Player Discussion Shea Weber

[NotProkofievian]

Nashville would gladly take him back...if they would had space + $$$ to get him. He is still a very good NHL d-man. Don't fool yourself.

Habs could also try to trade him to his #1 fan, Babcock in TO.

Lol for what?

 

[Scintillating10]

Subban is better defensively than Weber right now I don’t see the point Weber fans are trying to make by comparing the two . Weber has a better shot... that’s pretty much it.

Subban is better at defending zone entries, retrieving pucks in the corners on dump ins and board battles in general , he’s better at getting the puck out of the zone with his passes or his skating, he’s better at the point in the offensive zone and he’s much less predictable than Weber on the powerplay. Weber can score goals and cross check people I guess that’s not bad. But he’s frankly not close to subban defensively or offensively overal when it comes to playing hockey in 2018-2019.

I hate to be that guy but it’s not even close.

We were pretty bad when Subban was here.

Weber, take a lot to move him. We should get more than Rangers got for McDonagh. Where he is signed. Which was Howden, a first and a conditional first if Tampa win Cup in '19, plus 2 throw-ins.

 

[Chili]

Babcock does not want him, don't base anything on that one statement in the past that was just said to save face for a friend. Besides, Babcock has Ozihgnaov, whose shot was the hardest in the KHL and would have been ranked next just behind Weber's if he was in the NHL. Plus he's 25, big, can skate and does not have a $7.8M yearly contract that the Leafs wouldn't take.

Ozhiganov played well yesterday considering it was his first real NHL game and it was on a smaller ice surface than he is used to. Babcock likes him as well and will most likely keep him on the Leafs instead of sending him to the AHL for adjustment.

Shipachev was a pretty good KHLer too, didn`t last long in the NHL though.

I have been following the Euro vet migration the last few years and the failure rate is high. Big adjustment to smaller ice surface, style of play, schedule, etc. Only a handful have made it lately.

Weber just needs to get healthy, like others have said, he could considerably help any team in my opinion.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Yes he never posted more then 33 assists in a season. He also never played behind a decent team, or in offensive minutes. No d man is putting up huge assists being utilized like a shut down d man.

Lets be real here....when PK won the Norris he started on the o zone 55 percent of the time and if I remeber correctly wasn’t even killing penalties. Weber same year started in the o zone 42 % of the time. Flip usage around and no way PK has a Norris.

Webers offensive production when you consider how he is used is insane. Yes, he scores a lot of goals on the PP, that is when he is used most in the o zone. Its incredible to me that his absolute dominance on the PP is somehow evidence of him being an incomplete offensive player. Or that him recovering a puck and making a short pass to a player with speed is also a knock against him. Its bizzare, this is a very effective way to move the puck up ice.

I’m mostly done arguing Webers effectiveness on these boards, folks don’t seem to understand how much of a unicorn a player is that can score 20 goals, come top 10 in D scoring and be the best shutdown guy in the league. He is the ultimate substance player but his lack of style does not play well in Montreal.

PK had the absolute toughest assignments all year, with the lowest ozone starts all year this year, along with carrying the weakest partner of all the Norris finalists (Emelin) on his back for half the year, so the entire premise of your post is completely off base imo. PK was more deserving of the Norris this year than the year he won it and clearly the best D this year despite the disadvantages he had to face. Weber never could have done what PK did this past year.

Weber is a good dman, he doesn't tilt the ice the same way PK does and Weber will be trending down, some argue he already has, I don't believe he has, I just believe he doesn't have the ridiculous reputation that he can walk on water like he did before.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

I prefer Weber - he's a better #1 dman in my opinion. But they are both good players.

I really don't understand why people care so much about the trade - it's bizarre. Neither player is much better or worse than the other, so why not just move on with your lives?

The reason people haven't moved on is because they disagree with what you have said. Imagine that, opinions different from yours.

 

[Fazkovsky]

Yeah its a bad trade but you gotta move on

Its like crying on a mistake or bad choice that you did . I do it all the time and it leaves me more frustrated and disappointed

 

[ArtPeur]

The problem with that trade and why people will never forget is that we were told we would have a better team with Weber.

Add the facts that:

- Subban had better ppg in hist first season despite losing games to injuries
- Nashville went further than the Habs in playoffs in 2 seasons
- the Habs are now tanking
- Weber will have missed one full year to injuries and recovery

 

[Deebs]

Subban is better defensively than Weber right now

PK is the better offensive D man, of course, but let's not get delusional about their play in their own end.

 

[Andrei79]

PK is the better offensive D man, of course, but let's not get delusional about their play in their own end.

He's right.

A good defenseman turns defense into possession. Subban's one of the very best at it. Weber's average, not anywhere near the truly elite at it. He defers to his linemate.

 

[japhi]

He's right.

A good defenseman turns defense into possession. Subban's one of the very best at it. Weber's average, not anywhere near the truly elite at it. He defers to his linemate.

The arguments here for PK are hilarious. He ‘tilts the ice’. Turns defense into possession. He ‘moves the needle’.

Before Weber got here there were endless posts about how poor his possession numbers were and how PK had significantly better advanced stats. How is that argument holding up guys?

Subban went to Nashville and basically turned into Weber but with a better team. Similar offensive an advanced stats. He got slower and better defensively. Gets a more assists and scores less goals. Plays with a better partner behind better forwards.

I agree he’s a better player right now but only marginally. He has a better stretch pass and is stronger in transitions. Struggles to get his shot through and can get exsposed in his own end. Net they are very close and in Weber’s first season he was better on a worse team, last year a healthy weber probably goes top 5 norris again. His start was incredible. He has had some terrible luck with injuries but nothing he has shown here indicates he isn’t still a top 10 defenseman healthy.

Doesn’t make it a great trade but come on guys, and I get that you guys lost your bff, but the lack of understanding on how good Weber is around here is exposing some of you.

 

[Perrah]

The arguments here for PK are hilarious. He ‘tilts the ice’. Turns defense into possession. He ‘moves the needle’.

Before Weber got here there were endless posts about how poor his possession numbers were and how PK had significantly better advanced stats. How is that argument holding up guys?

Subban went to Nashville and basically turned into Weber but with a better team. Similar offensive an advanced stats. He got slower and better defensively. Gets a more assists and scores less goals. Plays with a better partner behind better forwards.

I agree he’s a better player right now but only marginally. He has a better stretch pass and is stronger in transitions. Struggles to get his shot through and can get exsposed in his own end. Net they are very close and in Weber’s first season he was better on a worse team, last year a healthy weber probably goes top 5 norris again. His start was incredible. He has had some terrible luck with injuries but nothing he has shown here indicates he isn’t still a top 10 defenseman healthy.

Doesn’t make it a great trade but come on guys, and I get that you guys lost your bff, but the lack of understanding on how good Weber is around here is exposing some of you.

So Subban wasn’t tied for 4th in goals by dmen last year? 1 off the lead.

His supposed better partner for half of last year was Emelin. Isnt that the same guy that Weber was so great for propping up for half a year the previous year?

Probablys for the norris mean sweet f*** all, atleast that was what was said when Subban was injured part of the first year.

 

[the]

Well I’m one of the rare Man Mountain fan, I think he’s underappreciated and can still be a top defenseman.

No doubt I wish we still had PK and clearly we lost the trade but I can also respect what Shea Weber brings. It’s unfortunate that we don’t have a good team since I’m sure he could have won some fans over if he was healthy.

The next few months are going to be interesting. Can he make a full comeback or are his injuries going to slow him down?

For our sake I still hope he has a few good years left in him.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

The problem with that trade and why people will never forget is that we were told we would have a better team with Weber.

Add the facts that:

- Subban had better ppg in hist first season despite losing games to injuries
- Nashville went further than the Habs in playoffs in 2 seasons
- the Habs are now tanking
- Weber will have missed one full year to injuries and recovery

The fundamental issue is age IMO. Weber is a #1 today(when healthy) but was top end of league years ago. I suspect when Subban reaches this age he too won’t be top 5(probably top 15).

People can compare Subban and Weber all they want but in their respective primes they were both elite. The problem is we got a guy leaving his prime for a guy in it. That’s why trade is a mess

 

[CauZuki]

Lol for what?

I'd do it for Tolvanen and a 1st 2019 , Habs retain whatever is required.

 

[RealityBytes]

Shipachev was a pretty good KHLer too, didn`t last long in the NHL though.

I have been following the Euro vet migration the last few years and the failure rate is high. Big adjustment to smaller ice surface, style of play, schedule, etc. Only a handful have made it lately.

Weber just needs to get healthy, like others have said, he could considerably help any team in my opinion.

Maybe so, if Weber gets healthy again, but he won't be going to Toronto.

This whole thread started because people here keep bringing up that one time old stale comment out of context that Babcock is dying to get Weber. He's not, and besides, Dubas would never take on Weber's contract. Yet, it keeps getting repeated over and over here ... Babcock wants Weber. People just need to open their eyes and put that comment to rest.

 

[admiralcadillac]

Maybe so, if Weber gets healthy again, but he won't be going to Toronto.

This whole thread started because people here keep bringing up that one time old stale comment out of context that Babcock is dying to get Weber. He's not, and besides, Dubas would never take on Weber's contract. Yet, it keeps getting repeated over and over here ... Babcock wants Weber. People just need to open their eyes and put that comment to rest.

Babcock isn't dying to get Weber, his no.1 dman for team canada? What are you on?

He'd take weber on the leafs in a millisecond, but for multiple reasons it's not a possibility. Impossibility and lack of interest are two different things.

 

[NotProkofievian]

I'd do it for Tolvanen and a 1st 2019 , Habs retain whatever is required.

I would too. Nashville wouldn't.

 

[RealityBytes]

Babcock isn't dying to get Weber, his no.1 dman for team canada? What are you on?

He'd take weber on the leafs in a millisecond, but for multiple reasons it's not a possibility. Impossibility and lack of interest are two different things.

Lol ... in a millisecond ... right. Believe what you want.

Regardless, Weber isn't going to Toronto ... and just leave it at that.

 

[admiralcadillac]

Lol ... in a millisecond ... yeah sure. You need to get in touch with 2018. It really takes a lot for some people to discard an old statement that has no bearing now.

Regardless, Weber isn't going to Toronto ... and just leave it at that.

Have you seent heir defense? He'd be their best d by a mile.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Weber would be great with rielly but the cap hit after those forward contracts would be near impossible.

 

[Johnny31]

Reilly is better for the leafs than Webber would potentially be. Dont live in the past

 

[JianYang]

I can't believe we are still talking about this.

The Habs lost the trade mainly because subban was more suited to where the game was going, and is like 4 years younger than Weber.

Another thing not in Weber's favour is the supporting cast. Subban has josi, Ellis, and ekholm around him which will make him look that much better.

Weber has petry and.... (Crickets)

Even the best players in this league's history never won squat without a good team around them.

I'm not saying Weber is bad. He's actually better than he gets credit for around here, and is more than capable of being one of the best dmen in the league, but this is a lost trade no doubt.

 

[Harry Kakalovich]

The reason people haven't moved on is because they disagree with what you have said. Imagine that, opinions different from yours.

Stunning. Next you'll tell me there are actually billions of different people on earth.

Thanks you've helped me understand your mindset.

 

[JianYang]

Babcock isn't dying to get Weber, his no.1 dman for team canada? What are you on?

He'd take weber on the leafs in a millisecond, but for multiple reasons it's not a possibility. Impossibility and lack of interest are two different things.

Babcock is actually the founder of the term "man mountain". He gushes over Weber. Question is whether dubas feels the same. Somehow, I don't think he values him as much.

 

[the]

Asked about the impact of new Montreal Canadien Shea Weber, Team Canada coach Mike Babcock gushed — or at least as close to gushing as Mike Babcock gets — as he discussed the impact of the hulking defenceman who played for him on the 2010 and 2014 Olympic gold medal teams.

“Just physically, he’s man-mountain,” Babcock said on Tuesday.

“When he looks at you, you know (he means) business. He’s as good a human being as I’ve ever been around, period. So he doesn’t have to say much, all he’s got to (do) is look at you and you snap into shape. He makes you a better coach.

“If you haven’t been cross-checked in the ribs by him you find out what that is, too. He cuts a big swath out there. He shoots it so hard no one wants to stand in his lane.

“But what I like about him best is when he walks in the dressing room you know it’s business. And so he’s a culture-type person. He makes your franchise better when he walks in the door. Bar none.”

Canada’s Babcock gushes over Canadiens’ Shea Weber