Sportsnet: Talking Calder last night.

[sIDEsHOW93]

What are you talking about?

van Riemsdyk-Bozak-Kessel lead the team to multiple playoff appearances.

Switch Kessel - Laine and same result, with perhaps a couple more goals

Multiple?

 

[WilliamNylander]

He averages 21m a game to our 3 guys with 21 and change or slightly over 22m? He plays stiff comp too! Matthews is not playing Kadri role of shutting down other teams top lines either. The guys the best out there right now, D is not easy to dominate and nearly impossible to do like he is at 19. He wins or should win in a fair and just world. Matthews and Laine have been great as well but at this point I need to see 75-85pts from either. Maybe the 40 goal mark would help the votes but Werenski deserves the hardware.

Matthews leads all toronto forwards in ice time per game.

Werenski is 4th on Columbus D in ice time per game.

This is literally the greatest Leafs rookie season ever. Matthews era adjusted goals would be ~55 goals in Wendel Clark's era.

Werenski is great but he does not deserve the calder. Matthews has almost as many even strength points as Werenski has total points! (and half of Werenski's points are on the PP).


You want more points...look at this.

Matthews has set up Hyman for 53 high danger scoring chances (Hyman is 3rd in the NHL after McDavid/Matthews). Hyman has only scored on 4 of them. If he was even a league average finisher, he would have 13 goals off of those high danger scoring chances...thats another 9-10 points for Matthews.

 

[thewave]

Matthews leads all toronto forwards in ice time per game.

Werenski is 4th on Columbus D in ice time per game.

This is literally the greatest Leafs rookie season ever. Matthews era adjusted goals would be ~55 goals in Wendel Clark's era.

Werenski is great but he does not deserve the calder. Matthews has almost as many even strength points as Werenski has total points! (and half of Werenski's points are on the PP).

Think of a top 4D teen rookie D that hit 50 pts and had great stats otherwise. Basically never happens, hardest position to learn and he is dominating it.

 

[WilliamNylander]

Think of a top 4D teen rookie D that hit 50 pts and had great stats otherwise. Basically never happens, hardest position to learn and he is dominating it.

Going back to 1995-96, 20 NHL D have had at least 38 points in their rookie season, lots with less power play time than Werenski. Phaneuf and Myers both had more points than him. I know its not the same # of points exactly but a lot of those rookie D men played a lot more minutes than Werenski does.

Want to know how many have rookie forwards have scored 35 goals since 1995-96?

Just Crosby, Ovechkin, and Auston Matthews.

 

[thewave]

Going back to 1995-96, 20 NHL D have had at least 38 points in their rookie season, lots with less power play time than Werenski. Phaneuf and Myers both had more points than him. I know its not the same # of points exactly but a lot of those rookie D men played a lot more minutes than Werenski does.

Want to know how many have rookie forwards have scored 35 goals since 1995-96?

Just Crosby, Ovechkin, and Auston Matthews.

Right and no D broke 50. He likely will so how do you compare that? Its an amazing thing to do and most teams don't even have a 50p D. Rielly has just 27 pts and is our "#1D". Jake just 36 as a vet on a high output team playing PP mins. Matthews is sheltered every home game and although its impressive doing that on D is more impressive. If he went PPG as well that's another story.

 

[ToneBone03]

Matthews leads all toronto forwards in ice time per game.

Werenski is 4th on Columbus D in ice time per game.

This is literally the greatest Leafs rookie season ever. Matthews era adjusted goals would be ~55 goals in Wendel Clark's era.

Werenski is great but he does not deserve the calder. Matthews has almost as many even strength points as Werenski has total points! (and half of Werenski's points are on the PP).


You want more points...look at this.

Matthews has set up Hyman for 53 high danger scoring chances (Hyman is 3rd in the NHL after McDavid/Matthews). Hyman has only scored on 4 of them. If he was even a league average finisher, he would have 13 goals off of those high danger scoring chances...thats another 9-10 points for Matthews.

This is mind boggling LOL

 

[WilliamNylander]

This is mind boggling LOL

I know lol I couldn't even believe it poor Matthews.

Here is the full article I got that from if you want to read it, its pretty good:

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/maple-leafs-wingers-best-fit-play-auston-matthews/

 

[Discoverer]

Going back to 1995-96, 20 NHL D have had at least 38 points in their rookie season, lots with less power play time than Werenski. Phaneuf and Myers both had more points than him. I know its not the same # of points exactly but a lot of those rookie D men played a lot more minutes than Werenski does.

Want to know how many have rookie forwards have scored 35 goals since 1995-96?

Just Crosby, Ovechkin, and Auston Matthews.

Why would you set the cutoff for a Matthews comp at his exact goal total and the Werenski comp at nine below his point total?

 

[WilliamNylander]

Why would you set the cutoff for a Matthews comp at his exact goal total and the Werenski comp at nine below his point total?

Because a lot of D were close to Werenski in terms of points but didn't play as many games.

For example Gostisbehere had 46 points but only played 64 games. Klingberg had 40 in 65. Shattenkirk was close, again not a full season. Then you take into account power play points (half of Werenski's points) compared to even strength (most of Matthews goals).

Hard to really compare in terms of rookie D points but there are a lot of D who had similar PPG to Werenski. This type of season is not really unheard of and certainly more common than what Matthews is doing.

 

[WilliamNylander]

This is another crazy stat. So Matthews, Ovechkin, and Crosby are the only rookies to score 35+.

Ovechkin had 52 goals (only 31 at even strength)

Crosby had 39 goals (23 at even strength)

Matthews has 35 goals (29 at even strength)

He might finish with more even strength goals than both Crosby and Ovechkin did as rookies...

 

[Discoverer]

Because a lot of D were close to Werenski in terms of points but didn't play as many games.

For example Gostisbehere had 46 points but only played 64 games. Klingberg had 40 in 65. Shattenkirk was close, again not a full season. Then you take into account power play points (half of Werenski's points) compared to even strength (most of Matthews goals).

Hard to really compare in terms of rookie D points but there are a lot of D who had similar PPG to Werenski. This type of season is not really unheard of and certainly more common than what Matthews is doing.

So set the cut-off for forwards at ~30 goals to account for the likes of Laine, Svatos, and Ryan, all of whom had more goals per game than Matthews. Otherwise you're making two completely separate arguments and manipulating the stats to try to prove your point.

 

[WilliamNylander]

So set the cut-off for forwards at ~30 goals to account for the likes of Laine, Svatos, and Ryan, all of whom had more goals per game than Matthews. Otherwise you're making two completely separate arguments and manipulating the stats to try to prove your point.

I guess. Then we have to factor in shooting percentage and many other associated factors. Probably too hard to compare.

I still think what Matthews is doing this year is a lot more impressive than what Werenski is doing.

We will see if the voters agree in a few months.

 

[thewave]

Because a lot of D were close to Werenski in terms of points but didn't play as many games.

For example Gostisbehere had 46 points but only played 64 games. Klingberg had 40 in 65. Shattenkirk was close, again not a full season. Then you take into account power play points (half of Werenski's points) compared to even strength (most of Matthews goals).

Hard to really compare in terms of rookie D points but there are a lot of D who had similar PPG to Werenski. This type of season is not really unheard of and certainly more common than what Matthews is doing.

But you can't diminish PP for a D like you can for an O. The reason is because QBing a PP is a special elite skill of it's own for D. Some diminish Nylander for PP points but reality is he is acting as QB for our team because he is that good.

 

[Apotheosis]

Matthews leads all toronto forwards in ice time per game.

Werenski is 4th on Columbus D in ice time per game.

This is literally the greatest Leafs rookie season ever. Matthews era adjusted goals would be ~55 goals in Wendel Clark's era.

Werenski is great but he does not deserve the calder. Matthews has almost as many even strength points as Werenski has total points! (and half of Werenski's points are on the PP).


You want more points...look at this.

Matthews has set up Hyman for 53 high danger scoring chances (Hyman is 3rd in the NHL after McDavid/Matthews). Hyman has only scored on 4 of them. If he was even a league average finisher, he would have 13 goals off of those high danger scoring chances...thats another 9-10 points for Matthews.

I am genuinely convinced that if you put Matthews with Marner and a winger who can score even at an average level, Marner and Matthews would score 90-100 points every season. That's in his ROOKIE SEASON. FFS.

 

[thewave]

I am genuinely convinced that if you put Matthews with Marner and a winger who can score even at an average level, Marner and Matthews would score 90-100 points every season. That's in his ROOKIE SEASON. FFS.

I highly doubt you mean this. I could see if Nylander or Marner were with Matthews all season he would have around 75-80 though. Sometime having two top end guys on a line just doesn't work as well.

 

[nsleaf]

Best rookie season the NHL has seen for a long time. Five guys in the mix for Calder and 3 play for the Leafs. Because of this it don't matter who wins.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Its looking like Matthews got it boys. He deserves it as a rookie and playing like this when we need it.

 

[WilliamNylander]

Werenski has been pointless in 5 straight, and has 1 point in his last 7 GP now. I'm not sure if he will get to 50 but it would be nice to see him hit 50 points the same night Matthews hits 40 goals.

 

[thewave]

Werenski has been pointless in 5 straight, and has 1 point in his last 7 GP now. I'm not sure if he will get to 50 but it would be nice to see him hit 50 points the same night Matthews hits 40 goals.

Matthews will take this title if he blows past 40 goals (70+ pts). Werenski will be the runner up which is fine but he has had quite the run. Producing down the stretch is what tips it back into Matthews hands while Laine is fading.

 

[daveleaf]

Playing the toughest position and in the toughest market and excelling I think Mathews is the clear winner. His all around game is impressive.

 

[MastuhNinks]

For a defensemen to win the Calder it normally takes two things: A) An exceptional season and B) No 'sexy' forward picks for the award.

Werenski has A but he isn't going to win in a year where there is a 1st overall pick rookie around 40G/70P leading his team from 30th place to playoff spot. The Calder is going Matthews guys (which, funny enough Wikipedia already lists him as the winner ).

 

[moon111]

If what you look for in a MVP is McDavid's performance, as a rookie with about 4 minutes less ice-time per game, Matthews cannot be denied the Calder.

 

[NewFang]

This is another crazy stat. So Matthews, Ovechkin, and Crosby are the only rookies to score 35+.

Ovechkin had 52 goals (only 31 at even strength)

Crosby had 39 goals (23 at even strength)

Matthews has 35 goals (29 at even strength)

He might finish with more even strength goals than both Crosby and Ovechkin did as rookies...

That first part is not true. Other rookies have scored 35+

 

[IBeL34f]

That first part is not true. Other rookies have scored 35+

It's supposed to be since 1995/96 or something, I think.

 

[WilliamNylander]

That first part is not true. Other rookies have scored 35+

Yeah I should've included the caveat of timing being since the 94-95 season.

Either way he leads every rookie since that 94-95 season in even strength goals now, he has passed Ovechkin and Crosby.