The all-purpose: Alexander Wennberg thread

Discussion in 'Columbus Blue Jackets' started by Palm Tree, Oct 12, 2018.

  1. Viqsi

    Viqsi IA IA BLUEJACKETS FHTAGN

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2007
    Messages:
    36,886
    Likes Received:
    5,265
    Trophy Points:
    205
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    Jackets 1st, Preds 2nd
    Location:
    Kölumboos
    It would certainly explain why there's so many folks who keep repeating arguments based exclusively on the themes of "ONLY ONE GOAL OMG" and "but William Karlsson" and "he doesn't hit people so he's soft".
     
  2. CBJWennberg10

    CBJWennberg10 Most Positive CBJ poster

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2009
    Messages:
    24,178
    Likes Received:
    2,379
    Trophy Points:
    156
    Gender:
    Male
    I bet he never scores a goal ever again.

    I’ll double down and say I bet he never does a good hockey play ever again. All he knows how to do is lose face offs, and do cute dog videos for Stanley steamer.

    Am I doing this right?
     
  3. thebus88

    thebus88 18/19 Blue Jackets- Sustain the Unsustainability

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,875
    Likes Received:
    638
    Trophy Points:
    84
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Michigan
    The defense and defenders are becoming laughable at this point.

    And, while there are a few people that focus a bit too much on a few quite "redundant" or "unimportant" aspects, of the issues with Wennberg, there are PLENTY of people who go into detail and have explained IN DEPTH the issue that they feel/AND ARE THERE with Wenny. And some have been saying it for a while.

    And all you are doing is DEFLECTING from the FACT that BOTH are actually right. You attempt to shut down BOTH sides with this simplistic, "Hur Dur"...."OMG"....BS. When its actually all true.

    The "goalposts" continue to be moved farther and farther by the last defenders of the "Swedish Filatov". Think of what would be and was said to the people 1-2-3 years ago that would say what is NOW majority opinion on Wennberg. "They" were supposedly wrong then and now the same, LITERAL "OMG, HATERS!!" defense, is all they have going against them.

    Cant even make the DEFLECTING "secondary assists" jokes when he's not even getting those, eh?
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2019
  4. thebus88

    thebus88 18/19 Blue Jackets- Sustain the Unsustainability

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,875
    Likes Received:
    638
    Trophy Points:
    84
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Michigan
    WHAT DOES HE DO WELL?!

    Other than being an above average skater and above average passer that cant put himself in the position to use either attribute on a consistent basis.

    He has simply average defensive ability and awareness. In relation to your average NHL player he is soft. And comparing him to Datsyuk in ANY WAY is ridiculous. Especially if you are trying to relate them in regards to a ****ing stick lift. This is the ****ing NHL.

    Cant wait for the, "I told ya so".

    Umby, Wizzy, Joey, Wenny, Bobby....oh my. AND BYE BYE.
     
  5. CBJWennberg10

    CBJWennberg10 Most Positive CBJ poster

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2009
    Messages:
    24,178
    Likes Received:
    2,379
    Trophy Points:
    156
    Gender:
    Male
    Okay. You're just making things up now.
     
  6. WerenskiRules

    WerenskiRules HFBoards Sponsor Sponsor

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2013
    Messages:
    3,913
    Likes Received:
    802
    Trophy Points:
    125
    Occupation:
    Department of Justice
    Location:
    Raleigh, NC
    Wennberg does a lot of things very well, skilled skater
    However, His inability to even be a scoring threat, let alone actually score, is a huge problem
    He's between a third and forth line center, with second line center salary
    Not good
     
    Palm Tree likes this.
  7. Monk

    Monk Registered User

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2008
    Messages:
    4,166
    Likes Received:
    806
    Trophy Points:
    139
    I'd take Wennberg over Datsyuk for sure.
     
  8. thebus88

    thebus88 18/19 Blue Jackets- Sustain the Unsustainability

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,875
    Likes Received:
    638
    Trophy Points:
    84
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Michigan
    No I'm not, YOU ARE. Its not always about you. There is 1 poster for sure who has done it multiple times, and it irks me. He is 1 of you. One of the last Wennycans. I wont call him out, but, its not too hard to find with the numbers with what they are nowadays.

    Anything else to add to actually debate anything I said?? Or just another LITERAL "OMG!!" response/defense??
     
  9. CBJWennberg10

    CBJWennberg10 Most Positive CBJ poster

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2009
    Messages:
    24,178
    Likes Received:
    2,379
    Trophy Points:
    156
    Gender:
    Male
    You won’t call him out, yet you do so by name calling. Okay then. Do it or don’t. And nobody has ever said Wenny > Datsyuk
     
    WubbaLubbaDubDub likes this.
  10. Double-Shift Lasse

    Double-Shift Lasse Just post better

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Messages:
    24,269
    Likes Received:
    1,875
    Trophy Points:
    196
    Location:
    Semirural Cbus
     
  11. leesmith

    leesmith Still in.

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2005
    Messages:
    21,172
    Likes Received:
    994
    Trophy Points:
    169
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Columbus, Ohio
    Swedish Filatov sounds like a good name for a band
     
    thebus88 likes this.
  12. EDM

    EDM Registered User

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    4,747
    Likes Received:
    505
    Trophy Points:
    139
    Face it, I was prescient when I nicknamed “Pooh”.
     
    thebus88 likes this.
  13. Cyclones Rock

    Cyclones Rock Registered User

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2008
    Messages:
    6,625
    Likes Received:
    1,856
    Trophy Points:
    157
    Great stuff.

    Wennberg has 1 even strength goal in his last 61 regular season games.
     
  14. MoeBartoli

    MoeBartoli Chex-to-Jax

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    4,322
    Likes Received:
    1,740
    Trophy Points:
    126
    If Gomez can bag a second in a year, I think Wennberg can do it in half that time.
     
  15. Double-Shift Lasse

    Double-Shift Lasse Just post better

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Messages:
    24,269
    Likes Received:
    1,875
    Trophy Points:
    196
    Location:
    Semirural Cbus
    Wennberg needs put back in that net-front role he manned for a couple of surprisingly productive weeks last year. Let him use his ability to read the play but force him to do it in an engaged rather than passive manner.
     
  16. Cyclones Rock

    Cyclones Rock Registered User

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2008
    Messages:
    6,625
    Likes Received:
    1,856
    Trophy Points:
    157
    You are the eternal optimist:laugh:

    He'll probably go on a 10 goals in 7 games tear.
     
  17. MoeBartoli

    MoeBartoli Chex-to-Jax

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    4,322
    Likes Received:
    1,740
    Trophy Points:
    126
    Fixed your post with a few emojis. :thumbu:
     
  18. WubbaLubbaDubDub

    WubbaLubbaDubDub And that's why I always say, Shumshumschilpiddydah

    Joined:
    May 25, 2012
    Messages:
    10,475
    Likes Received:
    1,313
    Trophy Points:
    140
    Location:
    C-137
    He's talking about me. And I've said multiple times I'm not comparing them skill wise, simply their defensive play styles.


    And I love all this hate after last night when he was put on a line with Panarin and Duke and the line looked like a legitimate threat almost every time they were on the ice together.


    *Insert line about how Panarin/Duke were carrying the line and Wennberg was just a passenger and how Wennberg sucks because he can't score a goal.


    Also for the millionth time, if Wennberg was "just okay" defensively, he wouldn't be put on the PK when there are other options to be put out there.
     
    Fairwhether, seneca, Viqsi and 2 others like this.
  19. Viqsi

    Viqsi IA IA BLUEJACKETS FHTAGN

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2007
    Messages:
    36,886
    Likes Received:
    5,265
    Trophy Points:
    205
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    Jackets 1st, Preds 2nd
    Location:
    Kölumboos
    There are indeed valid arguments that reflect poorly on Wennberg. But when it's pointed out that said arguments are not necessarily fatal to a productive NHL career (albeit one not as productive as we would hope), I've yet to see a followup response outside of a return to "ONE GOAL SOFT SOFT ONE GOAL KARLSSON GOAL ONE KARLSSON".

    Expectations are lower for the guy. That's undeniable. Sometimes, however, even a player that isn't turning out as desired is still useful.

    Yep. Because the whole debate is BS. The in-depth arguments are acknowledged and pointed out as unfortunate but not crippling, and that gets ignored in favor of the whining. The threshold for "failed player" is being set ludicrously high here.

    * * *​
    You're criticizing his positional awareness now? That's like criticizing Josh Anderson's ability to push to the net and battle in hard paces - it's, like, the biggest defining feature that makes him particularly useful.

    If you can't see that, no wonder you think he's hopeless.
     
  20. major major

    major major Registered User

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2013
    Messages:
    14,598
    Likes Received:
    1,662
    Trophy Points:
    139
    Wennberg and Atkinson are almost always together shorthanded, and so far they're 3 goals for and 3 goals against. Pretty good for down a man.
     
  21. thebus88

    thebus88 18/19 Blue Jackets- Sustain the Unsustainability

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,875
    Likes Received:
    638
    Trophy Points:
    84
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Michigan
    Now lets see Dubinsky's numbers playing with Atkinson.

    Over a short and long period of time.

    Actually, looking back, other than the Calvert-Dubinsky-Atkinson line being good, I'm pretty sure in the past, Dubi and 1 of those guys actually used to score "often" on the PK.
     
  22. thebus88

    thebus88 18/19 Blue Jackets- Sustain the Unsustainability

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,875
    Likes Received:
    638
    Trophy Points:
    84
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Michigan
    This right here is the heart of the issue.

    #1, he isnt that good positionally, especially in the defensive zone, ESPECIALLY around the net where he gets pushed around and outmuscled regularly. That is IF he has made the correct "read", picked up the correct "open" man and is in position to make a play, which more often does not happen.

    #2, THIS IS THE ****ING NHL. If "positional awareness" is considered his, "biggest defining feature" (small step back from "playmaker"/"passer") and what, "makes him particularly useful", then there is a legit problem with him having a 5 mil cap hit. Its almost the same as Hannikainen being a good forechecker. To be clear, Wennberg > Hannikainen.

    For all the "pumping of the brakes" I've asked for on Anderson, I take him 10/10 over Wennberg. To compare a legit strength that Anderson uses on a *nearly* nightly basis to make an "impact" or at least make "something" happen, to Wennberg's supposed "advanced awareness" is..... something.....I would not do.

    AND TO ADD, "battling in hard places", is 1 of the main things we are talking about when we call Wenny "soft, or the "Pooh"..
     
  23. Viqsi

    Viqsi IA IA BLUEJACKETS FHTAGN

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2007
    Messages:
    36,886
    Likes Received:
    5,265
    Trophy Points:
    205
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    Jackets 1st, Preds 2nd
    Location:
    Kölumboos
    Wait. Wait. This is like saying "so-and-so has a bad shot because he's skating slowly". The one does not follow from the other.

    Wennberg doesn't do the "living impassable barrier" space denial thing; he's an active stick-checker. It's a different but still valid style of defensive play. All the "you can't get to the high slot because I'm in your face" play doesn't help if the other guy can get a pass off, or gets the puck knocked away or his stick lifted just before the shot. Physicality may sometimes be more interesting to watch, and it's a completely valid play style (despite what the anti-Dubi camp might suggest), but that doesn't automatically mean it's a prerequisite for effectiveness.

    He makes the right reads for his approach to defense. And the numbers show it's working.

    I take it you therefore have similar issues with Ryan Suter and Ryan Murray? Because that's a large part of what defines those guys' effectiveness on the ice as well.

    ...except that that is a legit strength of Wennberg's. :dunno:

    I get that. But it's also completely irrelevant. It's like accusing Dubinsky of being a useless plug because he can't dangle the puck. That's not his game, and it doesn't need to be his game for him to be an effective contributor.
     
  24. thebus88

    thebus88 18/19 Blue Jackets- Sustain the Unsustainability

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,875
    Likes Received:
    638
    Trophy Points:
    84
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Michigan
    In the defensive zone, ESPECIALLY around the net, you can get PHYSICALLY REMOVED from having the correct or dominant position. And with him it happens a lot. Again, that is IF he has already made the correct read. This "stick checker" thing is all great, IN THEORY. Again, he is NO Datsyuk or Bergeron, offensively OR defensively, SO LETS NOT ACT LIKE IT, k?

    The "numbers" show WHAT is working? The last Wennycans are having to deal with all this Wennberg "hate" because its NOT working. Remember that Bruce Garrioch "rumor", OH RIGHT, "oy vey, move along".

    You realize that as of 1/7/2019, BOTH of those guys, both two way defenseman, are outscoring Wennberg?

    Yea, ok its "his strength", how much does it help the team in relation to Anderson, and other guys' strengths?

    And, NO, its not irrelevant. Like Anderson, DUBINSKY FILLS THE ROLE asked of him. What is Wennberg doing currently, that his "awareness" or other "strengths", are helping him be a "effective contributor" on the team?
     
  25. Viqsi

    Viqsi IA IA BLUEJACKETS FHTAGN

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2007
    Messages:
    36,886
    Likes Received:
    5,265
    Trophy Points:
    205
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    Jackets 1st, Preds 2nd
    Location:
    Kölumboos
    Oh, c'mon. That's a silly comparison. Dubinsky is no Ryan Getzlaf, offensively or defensively, but he still provides a similarly effective physical game.

    And you keep saying "if" even though he consistently does so. Just because he doesn't get into position to make a hit doesn't mean he's out of position or has misread the play.

    No, that's coming up because folks are bitter that he's only scored one goal, and they can't get past that.

    And? They're better players. The point wasn't one of "ha ha wennberg is better than these guys", it was "the skillset that Wennberg has that you are dismissing as irrelevant also distinguishes these Really Good Players."

    Diversity of approach. I believe that it's important to have a variety of skills available on one's roster, because even though there's some chemistry benefit to be found from most folks going in the same direction, it also makes your team easier to counter - counter the One Style and the team is done. Diversity breeds strength. In games where Dubinsky's approach is ineffective, Wennberg's can help the team win. In games where Wennberg isn't as helpful, Dubinsky can help the team win. Obviously, you'd ideally want someone who can help you win regardless, but that's like wanting a 30+ scorer on every line - it's nice and desirable but not really a realistic end to be sought.

    Defending. Supporting play in the offensive zone. Covering for our pinching blueliners with consistency.

    Honestly, if I didn't think such moves were generally silly and doomed to failure, I might have suggested we try moving him to defense by now. ;)
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice
monitoring_string = "358c248ada348a047a4b9bb27a146148"