Should Todd Bertuzzi been banned for life?

ManwithNoIdentity

Registered User
Jun 4, 2016
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I don't agree with you, but I respect your opinion of defending a guy who committed premeditated aggravated assault on a defenseless player by sucker punching him in the side of the head, breaking three of his vertebrae and ending his NHL career. Thanks again for your opinion.

Oh give me a f***ing break.

Much worse has been done by other players and we don’t see nonstop complaining and outrage against them

Get over it.
 

cptjeff

Reprehensible User
Sep 18, 2008
20,616
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Washington, DC.
Why does Bertuzzi deserve a second chance, while Moore isn't capable of having the same chance due to Bertuzzi's decisions? Shouldn't the punishment fit the crime? Or does saying sorry make up for permanently injuring someone, altering their life forever, and ending their NHL career?

Joni Pitkanen's career was ended by a check while chasing the puck on an icing. Should we ban the player who checked him for life? Does he deserve a second chance when Pitkanen doesn't get one?

Seriously, this is garbage logic and you know it. Career ending injuries happen on freak accidents all the damn time. The extent of the injury does not determine the liability, nor should it. Bertuzzi did a nasty, dirty thing, but there was absolutely no way he could have had any reasonable expectation it would lead to an injury as serious as the one Moore ultimately got. Suspendable, yes. Lifetime ban? Bugger off. Tom Wilson does worse once a week.
 

ricky0034

Registered User
Jun 8, 2010
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How often do you see someone get stalked up the ice and sucker-punched in the side of the head for refusing to engage in a second fight in a game, after having a "bounty" put on his head in response to a clean hit (according to the NHL and the guy he hit)? I've been watching hockey for almost 40 years and have only seen it the one time.

I mean obviously if you wanna get that bizarrely specific there's not gonna be many examples

how often do you see someone get crosschecked in the face on a Tuesday playing against the Vancouver Canucks right after Tanner Glass scored a goal?
 

HansonBro

Registered User
May 3, 2006
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Adding context

Beyond his NHL and IIHF suspensions, legal action was taken against Bertuzzi in the provincial courts of British Columbia and Ontario, as well as in Colorado state court. After a four-month investigation, the criminal justice branch of the Attorney General of British Columbia announced on June 24, 2004, he was being formally charged with assault causing bodily harm.[21] With the charge, Bertuzzi faced up to one-and-a-half years in prison.[22] Several months later, on December 22, Bertuzzi pleaded guilty to the assault charge after arranging a plea bargainwith prosecutors. He was given a conditional discharge requiring 80 hours of community service and one year's probation that additionally prohibited him from playing in any hockey game Moore was competing in. Under Canadian law, Bertuzzi's successful completion of his probationary period precluded him from a criminal record.[23]Moore expressed disappointment regarding Bertuzzi's discharge and was upset that he was unable to attend the court date, having to issue a written victim statement instead. Moore's lawyer, Tim Danson, was given one day's notice of the court date following Bertuzzi's plea bargain, which he said was insufficient time for Moore to travel to Vancouver.[24]
On February 17, 2005, Moore filed a lawsuit in a Colorado court against Bertuzzi. Also named in the lawsuit were numerous individuals within the Canucks organization, including Brad May (Bertuzzi's teammate at the time who was quoted as saying that there would "definitely be a price on Moore's head" after Moore's hit on Näslund), Brian Burke, Marc Crawford, as well as the Canucks organization as a whole and the Orca Bay Sports and Entertainment company that owned the team. The lawsuit was thrown out in October 2005, as the Colorado judge ruled the case was better suited for Canadian courts, as Moore and all the defendants were Canadian citizens. Planning to appeal the decision,[25] Danson stated publicly the following month that Moore had begun skating and doing regular workouts, but continued to suffer concussion-related symptoms.[25]
 

Goose

Registered User
Apr 18, 2006
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Tens of thousands of people get away with drinking and driving or texting and driving and only a select few get unlucky enough to kill someone else and then end up in jail with their entire life ruined.

That's the best analogy I can think of for Bertuzzi. He did the hockey equivalent of drinking and driving - lots of others in the league have assaulted other players in equally dangerous ways - but he and Moore got unusually unlucky and it destroyed Moore's career.

People come down on either side of this debate - some like harsh punishments for these types of offenders, others empathize with the fact that they got unlucky. I respect people's opinion across the board, each end of the spectrum is understandable, it's the people who think Bertuzzi crossed a line that's never been crossed in the history of hockey before that I don't understand. There are tons of very violent acts in hockey that MIGHT have ended careers. It's amazing a fist fight hasn't killed someone yet, when you think about that as an example.
 

Trocity

Registered User
Nov 24, 2016
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I don't think he should have been banned for life, however if someone had of head shotted him at some point after and ended his career/gave him brain damage that affected his quality of life, I wouldn't have felt bad either.
 

Hasbro

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The way they fall though it never looked like a slam to me. It looked like Moore's body went limp from being knocked out and Bert went down with him since he was holding him. That part always seemed accidental. Though I'm not sure if that ultimately matters if it results directly from an initially egregious premeditated act.
Bertuzzi also did keep swinging after that little whoopsie.
 
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Hasbro

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Best I can currently find is a broken link from an old story about it.

http://www.sptimes.com/2004/03/04/Lightning/Tortorella_repeats_ca.shtml
"CHICAGO - For the second time in two weeks, Lightning coach John Tortorella called for league MVP candidate Martin St. Louis to receive more protection from referees.
Obstruction, elbows, face-washes, Tortorella said the wing has been the target of it all. But what really got the coach steamed was when the 5-foot-8 St. Louis was cross-checked from behind into the boards by Colorado's Steve Moore during the first period of Monday's 3-0 Tampa Bay victory."
It was a mad scramble to find anything to validate the persecution complex the Canucks had going under Burke.

Funny thing was Ruutu cheap shotted Forsberg in the same game and put him out longer than three games and no whining or bounties out of Colorado.

Good thing Bertuzzi got to keep playing though. He needed to keep earning his considerable restitution to Moore.
 
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Feb 24, 2017
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It was a mad scramble to find anything to validate the persecution complex the Canucks had going under Burke.

Funny thing was Ruutu cheap shotted Forsberg in the same game and put him out longer than three games and no whining or bounties out of Colorado.

Good thing Bertuzzi got to keep playing though. He needed to keep earning his considerable restitution to Moore.
It’s an article out of a Tampa Bay paper. From before Moore ever went after Naslund. I’m not sure what the problem is here.
 

Boeser Fan

Registered User
Jun 23, 2018
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It was a mad scramble to find anything to validate the persecution complex the Canucks had going under Burke.

Funny thing was Ruutu cheap shotted Forsberg in the same game and put him out longer than three games and no whining or bounties out of Colorado.

Good thing Bertuzzi got to keep playing though. He needed to keep earning his considerable restitution to Moore.
Yeah don't kid yourself the Canucks ownership paid a majority of that settlement https://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/nh...keep-side-agreement-details-private-1.1280683
 

Regal

Registered User
Mar 12, 2010
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Bertuzzi also did keep swinging after that little whoopsie.

I don't think he fully realized he was out. It's still brutal either way, but I think it was a case of an egregious act that was made worse due to unfortunate circumstances
 

vippe

Registered User
Mar 18, 2008
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Career ending predatory assault. The attack was bad itself and the injury was horrendous. This wasnt a hit gone bad - this was not a hockey play. This was assault, assault does not end well and consequences has to be considered. Bert definately did not receive the punishment he deserved.

Bertuzzi got a slap on the wrist and played hockey for another 10 years earning 25M+ while doing so. Meanwhile Moore struggling with career and personal life due to the injuries suffered from a non hockey play.
 

Oddbob

Registered User
Jan 21, 2016
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What Bertuzzi did to Moore wasn't accidental, so I don't know how that's relevant. Or are you suggesting Bertuzzi accidentally challenged Moore to a 2nd fight in the game, accidentally stalked him up the ice, and accidentally sucker punched him in the side of the head? The outcome might not have been intentional, but the actions leading up to the injury absolutely were.

Not suggesting it was accidental at all. You suggested that people don't deserve second chances if they alter someone else's life negatively for the rest of their lives. I was suggesting people, all of us make dumb decisions, and all deserve second chances. Why is Bertuzzi any different than any other human being?
 

Oddbob

Registered User
Jan 21, 2016
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Real quick- criminals do not get a billion chances. They often don't get a chance, singular, never mind multiple chances.

Anyways, shouldn't have been banned for life, but he shoulda gotten at least half a season. The NHL kinda botched that whole thing with the lockout and all, Bert only ended up getting 20 games and for an assault that broke a dude's neck.. shoulda been half a season at least.

Criminals don't get a tonne of chances? Of course they do, asinine to suggest otherwise! They rob, do a little time, get out, and rinse and repeat a lot of times. Drunk drivers get slaps on the wrists all the time and return to do many more DUI's endangering many peoples lives. There are a boatload of examples of criminals getting many many chances.
 

thadd

Oil4Life
Jun 9, 2007
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Canada
Is this not a hot topic anymore?
I guess not.
There are probably people here who don't even know who Todd Bertuzzi was other than some guy that broke someone's neck.
That being said if you feel that he should have been given a lifetime ban then there are several hundred hockey players before him who should have been issued the same lifetime ban.

There's no point in talking about specific individuals if you want to promote positive change. Singling out a single individual is far too reactionary a response. All his suspension showed was that you won't get away with breaking a coward's neck via jumping them from behind after they've clearly stated that they have no interest in fighting. To be fair Todd was probably more than well equipped to fight 2 Moores simultaneously, but for better or for worse that was done in an age when you still had the remnants of "don't you dare take out our superstar and if you do we'll make you pay"

In the end Ray Crawford was just as responsible as he's admitted that he told the team that Moore has to pay the price. Those are very vague terms, but when you have a head coach promoting to the players exactly what the league doesn't want you to do, i don't think it's smart to think that it's going to make things any better.
 
Feb 24, 2017
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Career ending predatory assault. The attack was bad itself and the injury was horrendous. This wasnt a hit gone bad - this was not a hockey play. This was assault, assault does not end well and consequences has to be considered. Bert definately did not receive the punishment he deserved.

Bertuzzi got a slap on the wrist and played hockey for another 10 years earning 25M+ while doing so. Meanwhile Moore struggling with career and personal life due to the injuries suffered from a non hockey play.
When Moore smashed Martin St. Louis from behind head first into the boards, and when he went out of his way to deliver a vicious headshot to Markus Naslund, was anyone here up in arms?

Moore should never have been in the league. He was a garbage player only in the lineup due to how many forwards the avs were missing. He tried to endear himself to the avs by targeting superstar players on the other teams, with hopes of staying in the lineup.

Moore played a dangerous little game, and he unfortunately got burned pretty badly.
 

IWantSakicAsMyGM

Registered User
Oct 13, 2011
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Joni Pitkanen's career was ended by a check while chasing the puck on an icing. Should we ban the player who checked him for life? Does he deserve a second chance when Pitkanen doesn't get one?

Seriously, this is garbage logic and you know it. Career ending injuries happen on freak accidents all the damn time. The extent of the injury does not determine the liability, nor should it. Bertuzzi did a nasty, dirty thing, but there was absolutely no way he could have had any reasonable expectation it would lead to an injury as serious as the one Moore ultimately got. Suspendable, yes. Lifetime ban? Bugger off. Tom Wilson does worse once a week.

You mean the play where Pitkanen was skating full speed trying to reach an iced puck first, lost an edge and ran into the end boards, breaking his heel? Which player checked him on that play? From everything I've seen, the answer to that is "nobody", so I'm not sure what you're even trying to suggest here. No one checked him, no one put a bounty on his head, and no one purposefully challenged him to a second fight in the game, stalked him up the ice and sucker punched him from behind. It's not comparable at all. So, yes, I do agree that your logic is garbage.

I also said earlier in the thread that I don't think a lifetime ban was merited, so your little strawman argument is also garbage.
 
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Reagans Blues

Registered User
Apr 12, 2019
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Oh give me a ****ing break.

Much worse has been done by other players and we don’t see nonstop complaining and outrage against them

Get over it.
I mean has there been though? That was pretty horrible. Mcsorley taking Brashear's head off comes to mind but that's about it.
 

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