Post-Game Talk: Slow starts, soft goals and poor 5on5 play doom the Oilers

[McTonyBrar]

Who was the goalie for majority of those games?

 

[McTonyBrar]

I really really hope Duncan Keith retires after this season.

Yeah that first goal was definitely on him. Adam Lowry let go a howitzer that rivals the shots Al Macinnis took back in the day..

 

[redgrant]

Who was the goalie for majority of those games?

It doesn't matter. This is not a good second paring. Mikko is gone end of this year. We're stuck with both these duds going forward.

 

[redgrant]

Yeah that first goal was definitely on him. Adam Lowry let go a howitzer that rivals the shots Al Macinnis took back in the day..

Yeah and his awful turnover behind the net?

 

[McTonyBrar]

Social media defending Koskinen to no ends lmao..

He’s 9-2!!!! It’s Keith’s fault for koskinen allowing a beer league wrist shot on the first shot on net!! It’s Keith’s fault that Koskinen got scored on by a slapshot on the blue line with no screen!!

 

[McTonyBrar]

It doesn't matter. This is not a good second paring. Mikko is gone end of this year. We're stuck with both these duds going forward.

Ceci has been solid.. it’s not his fault a beer leaguer is in net

 

[Game suspension]

Certainly looks to me like the Oilers need a new goalie or two. I hope Holland stops taking bows for making it to the HHOF and gets to work. I have no idea how he thought he could get away with the same goaltending as last year. Wishful thinking ain't gonna cut it.

 

[McTonyBrar]

Yeah and his awful turnover behind the net?

Did I say anything about that? Do you come on here to rip the team and then leave?

 

[Marty McSurly]

Yeah that first goal was definitely on him. Adam Lowry let go a howitzer that rivals the shots Al Macinnis took back in the day..

You would rather have Duncan Keith next season than $9 million in cap space?

Ok!

 

[Forgot About Drai]

Ceci has been solid.. it’s not his fault a beer leaguer is in net

Dude your crusade against Koski is wild.

Koski lets in some pretty weak goals but he also stole some games earlier in the season too. Im not saying hes the answer going forward but lets take a breathe and realize he is not our only issue.

 

[K1984]

Honest question - how do you see these holes being filled: 1G, top 4-ish LD, 3C and 2RW before playoffs?

We all agree these are holes right? A team in year 5+ of McDrai w/ stanley cup asperations should not have this many holes.

Yes, we are 11-3, but we KNOW McDrai can basically drag any team through the regular season. This is about playoffs and we need those holes filled because we have seen multiple times now that McDrai by themselves arent good enough to last through playoffs. I dont know if we should be panicking but those are serious issues for a STANLEY CUP aspiring team.

We are done with rebuild, reg season success is tablestakes. Its whats expected. How do you realistically fill those holes before playoffs?

I don't think it's the end of the world if they don't pick up a 2 RW, but I don't think the other positions are impossible to fill.

 

[McTonyBrar]

 

[McTonyBrar]

Dude your crusade against Koski is wild.

Koski lets in some pretty weak goals but he also stole some games earlier in the season too. Im not saying hes the answer going forward but lets take a breathe and realize he is not our only issue.

My crusade against Koskinen isn’t wild because it has some sense to it. He’s allowed goals like this for 3-4 seasons. Sure he makes big saves but you can’t allow deflating goals like that. If he’s good, why didn’t other teams try for him and why did we try so hard to trade him?

 

[Forgot About Drai]

I don't think it's the end of the world if they don't pick up a 2 RW, but I don't think the other positions are impossible to fill.

Yeah I agree on 2Rw. I listed it last for that reason it would be a "nice to have"

It can be filled - but it will be hard considering cap and assets. I think thats the reason im worried. Those positions can be filled out but its gonna be tough making it work. Will have to be some 06 KLowe shit

 

[McTonyBrar]

You would rather have Duncan Keith next season than $9 million in cap space?

Ok!

I’d rather have Keith than Koskinen

 

[Forgot About Drai]

My crusade against Koskinen isn’t wild because it has some sense to it. He’s allowed goals like this for 3-4 seasons. Sure he makes big saves but you can’t allow deflating goals like that. If he’s good, why didn’t other teams try for him and why did we try so hard to trade him?

Im not even saying hes good. We clearly need to upgrade. All I'm saying is he not the sole reason we lose.

 

[McTonyBrar]

Dude your crusade against Koski is wild.

Koski lets in some pretty weak goals but he also stole some games earlier in the season too. Im not saying hes the answer going forward but lets take a breathe and realize he is not our only issue.

And I’m not saying he’s the only problem. Our defence has been shit

 

[Marty McSurly]

I’d rather have Keith than Koskinen

Was that even the f***ing question?

 

[bucks_oil]

It's simply unrealistic at the NHL level, against top-10 teams, to expect players to routinely come back from constant lay-ups into their own net. I don't know if any of the teams that won the Stanley Cup in the last 15 years would be cup champions if they had to overcome a 1-0 deficit before the game starts in most of the games they played. The parity in the NHL is just too great to expect a team to get over that and still be elite. It's not realistic.

What's worse is that even when Koskinen is in the zone, he's liable to let in a brutal goal. NHL starters need to make the saves that Koskinen makes when he's "on," which people seem to sometimes think means he's "stealing a game." But the reality is, NHL starters make those saves; that's why they're starting in the NHL. Koskinen is not doing anything above and beyond what the team should expect of a starter when he "bounces back" from his routine muffin. The big difference between an actual NHL starter and Koskinen is that the starter makes all the saves Koskinen makes and lets in a squeaker every once in a while, whereas Koskinen lets in that muffin almost every game.

This is who is and always has been. The team has had to score 4+ goals to win more nights than not (including the nights they lose), and a big part of that is goaltending.

Look, I agree that last nights 1st goal was a terrible goal. I also agree that given the body of work Koskinen has put forward on this team he is not an NHL starter. That's not in debate. We need to move on from him.

That said, he has been playing quite well. You say ~ treading water. I disagree, I think it's been a bit more than that, but again... I'm not here to defend Koskinen.

I'm simply making two points:
1) We have complained about 1st shot/early goal-itis as an excuse for at least 4-5 goalies. Scrivens, Talbot, Koskinen, even Smith. First, 2nd, 3rd shots on goal go in a lot against most teams in the league. It is not an excuse to pack it in when you get scored on early. That's a losers mentality.

2) The goalie is just like any other player. He's responsible for his own mental state of mind and to compensate for mistakes made by his teammates. That's hockey.

When a goalie blows it on a play, (as Koskinen did) he's responsible to not blow it on the next play and get his head in the game. Koskinen's mental lapse on that play (it was a mental lapse, he's clearly capable of making that save... that's why we think it was a weak goal) is just that. A mental lapse.

It's no different than a defenseman taking his eye off the puck and having it bounce his stick at the blue line leading to a breakaway against. Zero difference except that the goalie will have a chance to bail out the defenseman, and usually a goalie gets no such luxury.

Given that higher-stakes consequence, it is completely unreasonable to ALSO make the goalie responsible for his teammates' ability to recover from a goal on subsequent plays. That is on them to shake it off.

IF you think it is ok for a whole teams' worth of players to not overcome that weak goal/injury to the psyche, then it would follow that the goalie doesn't need to worry about stopping a breakaway when player X makes the same repeat mistake at the blue line. Teams that think that one guy's momentary lapse in concentration is any worse than the next guy's lapse in concentration are not TEAMS.

Now... that said, players that consistently make errors in judgement and mental mistakes are not the types of players that should be holding down primary jobs at the NHL level. Physical talent can of course overcome some of those mental errors, but ultimately the balance has to be in favor of positive performance/winning. With Koskinen it is not (though I would argue his deficit is at least as much physical as it is mental... his reflexes do him no favors).

 

[McTonyBrar]

Was that even the f***ing question?

Nope. I know Keith has been off as the games have gone on. Be happy it’s only for 1 season after this one.

 

[bucks_oil]

The bigger issue is 6 straight games giving up the first goal. You can’t do that.

True... last night's first goal was clearly on Koskinen. It was a stoppable shot.

But six in a row is very definitely a team issue.

 

[Marty McSurly]

Nope. I know Keith has been off as the games have gone on. Be happy it’s only for 1 season after this one.

Be happy Koskinen is done after this season.

Keith off the books next year with a cap credit would be a gift.

 

[Trafalgar Sadge Law]

I de


I defended Keith before but he has looked terrible. I thought it would be Ceci

I think I commented during preseason that Keith's puck moving skills and skating were better than I expected for a 38 yo but he just didn't contribute anything tangible defensively. People kept flaming me and saying Keith looked great defensively but I just didn't see it and nobody could answer my question: what does he do defensively? Wasn't denying zone entries, wasn't winning puck battles and breaking cycles, wasn't clearing the net, Ceci was the one doing the heavy lifting from what I saw and filling those roles. And this was just preseason, it has only gotten worse since after the first 5 or 6 games. The one thing Keith seemed okay at was getting into passing/shooting lanes but that seems to have disappeared the past few games too.

 

[McTonyBrar]

Hyman - Mcdavid - Puljujarvi
Nuge - Draisaitl - XXX
Foegele - XXX - XXX
XXX - Ryan - XXX

Nurse - Bouchard
XXX - XXX
Keith - Ceci

XXX
Smith

Trade block: Barrie, Yamamoto, Kassian, Koskinen, Mcleod, Benson, Shore, Turris.

That's how I honestly see this roster... Can anyone fill in the holes by TDL lol?

No but you can do that in NHL 22

 

[McTonyBrar]

Be happy Koskinen is done after this season.

Keith off the books next year with a cap credit would be a gift.

True. I think we will see a couple of moves Condors style in a couple of weeks