Confirmed Trade: [STL/CAR] Justin Faulk (14% retained), 2020 5th for Joel Edmundson, Dominik Bokk, 2021 7th

[Qward]

..... a trade that looks good for both teams? Wha wha what?!

 

[bleedblue1223]

I wasn't saying he's a bad player, I'm saying he's not a PP weapon anymore.

His game has changed. He's more of a two-way guy now. I like him and always have, I'm not ragging on him. All I'm saying is, you're not getting the type of player you think you are.

I know he's not that player anymore.

 

[Stealth JD]

Kase is better than what STL sent back.

Can't believe the Ducks couldn't negotiate an extension with Faulk. They needed him more than the Blues.

Wow.

Blues will trade you Faulk for Kase.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Hop in your time machine and go back to 2015 when Faulk was actually a good PP guy and you might on to something. He's not that kind of player anymore.

Per Natural Stat Trick, he had the 2nd highest PPP/60 of his career in 17-18. Last year was not good, but I'd wait before writing him off totally.

Let's compare him to Gardiner, the guy who's going to fix Carolina's PP:

	Gardiner	Faulk
2011-2012	2.83	3.58
2013	4.08	1.79
2013-2014	3.61	2.96
2014-2015	2.44	5.37
2015-2016	3.92	4.96
2016-2017	3.72	3.82
2017-2018	5.31	5.11
2018-2019	2.59	2.49

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

 

[Sharks2020]

Fair deal for both sides

 

[LemmyUlanov55]

Woah. Blues D looks crazy good and the Canes got some pretty nice return. Bokk might fit quite well into their speed based offense.

 

[ijuka]

Per Natural Stat Trick, he had the 2nd highest PPP/60 of his career in 17-18. Last year was not good, but I'd wait before writing him off totally.

Let's compare him to Gardiner, the guy who's going to fix Carolina's PP:

	Gardiner	Faulk
2011-2012	2.83	3.58
2013	4.08	1.79
2013-2014	3.61	2.96
2014-2015	2.44	5.37
2015-2016	3.92	4.96
2016-2017	3.72	3.82
2017-2018	5.31	5.11
2018-2019	2.59	2.49

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

What? Since when is Gardiner a PP-reliant guy? Carolina has the players, they just needed to stop using Faulk on PP1.

 

[WeWantTacos]

Faulk play this many year:

and gets paid almost this many millions money every year:

25 years at $25m per? Someone take the keys from Armstrong.

 

[WhiteTrashAmerican]

Anyone saying that they aren't going to use Faulk on the PP is out of their mind. Literally his biggest strength is sitting on top of the PP and launching piss missiles at the net. If the Blues arent letting him do that he ain't worth 6.5

 

[ijuka]

Anyone saying that they aren't going to use Faulk on the PP is out of their mind. Literally his biggest strength is sitting on top of the PP and launching piss missiles at the net. If the Blues arent letting him do that he ain't worth 6.5

His biggest strength is preventing Parayko or Pietrangelo from being on the PP? Sounds like he's a nice spy.

 

[TT1]

wow this was grand larceny by Carolina

How are people saying this is a fair trade?
Terrible for STL, selling low on Edmundson and Bokk has legit upside. Faulk can't play D.

At least Faulk is a good PP option but STL already has Pie/Rayko/Dunn.. do they really wanna run 2 dmen on the PP? Trade makes no sense.

 

[tarheelhockey]

This is actually incredible asset management by the Canes. Most teams would've let Faulk go for nothing during the UFA season. Instead, the Canes acquired Gardiner and locked him into a bargain contract and flipped Faulk before his contract year for a 1st-round caliber prospect. Essentially turned a pending UFA into young assets while improving the team.

To add another layer to this...


It started in late June when they unexpectedly traded Calvin de Haan for a depth D and depth G from Chicago. We were all kind of scratching our heads at that, because CDH was solid for us. He was just a little overpaid and somewhat injury prone.

Then, a couple of weeks ago they unexpectedly pick up Gardiner. And it was like "ahhhh that's why they ditched CDH", even though the two are about as far from each other stylistically as possible.

Today, they flipped Faulk for Edmundsen... a CDH type player.

So they did this:

Faulk (expiring at $4.8M, looking for 7 x $6.5M) --> Gardiner (4 x $4.0M)
De Haan (3 x $4.5M) --> Edmundson (1 x $3.1M)
5th 2020 --> 7th 2021
Add Dominik Bokk
Add Gustav Forsling
Add Anton Forsberg

Canes are on the hook for $3.9M less in salary commitments, for at least an equal pair of players, while adding three prospects/depth, at the cost of downgrading from a 5th to a 7th.

And as a cherry on top, went from having 4 RHD in the top-6 to having a perfect 3R/3L balance.

 

[Lempo]

25 years at $25m per? Someone take the keys from Armstrong.

Yes, I'm afraid. In a year, 25, 25. If man is still alive.

 

[GoldiFox]

Per Natural Stat Trick, he had the 2nd highest PPP/60 of his career in 17-18. Last year was not good, but I'd wait before writing him off totally.

Let's compare him to Gardiner, the guy who's going to fix Carolina's PP:

	Gardiner	Faulk
2011-2012	2.83	3.58
2013	4.08	1.79
2013-2014	3.61	2.96
2014-2015	2.44	5.37
2015-2016	3.92	4.96
2016-2017	3.72	3.82
2017-2018	5.31	5.11
2018-2019	2.59	2.49

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

This is over simplifying the swap. Faulk is a shooter with zero playmaking ability. NHL teams have been shying away from running their PP through a point shooter as the 1-3-1 become popular and more goals are scored from movement across the slot.

Gardiner is a much better passer whose point totals were steadily increasing each year with Toronto's shooting talent until last year when he was demoted to the PP2. Gardiner played 115 PP minutes last year. Faulk has largely lost his ability to shoot from the point and his production decreased significantly last year despite playing 241 minutes on the PP with some of the best talent he has ever played with.

I don't think anyone expects Gardiner to be a significantly better overall PP player than Faulk. However he is a much better fit as a PPQB with Carolina's current shooting talent. Gardiner making plays with Svechnikov, Aho, Niederreiter, Haula, etc. shooting the puck is a significant upgrade to Faulk winging haphazard shots into traffic every time the puck comes to him.

 

[Svechhammer]

This is over simplifying the swap. Faulk is a shooter with zero playmaking ability. NHL teams have been shying away from running their PP through a point shooter as the 1-3-1 become popular and more goals are scored from movement across the slot.

Gardiner is a much better passer whose point totals were steadily increasing each year with Toronto's shooting talent until last year when he was demoted to the PP2. Gardiner played 115 PP minutes last year. Faulk has largely lost his ability to shoot from the point and his production decreased significantly last year despite playing 241 minutes on the PP with some of the best talent he has ever played with.

I don't think anyone expects Gardiner to be a significantly better overall PP player than Faulk. However he is a much better fit as a PPQB with Carolina's current shooting talent. Gardiner making plays with Svechnikov, Aho, Niederreiter, Haula, etc. shooting the puck is a significant upgrade to Faulk winging haphazard shots into traffic every time the puck comes to him.

Bingo

Faulk is a shooter on the PP. Dougie and Gardiner are primarily distributors on the PP. Our style of play has a bigger need for a distributor running point and getting the puck to Aho/Turbo/Svech/etc, and unfortunately we had Faulk running point with a grip it and rip it mentality. It just didn't mesh, and the PP looked like a mess because of it.

 

[Ahoy there]

Bingo

Faulk is a shooter on the PP. Dougie and Gardiner are primarily distributors on the PP. Our style of play has a bigger need for a distributor running point and getting the puck to Aho/Turbo/Svech/etc, and unfortunately we had Faulk running point with a grip it and rip it mentality. It just didn't mesh, and the PP looked like a mess because of it.

To be fair, the PP2 looked like a mess too and that can't be laid at the feet of Faulk. Our PP was so dysfunctional that it deserves more credit than simply placing it on Faulk. How many times did we ask last year if declining a penalty was an option? (it was said jokingly for the hockey purests here)

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

This is over simplifying the swap. Faulk is a shooter with zero playmaking ability. NHL teams have been shying away from running their PP through a point shooter as the 1-3-1 become popular and more goals are scored from movement across the slot.

Gardiner is a much better passer whose point totals were steadily increasing each year with Toronto's shooting talent until last year when he was demoted to the PP2. Gardiner played 115 PP minutes last year. Faulk has largely lost his ability to shoot from the point and his production decreased significantly last year despite playing 241 minutes on the PP with some of the best talent he has ever played with.

I don't think anyone expects Gardiner to be a significantly better overall PP player than Faulk. However he is a much better fit as a PPQB with Carolina's current shooting talent. Gardiner making plays with Svechnikov, Aho, Niederreiter, Haula, etc. shooting the puck is a significant upgrade to Faulk winging haphazard shots into traffic every time the puck comes to him.

This is overrating Carolina's shooting talent. Brind'Amour had the same PP set-up in the last home preseason game with Aho and Teravainen up high. It's even worse now that there are zero RHS on Unit 1. The Finns have combined for 24 PP goals over the past two seasons. Aho doesn't have much of a one-timer from distance. Teravainen doesn't like to use his. Faulk shot a lot for a reason.

The PP was and I think still will be a collective failure.

 

[hockeyguru]

You're paying a guy $6.5 million a year to play on the third pair?

Nah, somebody's moving to the left side and Faulk will be on the second pair.

he's gonna be making 6.5 on the 2nd pair when pie leaves in the off season

 

[Em etah Eh]

Blues could use a trigger man on the PP IMO. Tarasenko should be the shoot first guy but he passes way too much for my liking.

 

[hirawl]

Don Waddell is seriously going for the best two GM years in the history of NHL. Such a solid job again.

 

[Svechhammer]

This is overrating Carolina's shooting talent. Brind'Amour had the same PP set-up in the last home preseason game with Aho and Teravainen up high. It's even worse now that there are zero RHS on Unit 1. The Finns have combined for 24 PP goals over the past two seasons. Aho doesn't have much of a one-timer from distance. Teravainen doesn't like to use his. Faulk shot a lot for a reason.

The PP was and I think still will be a collective failure.

Good to know you haven't changed

 

[GoldiFox]

This is overrating Carolina's shooting talent. Brind'Amour had the same PP set-up in the last home preseason game with Aho and Teravainen up high. It's even worse now that there are zero RHS on Unit 1. The Finns have combined for 24 PP goals over the past two seasons combined. Aho doesn't have much of a one-timer from distance. Teravainen doesn't like to use his. Faulk shot a lot for a reason.

The PP was and I think still will be a collective failure.

It's a circular argument but one could argue that the lack of a PPQB significantly hurt the PP1's ability to score in the first place.

I see Aho scoring a lot more than the 3 PP goals (out of 30 total) he got last year.
I see Svechnikov scoring more than the 0 PP goals he got last year.
Haula scored 12 PPGs in his last full healthy year
Dzingle adds another high % shooter
Gardiner is the best point puck distributor the Canes have had on the PP since Pitkanen

All reasons I am optimistic. I don't hold the Canes first preseason game against them as it will take time to build chemistry with new personnel, but I actually thought they got some great looks and it appears that Rod agrees based on his most recent interview (https://www.newsobserver.com/sports/article235388632.html)

 

[Roman Yoshi]

I just worry that Carolina has way too much faith in prospects and young players like Foegele and Necas. If both of them of a low impact season, they are going to struggle to score.

 

[HanSolo]

Faulk play this many year:

and gets paid almost this many millions money every year:

Thanks!

 

[tarheelhockey]

It's a circular argument but one could argue that the lack of a PPQB significantly hurt the PP1's ability to score in the first place.

I see Aho scoring a lot more than the 3 PP goals (out of 30 total) he got last year.
I see Svechnikov scoring more than the 0 PP goals he got last year.
Haula scored 12 PPGs in his last full healthy year
Dzingle adds another high % shooter
Gardiner is the best point puck distributor the Canes have had on the PP since Pitkanen

All reasons I am optimistic. I don't hold the Canes first preseason game against them as it will take time to build chemistry with new personnel, but I actually thought they got some great looks and it appears that Rod agrees based on his most recent interview (https://www.newsobserver.com/sports/article235388632.html)

I don't know if this is going to work out in reality, but I do think you're hitting it right on the nose as far as how the Canes front office is managing the situation. High-percentage shooters combined with puck-moving perimeter guys is exactly the model for this offense. The only question is if RBA can take this group of players and make it happen on the ice.