The Cap ($69M)... and it's going hurt the Bruins

[norwegianbruinsfan86]

Wanna know what screwed the team's cap?

NHLPA didn't invoke the 5% escalator.

That's a huge hit on the cap. That's more than Kelly's salary

How much money are we talking about here? In the 5M region?

 

[JAD]

Don’t need to make decisions in haste that don’t call for haste … PC’s got all summer and training camp to figure this out … at least until rosters need to be submitted. Especially as other teams determine their needs and then what they are willing to give up. It should prove to be an interesting off season.

 

[Salem13]

"I'm concerned, but I think it's a challenge we can overcome," Boston Bruins GM Peter Chiarelli said. "It was supposed to be 70, it's 69, might've been 68. We planned for all those things. We have a challenge right now. It's just another component of the challenge."

We all have to sit back and wonder for a bit I guess.

 

[Bruwinz37]

Don’t need to make decisions in haste that don’t call for haste … PC’s got all summer and training camp to figure this out … at least until rosters need to be submitted. Especially as other teams determine their needs and then what they are willing to give up. It should prove to be an interesting off season.

Problem with waiting is that you lose the quantity of trade partners, you lose leverage and expose your RFA to offer sheets.

I see this as a manageable problem when looking at it as a one year scenario.....I see ask or problem when looking at it over the next two years.

 

[DominicT]

Why wouldn't Nhlpa invoke this?

Escrow. Players would have had to put all of it back into escrow

How much money are we talking about here? In the 5M region?

About $3.5 million

 

[JoeIsAStud]

we would never be able to go through a real season with a 21 man roster... you need to find at least a million dollars more to cut and probably realistically... 2 million more to cut

trying to go with a 21 man roster and only 500k to cover day-to-day injuries would guarantee zero wiggle room to make any type of deadline addition. once locked into this mess wed be at everyone's mercy

best to bite the bullet and deal away someone making 4 mill or more now... then use the ability to acquire someone with retained salary or a free agent that would take a bonus contract to replace the depth we are losing

That roster Bill posted is only 500K under the cap, but that includes Savard, so once they get to day 2 of the season they will be able to put Savard on LTIR and have plenty of money to play with

 

[Bruwinz37]

I still think Kelly is the linchpin. Move him, and him alone, and they've got a team that's under the cap.

CAPGEEK.COM ARMCHAIR GM ROSTER
CapGeek Armchair GM Roster
FORWARDS
Milan Lucic ($6.000m) / David Krejci ($5.250m) / Loui Eriksson ($4.250m)
Brad Marchand ($4.500m) / Patrice Bergeron ($6.500m) / Reilly Smith ($3.250m)
Ryan Spooner ($0.760m) / Carl Soderberg ($1.008m) / Matt Fraser ($0.688m)
Daniel Paille ($1.300m) / Gregory Campbell ($1.600m) / Justin Florek ($0.660m)
DEFENSEMEN
Zdeno Chara ($6.917m) / Johnny Boychuk ($3.367m)
Dennis Seidenberg ($4.000m) / Dougie Hamilton ($0.894m)
Torey Krug ($2.750m) / Adam McQuaid ($1.567m)
Kevan Miller ($0.800m) /
GOALTENDERS
Tuukka Rask ($7.000m)
Niklas Svedberg ($0.600m)
LTIR
Marc Savard ($4.027m)
BONUS OVERAGE
$4,750,000
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $69,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $67,410,000; BONUSES: $710,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $590,000

And that's with the full $4,750k cap penalty and giving Krug and Smith hefty raises.

I know that lineup isn't blowing anybody's skirt up, mine included, but as disappointing as it is, could you not say it's better than the team we thought we were starting with last season? I remember last summer some folks thought Soderberg would be back in Sweden by Christmas and that Reilly Smith was brought in to play with Carter Camper and Kelly was locked in as the 3C. But if the team listed above is the team we start with, the new Soderberg is a HUGE upgrade on Kelly as the 3c. Spooner and Fraser are last year's 3rd line unknowns (i.e. Smith/Soder). The D should be better as Dougie and Krug improve... Don't get me wrong, I want to see this team improve but I guess what I'm saying is the team above is the starting point for improvement, it's the worst case scenario, and it's not half bad.

Agreed this team doesn't have me dreaming of a parade.

I do think you are over shooting Smith by 750k.

 

[cat400]

Could it be possible that Kelly's injury will require him to be on LTIR at the start of the season and if so, what effect would it have on the Bruins salary cap?

 

[Central Scrutinizer]

Escrow. Players would have had to put all of it back into escrow



About $3.5 million

Thanks.

 

[RedeyeRocketeer]

Could it be possible that Kelly's injury will require him to be on LTIR at the start of the season and if so, what effect would it have on the Bruins salary cap?

Well not much really, specially if you think he can come back. But if by training camp he's actually still injured, and that being after a microdiscectomy, then you're potentially looking at the end of his career. People who don't recover well from that surgery don't just not get better, they typically get worse. And there's no point in operating again either. If he's done for the year, then the Bruins could perform the same gymnastics they played with Savvy. They demoted Krug/Hamilton on paper to the P, then LTIR'd Savy, then brought them back up. I guess in theory that could be done with both Savy and Kelly. But I suspect Kelly won't be a total write-off, and that realistically there's not going to be any sort of benefit here. He'll probably just play 60 +games (hopefully).

 

[DominicT]

Could it be possible that Kelly's injury will require him to be on LTIR at the start of the season and if so, what effect would it have on the Bruins salary cap?

Good question.

Curious to what some of the answers are

 

[EverettMike]

Good question.

Curious to what some of the answers are

I think his contract says that if he starts any season on LTIR, his salary is doubled in both dollars and length.

And that he gets immunity for all crimes in Massachusetts.

 

[Numbah4]

If Kelly is on LTIR, screws us in the summer. But, can make a trade as soon as the season starts.

 

[corpfan1]

Not sure I understand this lineup. It is short $3.5M. Must account for Savard's contract. Can't LTIR him before the season starts.

I still think Kelly is the linchpin. Move him, and him alone, and they've got a team that's under the cap.

CAPGEEK.COM ARMCHAIR GM ROSTER
CapGeek Armchair GM Roster
FORWARDS
Milan Lucic ($6.000m) / David Krejci ($5.250m) / Loui Eriksson ($4.250m)
Brad Marchand ($4.500m) / Patrice Bergeron ($6.500m) / Reilly Smith ($3.250m)
Ryan Spooner ($0.760m) / Carl Soderberg ($1.008m) / Matt Fraser ($0.688m)
Daniel Paille ($1.300m) / Gregory Campbell ($1.600m) / Justin Florek ($0.660m)
DEFENSEMEN
Zdeno Chara ($6.917m) / Johnny Boychuk ($3.367m)
Dennis Seidenberg ($4.000m) / Dougie Hamilton ($0.894m)
Torey Krug ($2.750m) / Adam McQuaid ($1.567m)
Kevan Miller ($0.800m) /
GOALTENDERS
Tuukka Rask ($7.000m)
Niklas Svedberg ($0.600m)
LTIR
Marc Savard ($4.027m)
BONUS OVERAGE
$4,750,000
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $69,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $67,410,000; BONUSES: $710,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $590,000

And that's with the full $4,750k cap penalty and giving Krug and Smith hefty raises.

I know that lineup isn't blowing anybody's skirt up, mine included, but as disappointing as it is, could you not say it's better than the team we thought we were starting with last season? I remember last summer some folks thought Soderberg would be back in Sweden by Christmas and that Reilly Smith was brought in to play with Carter Camper and Kelly was locked in as the 3C. But if the team listed above is the team we start with, the new Soderberg is a HUGE upgrade on Kelly as the 3c. Spooner and Fraser are last year's 3rd line unknowns (i.e. Smith/Soder). The D should be better as Dougie and Krug improve... Don't get me wrong, I want to see this team improve but I guess what I'm saying is the team above is the starting point for improvement, it's the worst case scenario, and it's not half bad.

 

[JAD]

Problem with waiting is that you lose the quantity of trade partners, you lose leverage and expose your RFA to offer sheets.

Maybe, maybe not. Then again new trade partners could emerge.

Leverage? All the other teams know Boston’s cap problems – so Boston doesn’t really have a whole lot of leverage to begin with.

RFA offer sheets? Could happen … they still got a little bit of time before that is allowed, and then they could always make a trade and then match. Gross overpayment by another team? - a chance they might have to take.

All I am saying is there is no panic to have to do something this weekend … there is time enough to work this out

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

That roster Bill posted is only 500K under the cap, but that includes Savard, so once they get to day 2 of the season they will be able to put Savard on LTIR and have plenty of money to play with

he put savard onto the ltir already

 

[Bruwinz37]

Maybe, maybe not. Then again new trade partners could emerge.

Leverage? All the other teams know Boston’s cap problems – so Boston doesn’t really have a whole lot of leverage to begin with.

RFA offer sheets? Could happen … they still got a little bit of time before that is allowed, and then they could always make a trade and then match. Gross overpayment by another team? - a chance they might have to take.

All I am saying is there is no panic to have to do something this weekend … there is time enough to work this out

There really is no maybe. The ideal time to deal is before UFA begins. More options. Less options = buyers market.

I am not suggesting panic.... Just a sense of urgency.

 

[Fire Sweeney]

Maybe, maybe not. Then again new trade partners could emerge.

Leverage? All the other teams know Boston’s cap problems – so Boston doesn’t really have a whole lot of leverage to begin with.

RFA offer sheets? Could happen … they still got a little bit of time before that is allowed, and then they could always make a trade and then match. Gross overpayment by another team? - a chance they might have to take.

All I am saying is there is no panic to have to do something this weekend … there is time enough to work this out

Most rosters will be 90 % set after this week's signings. The Bruins won't sign anyone and won't even be able to ice their current roster if they don't act.

 

[smithformeragent]

Now, if they don't exercise the LTIR from the start, doesn't the amount they can exceed the cap by grow exponentially?

I seem to remember the Penguins having something like $20 million in "cap space" at the deadline a couple of years back because Malkin had spent so much time on the IR.
Can someone explain? If that's the case, would the B's be better suited to start the season with a weaker roster and then take on some pieces at the deadline?

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

Why wouldn't Nhlpa invoke this?

players have been grumbling for a few years now why they keep bargaining in good faith for a certain number individually... and then not getting their money when their paychecks show up.

I remember joe thornton a couple years ago saying that he had lost over a million dollars because of escrow.

one of the guys In florida got very vocal about it a couple years ago too... but then shut up. it appeared from the outside to me that someone might have leaned on him and told him to shut up?

there was a reason why the union sort of had to allow the escalator clause in the past... because to NOT use it would result in teams forcing a lot of guys into retirement. whenever the cap doesn't grow there are a lot of vets that suddenly become very expendable.

owners love shinny new toys and are willing to throw a lot of money at glamorous players like first line superstars and fresh hot draft picks but owners don't like being told that they have to give 3 mill to some third line plug.

gm's on the other hand know that spending 3 mill on a non-sexy third line plug is often the way to win a cup. teams like boston/Chicago/la all have very expensive vets on the third/fourth lines

so there is a reason why both the league and the nhlpa have wanted to use the escalator clause {league likes it because it makes the league look healthier and lures new sucker owners into buy the leagues weaker teams from club members looking to bail from these big money losing investments}

the rank and file of the nhlpa though have been split about this for sometime and it doesn't shock me at all that they have finally put their foot down

 

[robert terwilliger]

I think his contract says that if he starts any season on LTIR, his salary is doubled in both dollars and length.

And that he gets immunity for all crimes in Massachusetts.

and he will personally go around to the home of every bruins fan and drink the last of the orange juice but leave the empty carton in the fridge.

 

[smithformeragent]

This helps answer my question...

http://www.capgeek.com/faq/how-does-long-term-injured-reserve-LTIR-work

 

[JAD]

The ideal time to deal is before UFA begins. More options. Less options = buyers market.

Well personally I was hoping they would have packaged the 25pick this year with a player or two - for a young right winger and a defenseman, both with potential, on cap friendly contracts also getting a second rounder back next year.

But anyway, I agree something will most likely happen before UFA begins. Maybe something put in place this weekend – announced Monday?

 

[smithformeragent]

Just taking a quick look at capgeek, there are a lot of teams in salary cap trouble.

Not quite as severe as the Bruins, but still not great.

We could see some absolute steals in free agency.

 

[LSCII]

It's a sweet position our supposed capologist has put this team in, no?