Subban Contract Talk VIII - Always darkest before the dawn...?

[sheed36]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-p...-bergevin--montreal-canadiens--211012830.html

Yeah MB will save lots in the long run after PK leaves as a UFA and plays for another team.

 

[Hoople]

Habs got a case.....i love Subban,i hope we can long term him..but he was gettin benched last yr....at 8-9 mill image..lol

Me too. It's a damn shame that Meehan is representing PK.

Hardballing down toward the path out of Montreal.

People should step away from this site for a moment and go to other non-Montreal hockey sites and read the reaction to this arbitration hearing.

He is a tad bit over-hyped in Montreal.

 

[Dr Gonzo]

Havent seen you posting that much lately.

Good to see you around.

I lurk. Been reading the goon thread, but didn't want to get involved since the battle lines were clearly already drawn out, and no one was budging.

 

[sheed36]

watch the video.

i see Timmins, Mallamby, Carriere and Bergevin...no idea who's the guy a 22 seconds.

no Dudley.

Just saw the video on TSN.

 

[RandR]

The Craig Button interview on TSN Radio was illuminating. He's been around, so it was nice to be reminded about how other player-team disputes haven't prevented other long term deals from being signed eventually.

I also thought that the frequent mention of Carey Price was important. Price is getting $6.5 million for another 4 years. If I remember correctly, LA told Doughty they wouldn't pay him more than Kopitar when he was holding out (they ended up doing so very slightly) and so I wouldn't be surprised if some of the management position is based on how much Subban will get compared to their other star player.

 

[overlords]

I lurk. Been reading the goon thread, but didn't want to get involved since the battle lines were clearly already drawn out, and no one was budging.

You also got ****ed by your ISP.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Me too. It's a damn shame that Meehan is representing PK.

Hardballing down toward the path out of Montreal.

People should step away from this site for a moment and go to other non-Montreal hockey sites and read the reaction to this arbitration hearing.

He is a tad bit over-hyped in Montreal.

If he goes, it will be the result of Bergevin's incomptence.

Lowball bridge
Goes to arbitration instead of paying 8.5 for this year

Totally ridiculous that you would put this on PK and Meehan, but I'm not surprised.

 

[Brainiac]

People should step away from this site for a moment and go to other non-Montreal hockey sites and read the reaction to this arbitration hearing.

He is a tad bit over-hyped in Montreal.

In fact, it's the opposite. Other fanbases can't believe how stupid our management is for letting this go that far.

 

[Habby Gilmore]

Is anyone else starting to lose respect for PK at this point? If he goes through this whole 48 hours and doesn't sign long term, I want him traded!

 

[Hoople]

Because his on-ice 5v5 sv% was 91.8. That's luck.

No, that's an excuse.

Was Murray's 92.1 sv% luck as well?

 

[Team_Spirit]

Is anyone else starting to lose respect for PK at this point? If he goes through this whole 48 hours and doesn't sign long term, I want him traded!

no.

losing respect for the owner of the franchise who milk us and wont pay his star.

 

[sheed36]

Is anyone else starting to lose respect for PK at this point? If he goes through this whole 48 hours and doesn't sign long term, I want him traded!

No....

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

In a perfect world where PK agreed to sign a long term deal, it would be a mistake.

But damn, PK demanded arbitration, got it, probably will continue to be a distraction for the Habs organization and he will need to be shopped for the best return possible.

Sucks for the Habs that he thinks he is in the same zip code as the two-time Cup winning Toews and Kane.

Because Toews and Kane won cups without a stellar support cast...

 

[Wats]

the only drama I see/hear about is from fans.

Hard to say the last 2 negotiations went swell. I don't think fans are the only ones paying close attention to all this...I think this is enough to be considered hockey drama.

5 year deal and Subban/Bergevin have a good relationship with no hard feelings or distractions to the team outside the final year assuming Habs wait to extend him unlike most other teams who won't wait. Seems like a more realistic scenario for a long term commitment vs the garbage we've seen last 3 years that no other big market team does with their best players. Maybe just me.

 

[Roulin]

No, that's an excuse.

Was Murray's 92.1 sv% luck as well?

Yes, Murray's was poor luck as well. As Bourque's 95.1 was good luck. On-ice save % for non-goalies fluctuates wildly, it's not a repeatable skill.

 

[Hoople]

If he goes, it will be the result of Bergevin's incomptence.

Lowball bridge
Goes to arbitration instead of paying 8.5 for this year

Totally ridiculous that you would put this on PK and Meehan, but I'm not surprised.

Common sense would say that if PK is asking for $8.5 million for a RFA year, he is probably asking well above $10 million for his UFA years.

The leftover Cap is around $11. That would hamstring this team and would not give Bergevin an opportunity to improve this team.

We would be in the same situation as last season. Good enough to make the playoffs and a small run. But not good enough to win the Cup. The only difference would be PK enjoying his overflowing wealth.

No thanks.

 

[the]

Is anyone else starting to lose respect for PK at this point? If he goes through this whole 48 hours and doesn't sign long term, I want him traded!

I've gained respect for him the day he took that lowball bridge contract!

 

[Le Barron de HF]

Would you guys do Eric Staal and Justin Faulk for PK & DD?

 

[WeThreeKings]

Would you guys do Eric Staal and Justin Faulk for PK & DD?

Take out PK and Id do it.

I wouldn't do it for PK straight up.

 

[Mario Lemieux fan 66]

Is anyone else starting to lose respect for PK at this point? If he goes through this whole 48 hours and doesn't sign long term, I want him traded!

I would not go as far as that. But, at the very least, you can say it was pure ******** when PK said that he want to be Habs for life. Subban wants to get paid and that's it.

 

[RandR]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-p...-bergevin--montreal-canadiens--211012830.html
But let’s look at what Bergevin’s managed to do in his negotiations with Subban:

- Kept his cap hit at $2.875 million for the last two seasons with that bridge contract, avoiding a potential cap calamity in 2013-14 when the ceiling dropped to $64.3 million.

- Kept him with two RFA years remaining at the end of that contract, which means two more cracks at short-term deals or a long-term extension, with arbitration in his hip pocket. (Although P.K. filed this time.)

- Managed to avoid handing out an elephantine contract before its time, with both Brendan Gallagher and Alex Galchenyuk coming off their rookie deals next summer.

From a nuts-and-bolts, taking what the CBA gives you perspective, what Bergevin’s done here so far is fine. And barring a miracle in which the sides decide on a long-term deal, he’ll save even more on Subban for next season when the arbitration ruling comes down, as well as in the long run. (Andrew Berkshire has done some great analysis on that last point.)

Craig Button made a good point on the radio that a lot of this has to do with leverage. PK will have more leverage as he gets closer to UFA status, so it wouldn't make sense for Bergevin to bend too much right now.

Conversely, of course, PK/Meehan will be less motivated to bend too much now because their leverage will get better.

Which unfortunately could mean that nobody will bend much at all until Bergevin is forced to do so, in which case he buys time and cap flexibility.

I suppose the key point is that the 2 sides remain business-like about the whole thing. It is hard for me to imagine that there won't be a cloud over things this year, but time will tell.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I never seen a Stanley Cup in Montréal or was to Young to remember.

You know why you've never seen a cup in Montreal? Because we haven't had superstars. That's the bottom line. When you don't have superstars, you don't win cups. Now we've got TWO of them and we're ****ing around with this arbitration nonsense.

Doesn't have a Conn Smythe? Are you serious with this? Stamkos hasn't won one either so I guess he can't get paid too?

Nonsense.

No, you're bull****ing me...

Nope. Just not going to waste my time with you. Look it up yourself if you wish. Or don't.... it's still there. I'm just not going to waste my time for you on it. And if you can't take what I'm saying at face value, then I'm definitely not wasting my time with you.

It seems like the pro-Bergevin crowd (who I should more fairly call the CAPSPACE!!!! crowd, since we still don't know for sure if Bergevin is to blame or not) seem to forget that every team that won the cup in recent times had to "overpay" somewhere. Doughty was "overpaid" at the time. So was Chara technically. Same goes for when Chicago re-signed the trio of Keith, Toews and Kane while also taking on Hossa. Two factors that kept them on top: the rising cap and organizational competency. They found ways to get cheap free agents and excellent prospects to challenge from below and create that depth.

That's what separates yearly contenders from the pretenders, not this penny pinching on the best players.

Yup. Good post.

I think when the inevitable leaks occur and we find out what Meehan has been asking for on Subban's behalf, people who assumed that Subban was being overly greedy are going to be shocked.

One big hint is that Meehan said that PK was NOT trying to become the league's highest paid defenceman. So right away, forget about the $10M and $12M scenarios.

True. Although some poster pointed out that he could still get the highest cap hit and still not be the highest paid.

If he is that great of a talent, teams will be lining up to trade for him.

Just like they lined up for Patrick Roy...

then you match the offer sheet and Subban is a Habs for 10 yrs....

I see, so a team offers 14 mil a year and we match, thus getting him for that long. Okay... Or we could try to sign him for what he actually wants and avoid that whole mess altogether and probably save a ton of cash.

 

[CaptainBenn]

I would not go as far as that. But, at the very least, you can say it was pure ******** when PK said that he want to be Habs for life. Subban wants to get paid and that's it.

he aint gonna accept getting paid 6M per just because Price got that contract back then
he accepted a cheap deal last time, time for Bergevin to pay him

 

[JuicyHam]

Would you guys do Eric Staal and Justin Faulk for PK & DD?

would rather have jordan staal.

 

[dukeofjive]

Today is priceless, i had the chance to listen to tsn690 most of the day, man habs fan are crazy.

Like carey price said, you guys gotta chill, or was it relax eheheh