Prospect Info: Thatcher Demko

mossey3535

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Feb 7, 2011
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I would trade Marky and Gamble at the trade deadline only if Demko plays this way until the. . People are and will probably blast me for this but we don’t have much cap space and I know it’s only been 3 games but Demko looks like he is ready for a breakthrough. But I would wait until the deadline before we trade Marky and only if Demko maintains this great play we have seen the last 3 games. Not if but when he continues to play this way the rest of the season trade Marky and get back a great return . Benning has definitely improved his trading lately. See the Leivo, Miller and Pearson trades as examples of that

Exactly. But Green has to play ball and actually start Demko. Otherwise we won't know. That's part of why I put the extra 0.5 seasons in my assessment. That is a huge factor and I don't actually trust Green to do it.
 

VanJack

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Jul 11, 2014
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I get it that we're still early in the schedule....but so far Markstrom and Demko might be one of the best 1-2 goalie tandems in the league. Don't know if it can last, but stellar goaltending can carry a team a long way if it does.
 
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Brock Boeser Laser Show

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because he'll be 31 by the end of that? if he has a poor season he is then a 31 year old in the summer without a contract.

well he’s gonna end up in Seattle if he signs for more than 1 year. What I’m suggesting is a gentleman agreement where I hope both parties are men of their word.
 

PuckMunchkin

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Exactly. But Green has to play ball and actually start Demko. Otherwise we won't know. That's part of why I put the extra 0.5 seasons in my assessment. That is a huge factor and I don't actually trust Green to do it.

Can you tell me anything about Demko's rebound control so far this year?

To my untrained eye, he is doing fantastic stopping the initial shot, but the rebounds are night-and-day worse than Markströms. Am I way off mark (no pun intended)?

well he’s gonna end up in Seattle if he signs for more than 1 year. What I’m suggesting is a gentleman agreement where I hope both parties are men of their word.

So even if he falls of a cliff as a goalie we still sign him to starter money?
 

LordBacon

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Thatcher seems to be a smart and calm goalie,
Still has some refining to do but I think if you give him two more seasons to develop he’ll be a starter for us for a really long time.
Great for a 2nd round pick.
 

F A N

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Aug 12, 2005
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Thatcher seems to be a smart and calm goalie,
Still has some refining to do but I think if you give him two more seasons to develop he’ll be a starter for us for a really long time.
Great for a 2nd round pick.

Demko is living up to his promise, but the Canucks did use a premium pick on him. Got to thank Calgary for choosing Mason McDonald. Credit to Benning for prioritizing goaltending.
 

Bleach Clean

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Aug 9, 2006
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Markstrom is arguably the best goalie in the league aside from John Gibson at this point, if you can get value for Demko (similar age and potential winger or defender) you do it.


I'd rather they trade Markstrom for a defender. Demko doesn't have the track record to warrant a significant return.

It's a very difficult trade though because Benning's job may be on the line. I think he would bank on self-preservation and just deal with the situation at the end of the year rather than recoup value mid-season.
 

VancouverJagger

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I'd rather they trade Markstrom for a defender. Demko doesn't have the track record to warrant a significant return.

It's a very difficult trade though because Benning's job may be on the line. I think he would bank on self-preservation and just deal with the situation at the end of the year rather than recoup value mid-season.

Agree completely and it would be awesome if he could get a top 4 D for him however I feel the probability of this happening as very low. I just don't see them flipping either this year. Best case I think in regards to this is we re-sign Markstromm later this season for 2-3 years and then flip him at the draft for assetts. Even that to me seems like a stretch for this management group.
 

DL44

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Can you tell me anything about Demko's rebound control so far this year?

To my untrained eye, he is doing fantastic stopping the initial shot, but the rebounds are night-and-day worse than Markströms. Am I way off mark (no pun intended)?

I agree with you... I'll let mossey speak to the technical side of it cuz he's pretty on top of it...
But I feel better with Marky in there... Rebound control seems better and he seems so strong at sealing the bottom of the net in those goal mouth scrambles. His battle level seems higher than it was last year - moving very quick and crisply in scrambling back into position.

Demko's start to the season has been an awesome revelation and provides a greater confidence boost than I expected to have with him..

My evaluation is based on observation feels tho.. people don't like that... I'll defer to mossey.
 
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bandwagonesque

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I'd rather they trade Markstrom for a defender. Demko doesn't have the track record to warrant a significant return.

It's a very difficult trade though because Benning's job may be on the line. I think he would bank on self-preservation and just deal with the situation at the end of the year rather than recoup value mid-season.
Teams in playoff contention don't trade their starting goaltenders, especially when they are among their most valuable players. Benning's job may well be on the line and he may be focused on self-preservation, but failing to trade Markstrom obviously wouldn't necessarily be attributable to this.
 
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PuckMunchkin

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I agree with you... I'll let mossey speak to the technical side of it cuz he's pretty on top of it...
But I feel better with Marky in there... Rebound control seems better and he seems so strong at sealing the bottom of the net in those goal mouth scrambles. His battle level seems higher than it was last year - moving very quick and crisply in scrambling back into position.

Demko's start to the season has been an awesome revelation and provides a greater confidence boost than I expected to have with him..

My evaluation is based on observation feels tho.. people don't like that... I'll defer to mossey.

I dont like observation feelings. Most people do.
 

mossey3535

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Demko's rebound control is coming along. He is getting better at involving his stick but he is part of a generation that really keyed in on using their pads. He's not as good at it right now compared to Marky but remember Marky's improvements have been huge over the last two years.

I would say he's quite good at trapping pucks against his body in general for shots from knees to shoulders. In fact, you'll see I've hardly mentioned rebound control at all in my posts the last three games and I actually highlighted some good rebound control saves he made.

One thing I will say though is that he is trying to calm down a tendency to reach/stretch and open up. What that does is reduce your chances of controlling the rebound.
 

elitepete

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Demko is living up to his promise, but the Canucks did use a premium pick on him. Got to thank Calgary for choosing Mason McDonald. Credit to Benning for prioritizing goaltending.
Agreed.

But if Demko becomes the goalie that I think he will become, he would be worth it even if we took him 10-15 overall.
 

mossey3535

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Feb 7, 2011
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If you want to play the rebound game, here is typical goalie coach criteria in order of most desirable to least desirable:

1) Catch it.
2) If onto upper torso or midsection, cradle and hold rebound against body.
3) If on ice, use stick to direct rebound, ideally to short side.
4) if pad level, flare butterfly to direct rebound to short side

Semi-controlled rebounds should have, in order:

1) direction (i.e. not into slot)
2) velocity (hot rebounds are harder for opposition to pick up
3) elevation

Special circumstances:
Shots off the boot are generally not controllable, but shots off the skate can be kicked.
Shots that make it past the pad rise and stick and hit the kneepads or bottom of the pants are unpredictable.

You can make a game of this and go through and grade each rebound, which is what many coaches do.

Goalie pads now are designed to give up long rebounds. If you see a big rebound, it is not automatically a 'bad' rebound. But a 3-6 ft rebound is just sits there is absolute death. It's too far away for you to reach, and is stationary so the forwards can easily skate into it for a shot. A 'hot' rebound is more likely to catch a skater by surprise. If the hot rebound has elevation, now the player has to bat the puck out of the air or block it and then control it. Those are precious seconds you can use for re-positioning.

The circumstances of the shot really dictate how much rebound you can control. If you are being deked on a break or semi-break, rebound control doesn't apply - you're just trying to make the first save. If the shot is mid to long range, then yes we can judge whether or not rebound control was adequate. A close range shot isn't subject to rebound control IMO.
 

Nucker101

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If Demko ends up having a really good season then I’d simply trade whoever has the most trade value
 
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If Demko ends up having a really good season then I’d simply trade whoever has the most trade value

I’d package him up for a Tanev replacement on the right side. Results and potential go at a premium return. Or use him as a cap dump to get rid of Loui to free up cap space.
 

Bleach Clean

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Agree completely and it would be awesome if he could get a top 4 D for him however I feel the probability of this happening as very low. I just don't see them flipping either this year. Best case I think in regards to this is we re-sign Markstromm later this season for 2-3 years and then flip him at the draft for assetts. Even that to me seems like a stretch for this management group.


The probability of it happening under Benning belies the logic that it would be a prudent move. People called this situation years ago and nothing has really changed. This team is 4 years a dumpster fire and 8 games into it's 5th year. The larger sample clearly shows how assets would be best utilized. Will they go that way? Not likely, as you said. Should they? Absolutely.

It's the same with Tanev. When a GM orchestrates moves so as to leave key blocks exposed, this is what happens.

This team is not asset rich. It has squandered futures and cap space for 6 offseasons. Can it afford to let an asset like Markstrom walk for nothing? Tanev? Let's see.
 

bandwagonesque

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The probability of it happening under Benning belies the logic that it would be a prudent move. People called this situation years ago and nothing has really changed. This team is 4 years a dumpster fire and 8 games into it's 5th year. The larger sample clearly shows how assets would be best utilized. Will they go that way? Not likely, as you said. Should they? Absolutely.

It's the same with Tanev. When a GM orchestrates moves so as to leave key blocks exposed, this is what happens.

This team is not asset rich. It has squandered futures and cap space for 6 offseasons. Can it afford to let an asset like Markstrom walk for nothing? Tanev? Let's see.
As far as I can tell no team in a playoff position has ever moved a star starting goaltender for futures. Assuming the Canucks are in playoff contention at the deadline, there would be absolutely no precedent for moving Markstrom and it's incredibly unlikely any GM in this position would do so. You know this.
 
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Bankerguy

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Apr 28, 2013
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Demko's great.
Only problem i noticed is that he tends to over-react when going side to side and this takes him a bit too far outside of his crease. It hasnt cost him a goal yet but i get nervous each time i see it and its happened 3 or 4 times
 

clay

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Aug 25, 2005
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I think he’ll be our starter next year. Don’t see how we’ll be able to afford Markstrom at $5M plus with the cap hell Benning has somehow created.
 

VancouverJagger

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The probability of it happening under Benning belies the logic that it would be a prudent move. People called this situation years ago and nothing has really changed. This team is 4 years a dumpster fire and 8 games into it's 5th year. The larger sample clearly shows how assets would be best utilized. Will they go that way? Not likely, as you said. Should they? Absolutely.

It's the same with Tanev. When a GM orchestrates moves so as to leave key blocks exposed, this is what happens.

This team is not asset rich. It has squandered futures and cap space for 6 offseasons. Can it afford to let an asset like Markstrom walk for nothing? Tanev? Let's see.

Yeah assett management is definitely not something our current regime has excelled in...........About the only time I can recall them doing a good job of this was the Burrows and Hansen trades (which at the time were lauded but have turned out like the rest of most of our moves.........meh).
 

forty47seven

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As far as I can tell no team in a playoff position has ever moved a star starting goaltender for futures. Assuming the Canucks are in playoff contention at the deadline, there would be absolutely no precedent for moving Markstrom and it's incredibly unlikely any GM in this position would do so. You know this.

There's precedent from like three years ago. Tampa traded Bishop for futures (Cernak) near the deadline when he was a pending UFA and Vasilevskiy showed he was capable of being a starter.
 

bandwagonesque

I eat Kraft Dinner and I vote
Mar 5, 2014
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There's precedent from like three years ago. Tampa traded Bishop for futures (Cernak) near the deadline when he was a pending UFA and Vasilevskiy showed he was capable of being a starter.
This is essentially completely false. Ben Bishop wasn't the starter and wasn't playing very well. He and Vasilievsky were sharing starts and I think Bishop had fewer starts at the time of the trade. Cernak was ranked as the Kings' 18th best prospect, not on Pronman's top 120, and was only part of the return, the main piece was another goaltender who started more games that season than Bishop with better statistics and who at the time of the trade was leading the league in shutouts. The trade was primarily made so the Lightning to avoid going into cap overage the following season. Yzerman was quoted by several sources as saying so. Also, the Lightning were nearly out of the playoff picture at the deadline that season.

Let's face it. You know Ronning on Empty's implication that Markstrom ought to be traded for younger assets regardless of where the team is at the deadline, and that failing to do so would represent a failure or unusual behaviour in a competent executive, is false. He knows it's false. This is exactly what people mean by toxicity. You're saying something you clearly know isn't true to make some larger point that nearly everyone understands anyway. Why go that far just to have one more grounds to criticize Benning that isn't even real? Aren't the legitimate ones enough? I don't get how it's worth it.
 
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