He does seem to be seeing the puck better. It might take more time physically (if it ever recovers), but the mental part was a big big issue.

 

[NJDevs26]

Well this is Cory's job-saving stretch drive. A few good weeks and the talk of buying him out and burying him in the minors goes away.

 

[Better Call Sal]

Cory reverting back to his normal self would please me to no end.

The Ginger Ninja Rises Again

 

[Scooooooooooooot]

Cory with a .925 sv % since coming back, love to see it.

 

[Bleedred]

Well this is Cory's job-saving stretch drive. A few good weeks and the talk of buying him out and burying him in the minors goes away.

If he can play like this for the remainder of the year, I'd hold off on buying him out, but I also wouldn't feel comfortable with him going back to being the clear cut starter next year, because the sample size of his good play would still be too small to wanna rely on him.

I am at least coming around to keeping him for at least another year, assuming he looks close to this good for the remainder of this year, but I still want a pretty good insurance policy behind him and I'm not sure Blackwood is that just yet and I know for a fact that Kinkaid is not that.

I think Keith might be cooked for the rest of this season, but even he may have a couple good games like he did against Carolina, especially if he isn't playing almost every night.

I've made this comparison a lot, but I see Cory right now as on par with later career Marty, who certainly had good streaks and even months and extended months of good play at the end.

 

[Whaddagoal]

Did anyone notice Cory's puck handling skills behind the net seem improved the last two games...... Tonight's game he seemed a lot more thoughtful with the puck behind the net, or maybe it's just me...

(I mean, better, relative to his own skills back there -- which are probably his worst attribute of his skillset).

I think in the game tonight vs. Buf, there was maybe only one play back there that was slightly dicey, the rest were pretty good reads...

 

[Bleedred]

Did anyone notice Cory's puck handling skills behind the net seem improved the last two games...... Tonight's game he seemed a lot more thoughtful with the puck behind the net, or maybe it's just me...

(I mean, better, relative to his own skills back there -- which are probably his worst attribute of his skillset).

I think in the game tonight vs. Buf, there was maybe only one play back there that was slightly dicey, the rest were pretty good reads...

I haven't really had a problem with Cory's puck handling for a while. He's been pretty alright with it for several years now. Not great, but not a liability either. I think he credited Chris Terreri with helping him with it. He's made the occasional gaffe with it, but nothing too bad.

Keith's the last two games were really a problem. Particularly against St. Louis, where he had a couple weak clears that went unnoticed due to a goal not happening because of them, like a couple of the others ones that did cause a goal.

 

[SJinNewJersey]

Cory has been great the last two games. But what happens now if he has a clunker or two the next couple times out? Are we going to say he is done and the last two games were a fluke or what?

 

[Bleedred]

Cory has been great the last two games. But what happens now if he has a clunker or two the next couple times out? Are we going to say he is done and the last two games were a fluke or what?

He’s probably somewhere in between. Which is why when I recite his sava percentage over the last 100+ games it’s over the last 100+ games and not the last 25 or whatever it was before he came back from injury the last time. He’s probably not as bad as he was to start the season, but I don’t think he’s this good anymore either.

I do think it’s possible he plays at a .920% level the rest of the year to push his save percentage for the season up what he is at this point in his career.

 

[None Shall Pass]

One thing you can't discount regarding Cory's performance over the past two(-ish?) seasons is that we know that he was playing with some sort of injury before the offseason surgery.

He's not young (Not old either), but he still doesn't have a lot of miles on him, either.

He looks like a different guy after coming back. He's seeing the puck better, being aggressive, moving quicker. He has confidence in himself and his body finally. I think he's still got something left.

 

[Nubmer6]

One thing you can't discount regarding Cory's performance over the past two(-ish?) seasons is that we know that he was playing with some sort of injury before the offseason surgery.

He's not young (Not old either), but he still doesn't have a lot of miles on him, either.

He looks like a different guy after coming back. He's seeing the puck better, being aggressive, moving quicker. He has confidence in himself and his body finally. I think he's still got something left.

I never understood the "not a lot of miles on him" argument. He may not have a lot of NHL miles, but it's not like he didn't play in the minors and in college. Are NHL games that much tougher on the body than the other leagues?

 

[Devilsfan118]

It would be the most "Cory Schneider" thing ever for him to rattle off 10 meaningless wins in his next 15 starts to push us out of a top-5 pick.

I mean, to be clear: I love the guy, and want nothing more (both for him and the Devils) than for him to find his game and return to form. But seriously, we don't need an extended winning streak right now. To draft anything but, really, top-2 would be such a f***ing shame after this dumpster fire of a season.

This blows. I want Cory to win, but the Devils need to keep their shot at a top pick.

 

[Nubmer6]

I love how Cory wins his first start since 2017 and he goes from the worst goalie in history to driving us out of being able to draft a good player.

This board really needs to even out its highs and lows.

 

[MartyOwns]

is there an easy way to bookmark all the posts in this thread at once?

 

[Triumph]

The Devils can't have a higher than 30% chance at a top 2 pick. They never had a realistic shot at finishing last overall, so decrease that even further.

This team is still quite bad and gets outshot every night. They will continue to lose games. Cory Schneider will go back to being meh, if not terrible.