World Cup: SF: Croatia vs. England, 7/11/2018

[Eisen]

I have no idea how Gazza is remembered in the UK today. For as a German he is one of your alltime greats. I read awhile ago he's a heavy drinker. That's sad, but Georgie Best was a heavy drinker, too. (yeah I know, he wasn't English).

I'm not so sure that Gazza is perceived as an alltime great in Germany. He had all the talent but everyone knew he was a headcase and it was always a mystery which version of him would show up. Because he could be flat out lazy and you'll notice it. That was all well known in Germany at that time.

 

[Bon Esprit]

I'm not so sure that Gazza is perceived as an alltime great in Germany. He had all the talent but everyone knew he was a headcase and it was always a mystery which version of him would show up. Because he could be flat out lazy and you'll notice it. That was all well known in Germany at that time.

Of course I am not Germany, and of course Gazza was a lazy ass, but at times he was a great player. I remember 1990, when England had a great team, and he was a really special player at that time.

 

[Lepardi]

I have no idea how Gazza is remembered in the UK today. For as a German he is one of your alltime greats. I read awhile ago he's a heavy drinker.

"A heavy drinker" might be a bit of an understatement. You'll probably be reading his eulogies pretty soon:

 

[Lepardi]

Considering I was 4 and -22 respectively on these occasions, no I don't remember them.

That sounds peculiar cause the goals were 18 years apart. I only know about the Gemmill goal because of Mark Renton's "I haven't felt this good since Archie Gemmill scored against Holland in 78" comment in Trainspotting. There was a time when I knew almost every line in that movie by heart cause I fell in love with the accent.

 

[Stray Wasp]

I have no idea how Gazza is remembered in the UK today. For as a German he is one of your alltime greats. I read awhile ago he's a heavy drinker. That's sad, but Georgie Best was a heavy drinker, too. (yeah I know, he wasn't English).

I look upon him with a mixture of fondness and sadness. He was an extraordinarily talented player, but the peak of his career proved to be the calendar year between May 1990 and May 1991, beginning with his World Cup campaign, and ending with that awful, utterly avoidable injury he suffered in the FA Cup final, which he began in a state of near unbalanced excitement. What followed was mostly injuries, recuperation and weight issues, sporadically interrupted by outbreaks of glorious football, played at a pace that diminished with each new setback.

Although it would be wrong to say he only harmed himself, former teammates line up to speak of his basic warmth and decency. He bonded naturally with kids at coaching and PR gigs. Alas, his roots weren't in the sort of traditional, steady working class background Alan Shearer sprang from. Moving to London was surely a mistake.

Alcohol hasn't been his only issue- there have been problems with mental illness and drugs too (as a child he saw a friend die, with traumatic after effects), and there was a suicide attempt. When I last saw him in the flesh in the autumn of 2012 he looked fearfully haggard, a ghost of a man. But nearly six years later he's still with us.

So he's a slightly unfulfilled talent, and a poignant human figure. But at his best he could dribble, pick out a pass from short or long range, shoot from distance whether in open play or set pieces, fearless but intelligent- as long as his blood wasn't up. His equivalent would walk into the 2018 England team, and command a transfer fee to make your eyes pop.

 

[Corto]

Normally, I'd look to each team's midfield for an indication of the likely eventual result, and that would mean Croatia wins.

But the 2018 World Cup isn't normal.

This version of England isn't that distinguished in terms of individual quality or collective style, but they're organised, more calm and conspicuously less stupid than most of the country's teams since 1996. Croatia, by contrast, seems a little frayed around the edges- and we must wait and see whether they suffered any decisive injuries last night.

Kieran Trippier is pretty much in a state of grace in terms of set-piece deliveries, and when a team like Sweden bungles its marking to allow a goal you begin to wonder where it all ends. And thanks to a header from a free kick the Croats landed an extra half hour's work as recently as last night.

Croatia would be a better team if they could swap Harry Kane for Mandzukic. I'd rather have Subasic (if healthy) in goal than Pickford. Neither team strikes me as having too many options off the bench.

Ultimately, my instinct is that whereas England can't play much better than they have so far, Croatia can- and it feels wrong that Modric should depart the World Cup with a whimper. Though England's 3-5-2 formation hasn't worked badly, yesterday we saw a couple of instances where suddenly they were caught 3 v 3 at the back, with the midfield cut adrift. I can imagine the Croats will be able to pass between their lines.

Whatever, this seems like the playoff for the right to lose the final.

Harry Kane is fantastic, and I'm saying that as someone who doesn't necessarily like his personality. The english press can sometimes overhype their players and than the rest of the world just laughs it off - but in Kane's case, I think he's a top, top striker, capable of holding up the play with best, dropping low, finishing, heading, strong - he's the complete package.

People saying England have been just lucky with the draw etc... You still have to win the games. Sweden beat Mexico and was the better team vs Germany in the first half. Colombia was missing James and playing some seriously negative football, but these teams aren't pushovers. They didn't exactly look to play attacking and score, but you still have to put them away.
England should not be underestimated, not by media, not by Croatia.

As for the game...
England has Kane and Sterling, something Croatia simply doesn't have when it comes to forwards. In these tournaments, having a guy who can put away 1 out of 2 chances as opposed to 1 out of 3 or 4 is HUGE.
Croatian trio (Perisic, Mandzukic, Rebic) is absolutely tireless and will press into oblivion, but their one-on-one skill is nonexist (except Rebic) and their finishing is far from world class (Kramaric might be the best when it comes to finishing, but I expect him to start on the bench).

Assuming none of these teams suddenly goes into a double block 30m from their goal like, guys like Lingard and Ali will leave their midfield positions to make attacking moves, as will Modric/Rakitic/Brozovic.

And that I think will be the biggest change to any game we've seen either of these teams play except Croatia vs Argentina.
There will be space to explore, but also attacking threats to be wary off.
I don't know what to expect. I would obviously very much like Croatia to win, but I'm far from confident in it.

One thing I don't agree is fighting for the "loser" spot in the final.
It's one game, anything can happen... A red card, set piece, early goal and then countering an opponent to death.
While France/Belgium are better on paper than England/Croatia, I wouldn't go more than 60-40 in any of the matchups.

 

[canuckster19]

Hope I'm wrong but I think Croatia will win this pretty easy. England always have a nack of disappointing me when I start to have faith in them.

Since you're a Leaf fan cheering for England, do you find it kind of funny when other Leaf fans don't like England because of their grandiose self-confidence and the perceived insufferable English media? Do you think Leaf fans self reflect on these opinions?

Cheering for England myself too, find it hilarious any time a Leaf fan will make fun of the English media and their fans though.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

The Gazza thing I will always remember is the Raoul Moat affair i.e. when he went to the location of a stand-off between cop killer Raoul Moat and the police and offered to negotiate with Moat having brought chicken and beer with him. I mean it's so 'wtf' and yet somehow in character, it's just so Gazza.

 

[Islesfan22]

Dam i didn't even notice Stones is a starter for England. Surely Croatia will try to take advantage of him as he bottled it quite a few times for City.

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

Dam i didn't even notice Stones is a starter for England. Surely Croatia will try to take advantage of him as he bottled it quite a few times for City.

So far in this tournament, the guy to target in England's back three isn't Stones, it's Walker.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

In the past few weeks i've heard on here that Otamendi is a donkey who's trash, Stones is a bottler, Ferdinho is a POS and Sterling sucks... yet they all played big roles in winning the EPL with a record setting year. Combine that with Pep bought the EPL with an elite squad. Which is it y'all?

 

[Jussi]

But you don't remember Paul Gascoigne chipping the ball over Colin Hendry or Archie Gemmill scoring against Holland?

Talking about little brother complex, the one we have towards Sweden is certainly nothing compared to the grudge you seem to bear against England. We root for Sweden in football here in Finland.



Actually according to the odds it's 58/42 England, and there isn't a better metric for these matches.

No we don't. We root fot England. This time we can go all the way!

 

[Islesfan22]

In the past few weeks i've heard on here that Otamendi is a donkey who's trash, Stones is a bottler, Ferdinho is a POS and Sterling sucks... yet they all played big roles in winning the EPL with a record setting year. Combine that with Pep bought the EPL with an elite squad. Which is it y'all?

Yes all have won the title with City but Stones has made big mistakes in the past for City just like Lovren has for Liverpool. Then again lots of the England players are filled Spurs who are notorious chokers.

 

[spintheblackcircle]

I think Croatia takes a 1-0 lead but Kane and Linegard will score for an England win.

 

[Blender]

In the past few weeks i've heard on here that Otamendi is a donkey who's trash, Stones is a bottler, Ferdinho is a POS and Sterling sucks... yet they all played big roles in winning the EPL with a record setting year. Combine that with Pep bought the EPL with an elite squad. Which is it y'all?

Otamendi definitely can't carry a defense, he's only good when heavily protected defensively like he was this year at City . He was awful for City in 15-16 and 16-17 and getting exposed all the time, and that was the case for Argentina for the same reasons. Stones only played 18 of 38 EPL games this year. Stones was also bad in 16-17 and wasn't exactly great in 17-18 when playing.

 

[kovacro]

England has been so good this tournament with regards to set pieces and that’s my primary concern. It’s been clinical on their part. Mcguire has been very involved and I’d a danger.

@Corto with a good overview of the matchup in which I tend to agree.

I’m hoping our guys can shake off the niggles and knocks from the last game and are at 100% or very close to for the semi. We surely cannot afford to be without Vrsaljko. Such a key component to the side.

Hoping Subasic can shake off his injury as well. I do like our backup Kalinic should something arise. We actually have a couple capable guys between thr sticks which is nice for a change.

As with Denmark and Russia previous, who I said would be tight games, this no will be no different.

Obviously my heart says Croatia, but my head says England. Hoping for a compelling and well played semi.

PS.. no pk’s please, the ticker cannot take anymore. End it in 90’

 

[bluumax]

Croatia are the one team i liked coming in to the tourney but wasn't really interested in watching, other than the Argentina game ive only watched small periods.

They seem to lack a true scoring threat up front and rely too much on midfield for obvious reasons, Modric is incredible. I think if we can choke their midfield we can really restrict their offense. I probably should be worried about our back three, but really, they have played very well so far and have given no reason to change them or doubt them.

For me, this is a game about Jordan Henderson, and whether he can stay tight and shut Modric down, if he can, and then distribute like he did against Sweden then we will have a chance.

Im really proud of England for getting this far, if this is where it ends it wont change that.

How do Croatia generally set up? and how mobile are their defense?- watching some of the balls in to Sterling on saturday i get the feeling England have found something there (direct ball down the middle behind the defense- let Sterling beat them for pace) that hadn't occurred to them before, might be something we see again if Croatia lack pace at the back

 

[Ivan13]

Šime is probably out against England, apparently, he did his knee in. It will be interesting to see how we set up on the back end, Ćorluka probably gets in which could be good as it adds another guy who is very good defending the dead ball. Mandžukić, Lovren, Vida, Ćorluka, Perišić all can command the air, which will be important against the English, whose main source of the offense are set pieces.

Also, it will be fun to see this team play against an opponent whose main goal isn't to play a cynical, tight, defensive football. This should - at least in theory - allow for the midfield to break down the structure of their opponent by breaking the lines by keeping the ball on the ground, rather the hoofing it upfield like they were forced to do most of the match against the Danes and at times against Zbornaja. The other interesting thing will be to see how England's full backs act playing against the likes of Perišić and Rebić, will they be able to play high upfield, or will they be forced to be more cautious given the threat there?

And last but not least, I'd want to touch on the subject of our CF. A layman would look at Mandžo's stats and see a guy who runs himself in the ground but doesn't score much, but the truth is that he has been an instrumental part of our success. In the game against Nigeria he forced the Nigerian defender to put one into his own net and got us a penalty, against Argentina, he run their D absolutely ragged with Rebić. Scored against Denmark and was instrumental against defending their set pieces and throw-ins and last but not least created both goals against Russians, first by finding Kramarić for a tap-in and then blocking Ignashevich and taking him out of the play on Vida's header. Sure he messed up on the Fernandes goal, but without him, we would've been out before the ET even started and he again pressed the backline like a madman, and played an instrumental at defending against the set pieces. Is he as good as a Kane or other top scorers? No. Is he insanely important to Croatia and does he play a role only a couple of strikers can? Absolutely.

 

[Ivan13]

Croatia are the one team i liked coming in to the tourney but wasn't really interested in watching, other than the Argentina game ive only watched small periods.

They seem to lack a true scoring threat up front and rely too much on midfield for obvious reasons, Modric is incredible. I think if we can choke their midfield we can really restrict their offense. I probably should be worried about our back three, but really, they have played very well so far and have given no reason to change them or doubt them.

For me, this is a game about Jordan Henderson, and whether he can stay tight and shut Modric down, if he can, and then distribute like he did against Sweden then we will have a chance.

Im really proud of England for getting this far, if this is where it ends it wont change that.

How do Croatia generally set up? and how mobile are their defense?- watching some of the balls in to Sterling on saturday i get the feeling England have found something there (direct ball down the middle behind the defense- let Sterling beat them for pace) that hadn't occurred to them before, might be something we see again if Croatia lack pace at the back

They don't lack pace.

 

[philip]

Get that to ****. I ****ing hate the English and would be about as happy seeing them lose a World Cup final as I would Scotland winning one. Or maybe just this one in particular.

I don't have a memory any more and I have a curious ability to forget just about anything about a sporting event I've seen. I couldn't tell you a thing about any European Championships in my life. World Cups the same, mostly, aside from finals and especially memorable moments. There are a few things which persist in the memory, however.

I remember Ronaldinho chipping David Seaman from forty yards.
I remember Zidane vomiting on the penalty spot then scoring.
Then scoring a free kick two minutes later.
I remember the Portuguese beating them on penalties.
I remember the Portuguese beating them on penalties.
I remember the advert for Borat popping up on the (then new) electronic advertising boards when Paul Robinson decided to let the ball go straight through him.
I remember being in a pub for the Slovenia game and them thinking this meant their tournament was on track.
I remember Ian Wright declaring England will SMASH Germany, smash them as soon as the group was over.
I remember Neuer's face mirroring the world, knowing that ball had crossed the line and not carrying.
I remember no introspection for being put out the World Cup by Germany on a given goal which didn't cross the line.
I remember Pirlo ripping the utter pish for 120 minutes then hitting a Panenka, because who else would?
I remember watching Harry Kane take corners.
I remember Alan Shearer crying, and me offering more insight into their problems in a post on here than he's done in his life.

Now, I've known a few English people in my time in various ways. I'll probably be at work with one on Monday. I technically am related to several of them. One in particular who I'll never see again has a piece of my heart and doesn't know this. Stray Wasp posts on here and is about the closest anywhere on HF comes to universal acclaim, even if he's been getting a bit over-excited as the rounds have passed. That's not his fault though, it's the team's for not doing the done thing and exiting.

Aside from all of those things, this tournament has been unlike any other I've experienced because there's been no certainty. Usually you know within five minutes of England's first game when they're going out but here, there's nothing. And until I know they're not going to win, there's no enjoyment for me. There are several good options available - a country with a smaller population than Scotland beats them, a country managed by Roberto Martinez beats them or the French beat them - but until they do, there's a nagging doubt about it I've never experienced before. Until I can experience the usual comedown from the English media I'm unable to avoid consuming, the irregular fervour we've experienced just grates. It can't be tuned out like normal.

So until that natural order restores itself I refer you to my opening line. Although if Queen Nic wishes to meet the Croatian president and beg her to teach us how to produce footballers she can hold on to the trophy all she wants. She may as well. We'll run out of room for stars above the badge in her lifetime. The national team will make Auchinleck Talbot look constrained by comparison.

Jesus, isn't it tiring carrying so much negative energy around with you all the time? 'I f***ing hate the English' is actually quite offensive, I'm surprised you're allowed to come out with lines like that without being warned. Something like 'I f***ing hate pakis' certainly would.

On the game, I put this in the Caps football thread, but I love Croatia. I've been a few times, the country, it's people, its cities and towns are all beautiful. I've got a major soft spot in my heart for Croatia and if England don't progress I couldn't think of a country I'd rather be knocked out by.

It's gonna be a close one for sure. If Croatia have trouble defending set pieces they might be in a bit of trouble, but equally unless we might a way to choke out Modric then he might just run the show. One things for sure I don't think we'll be allowed to dominate possession the way we have so far.

 

[canuckster19]

Jesus, isn't it tiring carrying so much negative energy around with you all the time? 'I ****ing hate the English' is actually quite offensive, I'm surprised you're allowed to come out with lines like that without being warned. Something like 'I ****ing hate pakis' certainly would.

On the game, I put this in the Caps football thread, but I love Croatia. I've been a few times, the country, it's people, its cities and towns are all beautiful. I've got a major soft spot in my heart for Croatia and if England don't progress I couldn't think of a country I'd rather be knocked out by.

It's gonna be a close one for sure. If Croatia have trouble defending set pieces they might be in a bit of trouble, but equally unless we might a way to choke out Modric then he might just run the show. One things for sure I don't think we'll be allowed to dominate possession the way we have so far.

Scottish cringe - Wikipedia

 

[hatterson]

In the past few weeks i've heard on here that Otamendi is a donkey who's trash, Stones is a bottler, Ferdinho is a POS and Sterling sucks... yet they all played big roles in winning the EPL with a record setting year. Combine that with Pep bought the EPL with an elite squad. Which is it y'all?

Otamendi is fine in a defense like City where they don’t have to defend a ton.
Stones has played well this tourney and maybe he’ll finally unlock his potential, but I’ll believe it when I see it.
Fernandinho is a fine midfielder but can’t fill the DM role near as well as Casimero.
Sterling is fine as a 4th or 5th offensive option on a team, he’s still got brutal last touch and bottles a ton of chances, which hurts a lot when you’re the second scoring option and the one of the strike pair who isn’t coming back to midfield to touch the ball all the time.

 

[Ivan13]

Xavi raving over Luka and Ivan in El Mundo Deportivo.

Of the four semifinalists of the World Cup, Croatia is the only team that builds their football in the midfield. Belgium and France are more direct.

Returning to the subject of Ivan Rakitic and Luka Modric, Xavi Hernández believes that "they are two of the most complete midfielders I have seen, two modern footballers, they have it all". "The two set the tone for Croatia. I love how they play, how they are associated, how they complement and releve ", values Terrassa.
For Xavi, "Rakitic is one of the best signings that Barça has made in their history. Every day it improves, it knows how to adapt to what the team needs at each moment and lives an extraordinary football maturity. Like Luka Modric, another that would have gone well to Barça. They are two authentic 'monsters' of the ball. " Heirs of Xavi and Iniesta, with their 'DNA'

The only big difference, as Xavi Hernández told MD, is that "we had Busi and they did not." It is true, Croatia gives that role to Marcelo Brozovic, very different from SergioBusquets.

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

In the past few weeks i've heard on here that Otamendi is a donkey who's trash, Stones is a bottler, Ferdinho is a POS and Sterling sucks... yet they all played big roles in winning the EPL with a record setting year. Combine that with Pep bought the EPL with an elite squad. Which is it y'all?

Stones has been one of England's better players, together with Trippier, Henderson and Maguire.

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

I have no idea how Gazza is remembered in the UK today. For as a German he is one of your alltime greats. I read awhile ago he's a heavy drinker. That's sad, but Georgie Best was a heavy drinker, too. (yeah I know, he wasn't English).

He has a twitter account if you want to check it out. And yes, it is rather sad.