Online Series: Star Trek: Discovery - Topic II

[Osprey]

Kurtzman is a talentless hack. You wonder how he keeps getting work. He seems to be well connected.

I'm sure that you're being rhetorical and know this, but being well connected to JJ Abrams seems to largely be how he keeps getting work... or, at least, that's how he got this gig, since he helped write and produce the first two new Star Trek films.

Trying to look on the birght side, there may be a few positives. Perhaps with less cooks in the kitchen the show will be more focused instead of a mishmash like season 1. Also, Akiva Goldsman is gone which is great news. He's worse than Kurtzman if you can imagine that.

You looked on the bright side during the turmoil prior to Season 1. How did that work out for you?

I doubt that the changes will make much difference here, since 1) they're midway through production of Season 2 (i.e. filmed 5 episodes already), and 2) the producers were fired for budgetary overruns and abusive behavior, not creative differences. We may not see any difference until Season 3, if there is one.

 

[The Nemesis]

It should not be a surprise that the best of the 3 Abrams Trek movies (the last one, Star Trek Beyond, which felt more like actual Star Trek than the other 2 did. And keeping in mind that I'm saying "best of the 3 movies" not that it was a great movie on its own merits) also happened to be the one without Kurtzman and Orci at the helm.

I made no secret of my relative distaste for the first season of Discovery and its cavalier attitude towards trying to be proper Trek. The fact that its fate is now in the hands of the guy that sucked the Trek-ness out of the movies is a horribly discouraging sign.

 

[johnjm22]

I doubt that the changes will make much difference here, since 1) they're midway through production of Season 2 (i.e. filmed 5 episodes already), and 2) the producers were fired for budgetary overruns and abusive behavior, not creative differences. We may not see any difference until Season 3, if there is one.

It literally can't be any worse than season one. Even if the writing continues to be bad (and I expect it will be), it should be more focused.

Hopefully it doesn't make it to season 3. I would just prefer it get cancelled. The show is an embarrassment.

People say TNG season one is bad, which it is, but you could at least respect what they were trying to do.

 

[johnjm22]

Season 2 trailer...looks bad.




This show is trying so hard to be cool, but it looks as dorky as ever.

 

[Blender]

Season 2 trailer...looks bad.




This show is trying so hard to be cool, but it looks as dorky as ever.

On one hand, I like Anson Mount and getting him to fill the massive void left by killing Jason Isaac's character off is much needed. On the other hand, this trailer pretty much featured all the worst aspects of season 1, so I'm not hopeful that this will be anything but bad again.

 

[johnjm22]

On one hand, I like Anson Mount and getting him to fill the massive void left by killing Jason Isaac's character off is much needed. On the other hand, this trailer pretty much featured all the worst aspects of season 1, so I'm not hopeful that this will be anything but bad again.

Looks like they're trying to lighten things up and make it funner. It makes Sonequa Martin-Green look even more out of place IMO. She's a stick in the mud.

I find it odd that all this money was spent on the show's production to make it cinematic, yet they give it a very standard TV-type trailer. You'd think they'd want the trailer to give off a big awe inspiring wondrous vibe to match the expensive production.

Also, contemporary music doesn't go well with Trek. It reminds me a bit of the Beastie Boys trailer in that way.

 

[SJSharksfan39]

Season 2 trailer...looks bad.




This show is trying so hard to be cool, but it looks as dorky as ever.

Awesome trailer. Excited for season 2.

 

[The Nemesis]

Hey, you guys liked the original Star Trek, right? You all liked Captain Pike? Yeah? How about Number One? She was a thing at one point, briefly. Sure you like her too. And Spock! We've got Spock now too! We swear! Look at us, we're everything you liked about the original Star Trek! Except grand adventure, interesting characters, a sense of wonder and optimism, originality, or an innovative style! But that's alright! Really! We're still Star Trek! Please like our show!



Also the fact that Pike is going to be wearing a TOS-esque uniform on a ship full of people wearing Enterprise-esque overalls/jumpsuits with completely different departmental colors feels like it'd get annoying fast.

Also the announcement that Number One will show up feels like we're a step away from them trying to play off the FANTASTIC RETURN of Yeoman Colt or Jose Tyler as selling points.

And yes, I had to go look up their names because it's not like I remember the random nobodies from The Cage besides Pike, Overly Emotional Spock™ (The women! ), and Number One

 

[redbeardtx]

This shit is just so bad. I just have a hard time picturing someone hearing a pitch for this and thinking "yeah, that sounds amazing"

 

[Osprey]

I cringed whenever Burnham was narrating or on screen, when the out-of-place music was playing (trying too hard to pander to millennials, it felt like) and when it was trying to be funny. I actually kind of liked the scenes with Pike, though. He looks to me like a Starfleet officer and acts like I'd expect a Captain to. It seems like Season 2 might feel a lot like Season 1, where, like Lorca, Pike's character carries the show and things take a dive when he's not on screen and, especially, when Burnham is the focus.

I can't help but imagine how the show might've been if they'd made it like past shows and centered it on a Lorca- or Pike-type Captain and made Burnham a likable First Officer. They just had to be "edgy" and subvert fan expectations by centering it on the first First Officer, making her hard to like and killing off the Captain at the end of each season, though.

 

[The Nemesis]

I cringed whenever Burnham was narrating or on screen, when the out-of-place music was playing (trying too hard to pander to millennials, it felt like) and when it was trying to be funny. I actually kind of liked the scenes with Pike, though. He looks to me like a Starfleet officer and acts like I'd expect a Captain to. It seems like Season 2 might feel a lot like Season 1, where, like Lorca, Pike's character carries the show and things take a dive when he's not on screen and, especially, when Burnham is the focus.

I can't help but imagine how the show might've been if they'd made it like past shows and centered it on a Lorca- or Pike-type Captain and made Burnham a likable First Officer. They just had to be "edgy" and subvert fan expectations by centering it on the first First Officer, making her hard to like and killing off the Captain at the end of each season, though.

At least we know this can't happen unless they decide to flip the bird at continuity or involve some time travel shenanigans because Pike is very much alive and not a vegetable at this point in the timeline (Memory-Alpha says we're 7-10 years away from the accident that lands him in the beepy-chair)

 

[Osprey]

At least we know this can't happen unless they decide to flip the bird at continuity or involve some time travel shenanigans because Pike is very much alive and not a vegetable at this point in the timeline (Memory-Alpha says we're 7-10 years away from the accident that lands him in the beepy-chair)

That's right. I realized that at one point and then forgot when I was choosing my words. The point, though, was that he'll likely be another single season actor, like Lorca and since he has his own ship. It seems like the plan from the beginning was to make the star of the show a First Officer so that the writers could have a revolving door of Captains, some of which are famous in Trek lore (like Pike), as a lazy way to keep things interesting and also allow for fan service.

"Beepy-chair"... haha.

 

[The Nemesis]

That's right. That actually crossed my mind while writing and then I forgot again. Regardless, the point was more that he'll likely be another single season actor, like Lorca and since he has his own ship to get back to.

The "beepy-chair"... haha.

Yeah, probably. I mean, god forbid we focus on likeable characters that can stick around like... Saru and..... ummm..... Lt. Robot-Lady... or... Ensign Daft Punk

 

[NyQuil]

It should not be a surprise that the best of the 3 Abrams Trek movies (the last one, Star Trek Beyond, which felt more like actual Star Trek than the other 2 did. And keeping in mind that I'm saying "best of the 3 movies" not that it was a great movie on its own merits) also happened to be the one without Kurtzman and Orci at the helm.

Yikes.

Beyond was terrible.

1. Who didn’t see Idris Alba coming?

2. Beastie Boys music waves destroy the bad guys?

3. Simon Pegg writes a script where the engineer saves the day and gets the girl?

4. Let’s use this motor bike for some wicked stunts.

Yeeesh. Amazed you think it’s the best one. Each one is worse than the one before it.

 

[Blender]

Sonequa Martin-Green just isn't a good actor, and focusing on another season of her wooden performance just isn't going to go well, especially with how weak the writing was in season 1. I agree that Anson Mount will likely carry the entire season like Jason Isaacs did last season, and that when he's not around things will drag.

Will Tilly be promoted to something this season? Or will she still be a cadet who seems to serve as Chief Engineering, a bridge officer, a member of senior staff, etc.

Yikes.

Beyond was terrible.

1. Who didn’t see Idris Alba coming?

2. Beastie Boys music waves destroy the bad guys?

3. Simon Pegg writes a script where the engineer saves the day and gets the girl?

4. Let’s use this motor bike for some wicked stunts.

Yeeesh. Amazed you think it’s the best one. Each one is worse than the one before it.

Beyond is easily better than Into Dumbness, I don't think it's close. Not that Beyond is a great movie by any stretch, but it's alright.

 

[NyQuil]

Beyond is easily better than Into Dumbness, I don't think it's close. Not that Beyond is a great movie by any stretch, but it's alright.

Funny, I would disagree.

I didn’t mind Into Darkness but I must be in the minority.

 

[Blender]

Funny, I would disagree.

I didn’t mind Into Darkness but I must be in the minority.

The thing with Beyond is, why did they need the Enterprise anymore? In Into Darkness it's established that they can transports over vast distances now. Also, why did anyone die in Beyond? Khan's magic blood can cure people from death.

 

[tacogeoff]

I didn't mind the trailer, looks to be an interesting season. The only thing that took away from it for me was the music and the elevator humor.

I cant wait to see how Anson Mount approaches this role. I was a huge fan of Hell on Wheels and he was excellent in his role...this is quite a shift lol.

To add to the fire....Beyond almost falls to the bottom with Nemesis.

 

[johnjm22]

To add to the fire....Beyond almost falls to the bottom with Nemesis.

Whereas Into Darkness actually does fall to the bottom with Nemesis.

I actually like the first half hour of Beyond. We're seeing what day-to-day life is like on the Enterprise. The Yorktown base has a sense of wonder about it. It felt like Star Trek. Then the movie unravels into obligatory boring action. It lost me after that.

 

[Blender]

Whereas Into Darkness actually does fall to the bottom with Nemesis.

I actually like the first half hour of Beyond. We're seeing what day-to-day life is like on the Enterprise. The Yorktown base has a sense of wonder about it. It felt like Star Trek. Then the movie unravels into obligatory boring action. It lost me after that.

Beyond is still blockbuster action schlock at the end of the day, but it's by far the most Star Trek of the three Kelvin timeline movies. The characters are also a lot more grounded and closer to the originals than the shallow and over the top stereotypes that the first two movies had. You can tell Simon Pegg at least has some idea of who these characters were, while the first two movies were clearly written by people who had no idea who they actually were. The plot of Beyond is a lot tighter and at least attempts to touch on a lot of Star Trek themes (i.e. ethics, science fiction, the human condition, politics, etc.) while also being a blockbuster action movie, while the first two movies were mindless action movies where the plot purely served to introduce the next action scene.

 

[johnjm22]

@Blender I mostly agree, but I think Pegg's Scotty in Beyond is very much an over the top stereotype. He says lassie every other word. It makes me cringe. Scotty was never like that.

Plot holes aside, Beyond does have a more focused story than the previous two films. I think it would have been more enjoyable had I not known the Enterprise was going to get destroyed. I blame the advertising campaign for that.

The motorcycle and Beastie Boys stuff was forced in by the Studio.

 

[johnjm22]

They just had to be "edgy" and subvert fan expectations by centering it on the first First Officer

There's nothing wrong with this premise. The problem is that it's written poorly and the lead actress is terrible. Telling the story of an individual's career journey through Starfleet could've been fascinating.

 

[Blender]

There's nothing wrong with this premise. The problem is that it's written poorly and the lead actress is terrible. Telling the story of an individual's career journey through Starfleet could've been fascinating.

I actually thought it was an interesting take on the series when it was first announced, and would have been fine if they had started with an even lower ranked officer who could have even transferred assignments if they wanted to shake up the cast. The problem of course is that the main character is horrible and Sonequa Martin-Green brings the same bad acting from The Walking Dead to her role here.

 

[Osprey]

There's nothing wrong with this premise. The problem is that it's written poorly and the lead actress is terrible. Telling the story of an individual's career journey through Starfleet could've been fascinating.

I agree that there's nothing wrong with the premise. I had to mention it, though, to criticize what I think were their motives in going with it.

 

[redbeardtx]

the lead actress is terrible.

Yeah, that's what kills it for me, among other things.