Samuel Girard - Best player from the 3 way trade?

[triggrman]

Has he scored a goal or an assist yet? Truly didn’t know he was actually in the NHL.

 

[Eltuna]

Has he scored a goal or an assist yet? Truly didn’t know he was actually in the NHL.

He’s only looked okay, I think if he sticks it’s as a 3rd/4th liner so not a huge loss. I think from a pure value perspective, both Nashville and Ottawa probably “lost” the trade. Kamenev, a 2nd, and Girard is more valuable than Turris and Bowers, Turris a good 1st, a 3rd, and Hammond is too much for Duchene. The difference to me is that with Nashville at least they’re going for a cup, if they can win a cup it won’t really matter how amazing Girard looks it will all be worth it.

 

[cgf]

Fair enough dude, and Im gonna make peace with ya. Its clearly not all of you.

But having said that, your Sens thread is still going strong, and you agree that its fairly classless, so hopefully you can understand my frustration.

I actually have always liked the Avs myself, and hope you guys keep doing well. But ill be equally happy to drink some salty tears at the end of the year if we do well and shut some haters up over there.

I totally get the frustration at the shade being thrown at your organization from all directions...there's a reason most avs fans stuck to HFavs (for the most part) during that horrific 2016-2017 season and why it took a few years for us to stop making jokes about having gifted Yakubov to the caps after the Varlamov trade. Which is why, even though it is a sunk cost, I expect you guys to celebrate every draft position you move up and I have no qualms with that.

I just wanted to point out that although you'll see more from the obnoxious avs fans in general board threads about Duchene, it's not because we're all smug pricks...while reminding you that there were plenty of smug Sens fans prior to the trade, if we were to judge each other's fanbases based on the worst amongst us.

FWIW I think you will do a lot better than all of the avs fans who are salivating at the thought of Hughes or Kakko, expect. I've posted in depth about it on multiple occasions, but I really liked a lot of the young forwards you have breaking-in/on-the-doorstep...and that youthful excuberance + a healthier locker-room, can provide a massive boost given the parity in this sport and the proven talent that is still on that roster; especially if Anderson decided to have one last insane season out of spite before age finally caught up to him for good

 

[cgf]

And I understand that its not personal. But accept that we're going to give it right back to you guys as long as we are still looking and playing great.

I think the only reason most of us took issue with your comments was because you called out the whole fanbase's class. Some good-natured ribbing is only to be expected after a blockbuster trade like this.

 

[triggrman]

He’s only looked okay, I think if he sticks it’s as a 3rd/4th liner so not a huge loss. I think from a pure value perspective, both Nashville and Ottawa probably “lost” the trade. Kamenev, a 2nd, and Girard is more valuable than Turris and Bowers, Turris a good 1st, a 3rd, and Hammond is too much for Duchene. The difference to me is that with Nashville at least they’re going for a cup, if they can win a cup it won’t really matter how amazing Girard looks it will all be worth it.

I don’t know that Nashville lost value wise, A bottom pairing defenseman is not more valuable than a 2nd line center, extended.

 

[Eltuna]

I don’t know that Nashville lost value wise, A bottom pairing defenseman is not more valuable than a 2nd line center, extended.

Girard might’ve been that on Nahville, but trust me this kid is really special. If the Ottawa pick ended up as let’s say 5th overall, I think it would be the second most valuable piece of the trade.

 

[triggrman]

Girard might’ve been that on Nahville, but trust me this kid is really special. If the Ottawa pick ended up as let’s say 5th overall, I think it would be the second most valuable piece of the trade.

I agree Girard is great, but his value to Nashville was a bottom pairing defenseman.

 

[cgf]

He ain't much of one. When David Poile basically dumps you as a Center, that generally isn't a good sign.

As far as the topic goes we knew Girard was going to be solid, we said as much when the trade happened. But he was going to be buried at number 5 for a while, so it was the right move to make.

*shrug* Kam's done nicely anchoring our 4th line so far and is getting more & more responsibility. Who knows if he'll ever grow into a Soderberg-esque middle-6er, but he's looking like he'll play in this league for quite a while...and a successful top 9 future is not out of the question at all. I'm still not a particularly big fan of his and don't think he'll ever be an ideal 2C, but he's looking like a legit NHLer now that he's healthy again.


Also feels like your underselling Girard something fierce by calling him just "solid"; especially with the step that it looks like he's taken this season. He may have not developed as quickly in Nashville, but he's outplaying Zadorov, Johnson & Barrie so far...and I just adore Zads, so it hurts to admit that our other young LHD is outshining him right now.

 

[Eltuna]

I agree Girard is great, but his value to Nashville was a bottom pairing defenseman.

Thats why I agree the trade makes sense from a Nahville perspective, even if Girard has a lot more value than Turris currently does only a year later. Sometimes you need to “lose” a trade to improve your team.

 

[cgf]

I don’t know that Nashville lost value wise, A bottom pairing defenseman is not more valuable than a 2nd line center, extended.

That logic doesn't fly...otherwise Norris-candidate Seth Jones should only have been valued as a bottom pairing blueliner in the RyJo trade because of the role he filled for you at the time.

That usage is why the piece was moveable for you at the time, but that doesn't change the value of the piece on the trade market...otherwise avs fans could talk about how we traded a 2nd line forward who spent quite a bit of time on the wing, for a #1 blueliner++++++

Not saying it was a loss for you value-wise, as I don't think it was, just don't like that argument and feel it's misleading.

 

[Armourboy]

*shrug* Kam's done nicely anchoring our 4th line so far and is getting more & more responsibility. Who knows if he'll ever grow into a Soderberg-esque middle-6er, but he's looking like he'll play in this league for quite a while...and a successful top 9 future is not out of the question at all. I'm still not a particularly big fan of his and don't think he'll ever be an ideal 2C, but he's looking like a legit NHLer now that he's healthy again.


Also feels like your underselling Girard something fierce by calling him just "solid"; especially with the step that it looks like he's taken this season. He may have not developed as quickly in Nashville, but he's outplaying Zadorov, Johnson & Barrie so far...and I just adore Zads, so it hurts to admit that our other young LHD is outshining him right now.

He is solid, he hasn't been in the league or played enough games to call him something special yet. He is a player that would be the #5 defenseman on the Preds though so once he plays a bit more and we see what happens then maybe we can move him up. For right now yes he's just solid.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

For Nashville, it all depends on whether or not they win the cup. I feel strongly that a cheap Girard+ is better than Turris, but if they win the cup, who cares. Its like the neuwendyk for iggy trade, only acceptable cause of cup.

 

[Eltuna]

He is solid, he hasn't been in the league or played enough games to call him something special yet. He is a player that would be the #5 defenseman on the Preds though so once he plays a bit more and we see what happens then maybe we can move him up. For right now yes he's just solid.

I’m biased since I love what Girard brings but he’s a lot more than just solid. He absolutely belongs in the Chabot/Makar tier in my eyes. He wouldn’t have gotten the playing time on Nashville but that doesn’t mean he’s a 5D. Johansen would be a 3C on Pittsburgh/Toronto but that doesn’t mean he’s a 3C.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Girard is playing on the top pairing right now and has been easily out best defender even while playing that role.


Hilarious to read Preds fans valuing him as a "bottom pairing defender"

Will make for a good bump in a couple years.

 

[The Abusement Park]

He is solid, he hasn't been in the league or played enough games to call him something special yet. He is a player that would be the #5 defenseman on the Preds though so once he plays a bit more and we see what happens then maybe we can move him up. For right now yes he's just solid.

Just because he’d be the 5th best dman on the Preds doesn’t mean he isn’t special or being less to the table. Just speaks to the talent on your d core. But Girard clearly has a ton of upside and what he’s done in the league at 20 is insane.

 

[Jumptheshark]

I just wanted people to see this play



As an Avs fan, he's more valuable than Duchene by far.

Would you guys rather have Duchene/Turris over Girard?

so one play is the deciding factor?

 

[RandomAvsFan]

But having said that, your Sens thread is still going strong, and you agree that its fairly classless, so hopefully you can understand my frustration.

I actually have always liked the Avs myself, and hope you guys keep doing well. But ill be equally happy to drink some salty tears at the end of the year if we do well and shut some haters up over there.

A thread on the Colorado Avalanche board keeping track of the team who owes us a 1st round pick is not classless. Some of the comments may be classless (not nearly as many as you're suggesting,) but the thread and idea behind it is not. If you don't like Avalanche fans talking about the pick, I suggest you stay away from that thread, which again is on the Avs board.

 

[Hasbro]

so one play is the deciding factor?

It's really every game with him and something like this.

 

[triggrman]

Girard is playing on the top pairing right now and has been easily out best defender even while playing that role.


Hilarious to read Preds fans valuing him as a "bottom pairing defender"

Will make for a good bump in a couple years.

That's what he was here and what he would have been for years.

Honestly, how many years do you give him to replace one of our top 4?

He had less value to us than a 2nd line center, just like Jones had less value than a 1st line center.

And if you want to really talk about bumping threads go back and read the Duchene threads that your fans blasted us for saying Girard should be part of a trade for Duchene. You guys pretty much called us idiots for suggesting it and laughed about Girard being special and called him an average prospect.

 

[67 others]

Girard is playing on the top pairing right now and has been easily out best defender even while playing that role.


Hilarious to read Preds fans valuing him as a "bottom pairing defender"

Will make for a good bump in a couple years.

On their team he WOULD be a bottom pairing Defender.

Josi/Subban
Ellis/Ekholm

He is not better than a single one of those guys. Maybe in a few years

it is no different than saying Josi was a Mid pairing defender until Weber and Suter were gone

 

[cgf]

so one play is the deciding factor?

Yes

 

[cgf]

And if you want to really talk about bumping threads go back and read the Duchene threads that your fans blasted us for saying Girard should be part of a trade for Duchene. You guys pretty much called us idiots for suggesting it and laughed about Girard being special and called him an average prospect.

You should maybe do that yourself before making assumptions. Cause some avs fans weren't thrilled with Girard, but not all. I loved Girard and repeatedly posted that I would've been happy with Girard + Kamenev + 1st...even though I wanted to squeeze Tolvanen into the package instead of Kam & the pick. And I wasn't alone.

 

[Armourboy]

I’m biased since I love what Girard brings but he’s a lot more than just solid. He absolutely belongs in the Chabot/Makar tier in my eyes. He wouldn’t have gotten the playing time on Nashville but that doesn’t mean he’s a 5D. Johansen would be a 3C on Pittsburgh/Toronto but that doesn’t mean he’s a 3C.

Like I said he is solid. Yall act like that's a bad thing or because I don't act like he is the second coming of Bobby Orr that I'm talking bad about him. He's a good solid Dman, in a few years he may be regarded as great, time or insane stats will prove that out.

 

[cgf]

On their team he WOULD be a bottom pairing Defender.

Josi/Subban
Ellis/Ekholm

He is not better than a single one of those guys. Maybe in a few years

it is no different than saying Josi was a Mid pairing defender until Weber and Suter were gone

Nah. Girard is a #1 dman for us, whereas only 1 of those preds can be a #1 dman for them. That means that Girard > 3 of those Preds blueliners.

 

[cgf]

Like I said he is solid. Yall act like that's a bad thing or because I don't act like he is the second coming of Bobby Orr that I'm talking bad about him. He's a good solid Dman, in a few years he may be regarded as great, time or insane stats will prove that out.

Just because it'll take you a few years to believe it doesn't mean he's not special now.