Salary Cap: Salary Cap Thread - Waiting for Goaldot

[Andy99]

Lol…if only we had cap space and all these players were actually interested in joining the Pens…

 

[Turin]

Lol…if only we had cap space and all these players were actually interested in joining the Pens…

Yea who cares about depth and having cap space for more important moves later. Also they aren’t 4th liners. Ryan Wilson once again is the biggest idiot.

 

[ChaosAgent]

No it isn't.

Ouch. Okay, 40.

Wow I've completely lost the ability to mental math. It's Sad.

 

[dogthateats]

Who cares about anything

 

[Empoleon8771]

Things that will always remain certain:

1. Death
2. Taxes
3. Ryan Wilson posting stupid shit on twitter

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

The good news for people here is that ZAR is pretty much definitely gone after this year, because he's a UFA and has been difficult to negotiate with both times as a RFA.

There's not a chance in hell he re-signs with the Penguins. He'll go to UFA and get some stupid contract from an ultra desperate team, and the contract will be bought out like 2 years into it

Yeah this is a good point.

I dunno. I can't say I'm a fan really. And I wonder about this coach and his pets sometimes. But it's tough to complain.

 

[Headshot77]

The good news for people here is that ZAR is pretty much definitely gone after this year, because he's a UFA and has been difficult to negotiate with both times as a RFA.

There's not a chance in hell he re-signs with the Penguins. He'll go to UFA and get some stupid contract from an ultra desperate team, and the contract will be bought out like 2 years into it

Yeah, if he manages to pot like 15 goals while still being "elite defensively" then some team is gonna do stupid things to get him.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Given the cap restrictions we are under, I think Hextall did OK.

We all wanted Pettersson, maybe Zucker and Jarry moved out for space to make upgrades, but without being in the FO we will never know if they attempted that and if so, what it would take to do. Hextall is more conservative than GMJR, and likely wouldn't have dumped those guys at any cost. Seems like the cost was too high so he opted to stand pat and save the assets to spend another day. We are going to need that style over the next few years to either compete for a cup or rebuild. The cupboard is bare and the bad contracts are starting to pile up, so resources need to be spent very carefully going forward.

 

[TimmyD]

The good news for people here is that ZAR is pretty much definitely gone after this year, because he's a UFA and has been difficult to negotiate with both times as a RFA.

There's not a chance in hell he re-signs with the Penguins. He'll go to UFA and get some stupid contract from an ultra desperate team, and the contract will be bought out like 2 years into it

That doesn't help with the fact that he is getting paid almost $2 million to suck on our roster this upcoming season

 

[ChaosAgent]

I think if Zucker produces similarly next year with Carter - and I think there's a very good chance he does - he won't have the big caveat of "but he's dragging Evgeni freaking Malkin down..."

Which was true, of course, but regardless then next January-February we could use Zucker to go big-game hunting on the wing. He'd already have the salary to match and he'd be a much more attractive asset.

 

[Empoleon8771]

That doesn't help with the fact that he is getting paid almost $2 million to suck on our roster this upcoming season

ZAR objectively doesn't suck.

He may not be anything special but he objectively does not suck.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

ZAR objectively doesn't suck.

He may not be anything special but he objectively does not suck.

"Suck" is way too strong a word and elicits too strong an emotion to describe dude.

He's a bucket of wallpaper paste.

 

[TimmyD]

ZAR objectively doesn't suck.

He may not be anything special but he objectively does not suck.

He objectively does suck. You could pay a guy $800,000 to do what ZAR does...I don't care about defensive analytics. He isn't very good and now he is eating up close to $2 million. There was no reason to even bring him back this year

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think Hextall overall did a good job this off-season considering the expansion draft, flat salary cap and the absolute insanity that free agency was. The worst you can say about this team is that it's basically the exact same as the team as last year but with McCann swapped for Heinen. Considering they had to lose someone in the expansion draft and likely would have also had to lose some highly paid players due to the cap, I don't think maintaining the same caliber roster while becoming cap compliant and gaining a prospect is a bad job.

 

[Empoleon8771]

He objectively does suck. You could pay a guy $800,000 to do what ZAR does...I don't care about defensive analytics. He isn't very good and now he is eating up close to $2 million. There was no reason to even bring him back this year

Lol based on what?

ZAR's a guy who doesn't get scored on, produces at a fine rate for a depth guy and just eats crappy defensive minutes in a bottom-6 role. Saying he "sucks" implies that there are about 200 players in the NHL that "suck".

"Suck" is way too strong a word and elicits too strong an emotion to describe dude.

He's a bucket of wallpaper paste.

This is a much more accurate statement than saying ZAR "sucks".

No, Jack Johnson "sucks". ZAR? At worst, you can argue he does nothing.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I think Hextall overall did a good job this off-season considering the expansion draft, flat salary cap and the absolute insanity that free agency was. The worst you can say about this team is that it's basically the exact same as the team as last year but with McCann swapped for Heinen. Considering they had to lose someone in the expansion draft and likely would have also had to lose some highly paid players due to the cap, I don't think maintaining the same caliber roster while becoming cap compliant and gaining a prospect is a bad job.

I mean not to take a page from Ryan Wilson but I personally would have preferred to take a chance on a guy like Tatar or even Saad while moving on from Zucker (I'm reasonably certain despite some rosy predictions that he's just gonna derp around the ice looking lost all next year again) but I mean all in all considering the ass spot JR put this team in and how zany prices on the market were... could have been far worse. I set lofty goals and don't really expect them to be met. But at least this all seems... competent.

I know people whinge about goaltending but I never considered that the be-all end-all problem on this team and there is still time in-season so whatever.

 

[displacedpensfan]

ZAR objectively doesn't suck.

He may not be anything special but he objectively does not suck.

"Suck" is a scientific term I reserve to quantify Jack Johnson's performance as a Penguin.

Going forward, I think it's crucial to find a way to move Zucker by the end of the year-the Penguins can afford to trade some term for a lower cap hit. Move him, and next offseason gets a bit easier. I don't know what you do about Petterson though.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I mean not to take a page from Ryan Wilson but I personally would have preferred to take a chance on a guy like Tatar or even Saad while moving on from Zucker (I'm reasonably certain despite some rosy predictions that he's just gonna derp around the ice looking lost all next year again) but I mean all in all considering the ass spot JR put this team in and how zany prices on the market were... could have been far worse. I set lofty goals and don't really expect them to be met. But at least this all seems... competent.

I know people whinge about goaltending but I never considered that the be-all end-all problem on this team and there is still time in-season so whatever.

Tatar isn't very good but I would have been happy to do that with Saad. But the problem is I don't really view that as an "improvement", that's just a lateral swap where you're hoping Saad fits better than Zucker does. I would say the saved cap space would also be a benefit there, but the flip side is that you're also having Saad for 3 more years than Zucker has left on his deal. What if Saad doesn't work out here? You're stuck with him because Saad also got a full NMC.

There were moves this off-season that I would have been happy had Hextall made, but there were substantially more moves that I would have been really mad had Hextall made. I don't think patience is a negative.

 

[Gurglesons]

I mean not to take a page from Ryan Wilson but I personally would have preferred to take a chance on a guy like Tatar or even Saad while moving on from Zucker (I'm reasonably certain despite some rosy predictions that he's just gonna derp around the ice looking lost all next year again) but I mean all in all considering the ass spot JR put this team in and how zany prices on the market were... could have been far worse. I set lofty goals and don't really expect them to be met. But at least this all seems... competent.

I know people whinge about goaltending but I never considered that the be-all end-all problem on this team and there is still time in-season so whatever.

That's fine. But you can't say ZAR sucks and the analytics are wrong and then try to defend Tatar. Not saying you are making this argument, but Tatar has been scratched in two consecutive finals runs.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Tatar isn't very good but I would have been happy to do that with Saad. But the problem is I don't really view that as an "improvement", that's just a lateral swap where you're hoping Saad fits better than Zucker does. I would say the saved cap space would also be a benefit there, but the flip side is that you're also having Saad for 3 more years than Zucker has left on his deal. What if Saad doesn't work out here? You're stuck with him because Saad also got a full NMC.

Ha that's funny because I'm actually less enamored with Saad than Tatar for the reasons you laid out... Tatar would have been a very loose commitment. I also see your overall point re: fit but frankly I don't think fit can get any worse than Jason Zucker. I know he had some bright spots here and there and his playoffs were respectable. But I feel like we're kinda reaching for compliments, here.

Regardless there weren't many great options out there that weren't heavily laden with risk. And this team cannot afford any more unforced errors. I can't stress enough that the previous crybaby quitter GM left them in a pretty unenviable spot.

 

[ChaosAgent]

"Suck" is a scientific term I reserve to quantify Jack Johnson's performance as a Penguin.

Going forward, I think it's crucial to find a way to move Zucker by the end of the year-the Penguins can afford to trade some term for a lower cap hit. Move him, and next offseason gets a bit easier. I don't know what you do about Petterson though.

I'm not sure about Pettersson either. He is what he is and I doubt he lives up to that contract. Having said that there will be contenders who will have holes at LD through injury or performance, and if Hextall is opportunistic he could get a good return for Petts as a serviceable but overpaid #4 in-season. The question is whether the org would have the discipline to actually follow through and willingly move from the sure thing in Petts to the question mark in POJ.

I wish we'd just bite the bullet now to open up the cap space - even eating the contract of an overpaid forward ala Sceviour or Spaling to do it - but I can see the rationale behind waiting.

 

[Andy99]

Yeah, Saad and Tatar are not deals I’d be pining for…Bennett, Reinhart trades or something like that, fine… but those two players don’t move the needle

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

That's fine. But you can't say ZAR sucks and the analytics are wrong and then try to defend Tatar. Not saying you are making this argument, but Tatar has been scratched in two consecutive finals runs.

I'm not really defending him. I would be interested in trying something else instead of Zucker since Zucker demonstrably doesn't work and Tatar has a solid track record of ES production.

Him being scratched is a fair point and a concern. But I'm not even convinced that was the right choice and was the topic of conversation at least this year.

I'm not really crusading for it. I just would have liked to see at least one top six piece switched out and something else tried and IMO Zucker makes the most sense. You can't blame me. I've been banging that drum forever.

 

[TimmyD]

Lol...Tatar "isn't very good" but ZAR is ok...makes perfect sense

 

[ChaosAgent]

Ha that's funny because I'm actually less enamored with Saad than Tatar for the reasons you laid out... Tatar would have been a very loose commitment. I also see your overall point re: fit but frankly I don't think fit can get any worse than Jason Zucker. I know he had some bright spots here and there and his playoffs were respectable. But I feel like we're kinda reaching for compliments, here.

Regardless there weren't many great options out there that weren't heavily laden with risk. And this team cannot afford any more unforced errors. I can't stress enough that the previous crybaby quitter GM left them in a pretty unenviable spot.

Zucker will do better flanking Carter of Blueger, whose simple games he can process with his limited offensive IQ. With Crosby he'll score goals through his outstanding hands, even if Sid's body language exudes "this guy doesn't know what he's doing out here."

His value will be higher by the deadline. I've come around to that.