The All Purpose Pens Off Day(s?) Thread - Injuries, Practice, Injuries, Lines, More Injuries, etc

[Peat]

I think it's safe to assume that the Penguins are planning on their defense being Dumoulin-Letang, MP-Marino and POJ with a RD. I don't know who that RD would be, they don't really have any RD prospects coming up that I think would fit there (I think Gudbranson would have been a great fit there, but whatever). I think Rielly is their only RD prospect too. POJ is in the same mold as Pettersson (lanky 2-way D that skates well and has a good outlet pass), so you probably need a similar complement for POJ as you would need for Pettersson.

I certainly don't miss Gudbranson because he had an ass contract, but someone exactly like Gudbranson would be a welcome addition for that bottom pair. Gudbranson actually had a fairly solid season with the Ducks this year, with being basically fine at ES and being great on the PK in terms of analytics while playing 20 minutes a night against 2nd pair competition. In hindsight, it may have been smarter to move Marino or Schultz to LD for a year and trade JJ instead of moving Gudbranson.

The 20/20 hindsight move would have been to move Schultz and keep Gudbranson. We'd have got the exact same results at worst and have a lot more assets to play around with. Cap space problems would look tighter next season mind.

That's really 20/20 mind.

 

[Ryder71]

The 20/20 hindsight move would have been to move Schultz and keep Gudbranson. We'd have got the exact same results at worst and have a lot more assets to play around with. Cap space problems would look tighter next season mind.

That's really 20/20 mind.

Why is your name ''peat'' just curious?

 

[Peat]

Why is your name ''peat'' just curious?

Because I was built out of Irish bog and Islay whisky by a mad witch on a storming night. Like a golem, but with none of the good qualities.

 

[Ryder71]

Because I was built out of Irish bog and Islay whisky by a mad witch on a storming night. Like a golem, but with none of the good qualities.

Well, I guess that clears that up.

 

[tkeagle]

Because I was built out of Irish bog and Islay whisky by a mad witch on a storming night. Like a golem, but with none of the good qualities.

HA! Made me laugh, thank you.

Unless you are...serious...in which case...

...now I'm scared...

 

[Ryder71]

If the Pens lose to the Habs, we'll have a 12.5 % chance to draft 1st overall.

 

[Khelandros]

Well, I guess that clears that up.

Or Repeat was taken already.

 

[Gurglesons]

The 20/20 hindsight move would have been to move Schultz and keep Gudbranson. We'd have got the exact same results at worst and have a lot more assets to play around with. Cap space problems would look tighter next season mind.

That's really 20/20 mind.

We’d also have Pettersson - Gudbranson and Johnson - Marino as two of our pairings which is absolutely frightening.

 

[EVGENIMERLIN]

POJ is a leftie. I think either you misremembered this or they made a typo.

Yeah my bad was probably left side, but they see him as the third paid guy

 

[Andy99]

If the Pens lose to the Habs, we'll have a 12.5 % chance to draft 1st overall.

As I mentioned in the other thread, so would Montreal...they’re nowhere close to winning a Cup...lots of incentive for them to tank this qualifying round and get a 12.5% chance at a local top player, the best they’re ever going get...

 

[Peat]

We’d also have Pettersson - Gudbranson and Johnson - Marino as two of our pairings which is absolutely frightening.

Both pairings with fine underlying stats. Hell, JJ-Gudbranson had fine stats too. Now, those were in small samples and positive conditions, but even so, not frightening in my book. But even if it was, even with major regression, they'd still not be worse than JJ-Schultz. I'd be no more scared walking into the playoffs with that quartet than I'd be with one containing JJ-Schultz.

And if you're going to be afraid of your defence, you might as well at least pick the option that gets you most assets i.e. trading Schultz while the world thought he held value.

 

[Gurglesons]

Both pairings with fine underlying stats. Hell, JJ-Gudbranson had fine stats too. Now, those were in small samples and positive conditions, but even so, not frightening in my book. But even if it was, even with major regression, they'd still not be worse than JJ-Schultz. I'd be no more scared walking into the playoffs with that quartet than I'd be with one containing JJ-Schultz.

And if you're going to be afraid of your defence, you might as well at least pick the option that gets you most assets i.e. trading Schultz while the world thought he held value.

This is one of those times where the stats aren't telling the full picture.

 

[Peat]

This is one of those times where the stats aren't telling the full picture.

They are when it comes to JJ and Schultz. An absolutely putrid pairing that makes each player much worse.

And tbh, I think they were very much telling the full picture when it came to Pettersson and Gudbranson, albeit they got to do it in a much more rigid structure than we've played this season, and I didn't see too much wrong with JJ-Marino, largely because Marino looked capable of carrying him. Which Schultz can't.

 

[Gurglesons]

They are when it comes to JJ and Schultz. An absolutely putrid pairing that makes each player much worse.

And tbh, I think they were very much telling the full picture when it came to Pettersson and Gudbranson, albeit they got to do it in a much more rigid structure than we've played this season, and I didn't see too much wrong with JJ-Marino, largely because Marino looked capable of carrying him. Which Schultz can't.

We have yet to really see a healthy JJ and Schultz pairing. And having a Pettersson - Marino pairing that can play heavy defensive minutes will help lightening up that load.

Our defense is light years ahead of where it was last year regardless of what the statistics stay.

 

[Peat]

We have yet to really see a healthy JJ and Schultz pairing. And having a Pettersson - Marino pairing that can play heavy defensive minutes will help lightening up that load.

Our defense is light years ahead of where it was last year regardless of what the statistics stay.

They were bad before Schultz ever broke his leg. In the games this season where they were seriously paired before Schultz got injured, they never had more than 50% of the scoring chances. A month after Schultz returned this season after injury they were reunited for five games and were bad again. Unless you think Schultz has simply never been healthy this season at all, we've seen ample and it's been bad.

And if you think he's never been fit this season at all, why the hell would you argue with 20/20 hindsight being trade him at the start of the season before other teams realised and go with someone who wouldn't have performed worse than not quite right Schultz?

The defence is light years ahead of last year, but that's on Marino and the forwards in front of them committing to actually playing defence. It has absolutely nothing to do with moving Gudbranson and keeping Schultz.

 

[Gurglesons]

They were bad before Schultz ever broke his leg. In the games this season where they were seriously paired before Schultz got injured, they never had more than 50% of the scoring chances. A month after Schultz returned this season after injury they were reunited for five games and were bad again. Unless you think Schultz has simply never been healthy this season at all, we've seen ample and it's been bad.

And if you think he's never been fit this season at all, why the hell would you argue with 20/20 hindsight being trade him at the start of the season before other teams realised and go with someone who wouldn't have performed worse than not quite right Schultz?

The defence is light years ahead of last year, but that's on Marino and the forwards in front of them committing to actually playing defence. It has absolutely nothing to do with moving Gudbranson and keeping Schultz.

I think Schultz fits the system we ran this year way more than Gudbranson would have and having JJ and Gudbranson all year would've significantly damaged our record regardless of the "assets".

 

[Giant Yankee Pens]

The turning point of this season imo was trading Guds for a 7th (when people thought we may have had to pay for someone to take him) and allowing Marino a spot.

I would rather bank on Schultz style of play as a bottom pairing D (like in 2016) than having two guys like JJ and EG in our D. Play Dumo Letang 25 mins, Pets Marino 20 mins and JJ JS 15 mins (with 2-3 mins being PK PP).

 

[EightyOne]

We also moved the very meh maatta

 

[Peat]

I think Schultz fits the system we ran this year way more than Gudbranson would have and having JJ and Gudbranson all year would've significantly damaged our record regardless of the "assets".

We didn't watch the same Schultz fam. People overtalk how bad he was but fitting the system? Nope. Didn't see it. Can't see any stats that support it. His ability to exit the zone quickly, to gain it, to push the pace of play, looked pretty damn average at best. He's been a guy that needs to be carried by his partner. He's probably a better system fit than Gudbranson but not way more, and almost certainly not to a degree that would have significantly damage our record, because for both of them who they're stood next to is by far the most important factor.

p.s. In the 7 games both were in the team this season, underlying stats favoured Gudbranson over Schultz. But not insignificant.

 

[Gurglesons]

We didn't watch the same Schultz fam. People overtalk how bad he was but fitting the system? Nope. Didn't see it. Can't see any stats that support it. His ability to exit the zone quickly, to gain it, to push the pace of play, looked pretty damn average at best. He's been a guy that needs to be carried by his partner. He's probably a better system fit than Gudbranson but not way more, and almost certainly not to a degree that would have significantly damage our record, because for both of them who they're stood next to is by far the most important factor.

p.s. In the 7 games both were in the team this season, underlying stats favoured Gudbranson over Schultz. But not insignificant.

Have we gotten to the point where we are saying Ian Cole carried Justin Schultz now?

 

[Peat]

Have we gotten to the point where we are saying Ian Cole carried Justin Schultz now?

No, but that was a long time ago now. That wasn't the same Schultz as the one we just got.

 

[Gurglesons]

No, but that was a long time ago now. That wasn't the same Schultz as the one we just got.

True. Schultz’s contract has been a disaster since the first year. That being said, I see no reason why we would have kept Gudbranson over him without knowing the player Marino would become.

And I don’t think it is surprising that Gudbranson has looked decent while playing with two similar puck moving defensemen in Pettersson and Lindholm. I know they used Fowler with him as well.

I don’t see the reason of basing a pairing around the weakest player either. I’d much rather have a strong top four and gamble with JJ and Schultz.

 

[Peat]

True. Schultz’s contract has been a disaster since the first year. That being said, I see no reason why we would have kept Gudbranson over him without knowing the player Marino would become.

And I don’t think it is surprising that Gudbranson has looked decent while playing with two similar puck moving defensemen in Pettersson and Lindholm.

As I said, this is 20-20 hindsight. At the time, keeping Schultz and trading Gudbranson sure looked the right move. I didn't realise Marino would be this good and I didn't realise Schultz would be this meh. It's a move I'd change if we had a time machine, not one I'm particularly criticising based on knowledge at time of move.

And absolutely having a puck moving dman has helped Gudbranson a ton... just that now Schultz needs that PMD a lot too. That's the big thing.

 

[Giant Yankee Pens]

Schultz averaged 14+ mins a night after he was traded here in 15-16. He averaged 19+ this season playing mostly second pair with Pets. I would bet that JS is still capable of playing 15 mins of third pairing offensive match ups now too.

 

[StroShow]

There is a pay-wall so wasn't able to read the entire thing but the caption says Bjugstad is not out for the entire season as first expected. And there is other injury updates in the article as well.