Stop responding to Shaman, he’s a red wings fan that hates everything red wings
The Future is Promising
- Thread starter ThankGord
- Start date
If the young players learn and grow, we could ice the exact same team next year and goal differential would improve (not to mention our defense being shredded with injuries all year). Improvement doesn't always have to come from outside.
Snuggs
Registered User
- Jun 24, 2018
- 2,272
- 1,088
I get your point my man, but dude. How can you compare a expansion team to the rest of the league? An Edmonton? Really, really? They're terrible there, crying outload they traded Hall who the next year was a Heart trophy winner... Lol.
Buffalo you've got a point I think. But man, the Red Wings aren't comparable in anyway to Vegas/Edmonton. Edmonton is like... Idk, the NYK's or SUNS... even our own LIONS, they're just a very very poorly ran sports franchise.
Shaman464
No u
Nashville:
Johansen 4th overall
Forsberg 11th overall
Ellis 11th overall
Turis 3rd overall
They seem to have a few former really high end picks on their team. They also have made some trades that I doubt Holland would make (Jones, Weber, Legwand, etc). They also have some of the best scouting and development staff for defensemen, which gives them a competitive edge. For elite prospects, they have developed more high end defenders in the last 2 decades than Detroit has developed high end players.
Vegas hasn't had time to build a prospect pool.
Edmonton is what we should be afraid of, because their management has the problem of not being willing to make timely moves to improve themselves, and sit on their drafted talent. Imagine not trading Taylor Hall after he had his worst season of his career. They also had pretty bad luck, the 2012 was an abortion of a draft for top end talent.
Shaman464
No u
Except it usually does. Every team at the top has made trades to get players to get them over the top. And, statistically, its unlikely that most of the "young" players are going to get that much better. Most players make their most significant statistical progress between 18 and 23, peak 23-27. As for the defense, Green isn't going to get better next season, he'll be 34. Daley won't be either at 36. Kronwall seems to want to come back, he's nearly 40, and Ericsson isn't likely to retire either. That's 4 of the 6 defenders right there. Hronek looks really good, but Detroit needs to fill 4 of their 6 defenders positions including possibly 2 top pairing defenders.
Shaman464
No u
I wouldn't consider him a core piece. He's a complementary player. Not every player, even good ones, are core players. Ovie, Backstrom, Kuznetsov, Carlson are their core. Understanding that is how teams like the Hawks and Pens were able to extend their contention windows, by knowing who is their core, and who are the replacement parts.
You're treating your opinions as facts and contradicting yourself. You're wary of Edmontons approach because they weren't willing to make trades, but then wonder what they'd be like if they didn't trade Hall (improved by 40 points as a 25/26 year old).
He was a big contributor in them winning the Stanley Cup, ask any Caps fan and they'll tell you how integral he was to them winning. He might not be one of their most talented players but he was one of the biggest reasons they had success.
You look at life with no milk.
Shaman464
No u
Just like Sharp and Byfuglien were major parts of Chicago's runs, and Flurey and Orpik were major parts of Pen's runs. Players can be big contributors, but that doesn't make them core players.
DetroitRed
Crashes the Crease
I want to agree with them on one thing in particular: Blashill is extended because he has demonstrated through Bertuzzi, Mantha, Athansiou and Larkin, that he can develop players. I'm still a good bit skeptical about Blashill in other areas, but I think they got that right.
On the whole though, these men seemed.. I guess intoxicated is the word I want to use here. I mean, there certainly are some reasons for optimism, and I feel optimistic even in 28th place, but these gentlemen were basically frolicking giddily around lala-land with rose-colored glasses on and not giving a shit. They didn't even mention anything that didn't support their argument, they were simply pushing a narrative , no critical thinking at all. That's not a good thing.
On the whole though, these men seemed.. I guess intoxicated is the word I want to use here. I mean, there certainly are some reasons for optimism, and I feel optimistic even in 28th place, but these gentlemen were basically frolicking giddily around lala-land with rose-colored glasses on and not giving a shit. They didn't even mention anything that didn't support their argument, they were simply pushing a narrative , no critical thinking at all. That's not a good thing.
Shaman464
No u
Not if they didn't trade Hall, but why that didn't trade him sooner. They waited way too long to trade him, and when he regressed for a season then did it. It's not good asset management, which is Edmonton's biggest problem. There is no contradiction there.
Goalie guy
Registered User
You do know a player like that does not come along very often if ever right? So if you're pinning your hopes of a good team on Lid's 2nd coming I don't think it will ever happen here for a long long time.
Gotcha, may have misunderstood that. You think if they traded him earlier Chia would've gotten a better return than Larsson?
Shaman464
No u
Which is why they need to trade for one. That's what I meant by being aggressive. Holland can't be worried that AA could be a 35 goal scorer, when he could trade him after a 30 goal season for a defender (as an example).
Shaman464
No u
They trade him two seasons sooner and they are trading a player with two over ppg seasons, instead of one that had a massive regression and then a better season. An 80 point player in 13-14 is basically a 90 pt player this season, and the return on that player is much better than a player wasn't even close to a ppg in the two seasons prior to the Larsson trade. And that's not going into him being younger, and having more years of RFA control, which are two more huge pluses.
Except their GM rewarded him with a 6 year contract.
Kuze, Carlson, and Wilson's contracts all expire the same year.
Shaman464
No u
That will be their Abdelkader contract. Except Abdelkader actually put up slightly better points over his career.
Except Wilson was 24 when he signed it and had an improved season this year after having done so. But yea, exactly the same.
Just like Hronek and Cholowski are probably gonna be Smith and Kindl, everything is so exactly the same.
obey86
Registered User
- Jun 9, 2009
- 8,013
- 1,274
Wake me up when someone of Dahlin's caliber becomes available on the trade market.
Shaman464
No u
obey86
Registered User
- Jun 9, 2009
- 8,013
- 1,274
We were talking about Dahlin specifically. An 18/19 year old super prospect. Those aren't available for anything.
Karlsson is available this offseason, and most people here (mostly the tanking crowd) don't even want to sign him even if he was interested.
So, since you're clearly not impressed with any of our prospects (save Zadina) or young players (save Larkin) and think the rebuild is going nowhere, what would you do?
Shaman464
No u
Teams sign and overpay role players. Its a pretty common thing that happens when teams are on top. JT Miller got a similar contract last season, and now a year later Bolts fan are identifying him as the odd man out.
And they could be, Hronek probably not, but Cholo still hasn't established himself in the NHL, and until he does, he hasn't even earned what Smith has.
