Salary Cap: Salary Cap & Roster Building - Locked in until July

[Riptide]

Did you say fastest skater? At 6'5"? If that's true...wow.

I was thinking the same thing. Hopefully Gonchar can work on his defensive game... Because guys that size who can skate and actually play are guys everyone loves to have.

 

[Riptide]

Let's be honest, a huge percentage of undrafted defensemen don't pan out. Maybe it's just confirmation bias with how the Penguins have developed players, but it seems like there are a lot more undrafted forwards who become regulars than undrafted defensemen. That might just be the way it is with the Penguins, though.

For every Lovejoy, it seems like there are 4 guys like Letestu, Dupuis and Sheary.

Because you have a lot more options up front to hide guys and to give them a chance. I mean it's not like it's a big deal to put ZAR (or Rowney) or whomever on the 4th line and then double shift Crosby/Malkin/Kessel to limit their minutes if they're struggling. Which means its really easy to insert someone into the lineup when they're a forward and then just kind of play it by ear based on how they do. When they're a blueliner... unless you're going to play your other 5D 22+ minutes each... it's a lot harder to hide/shelter someone when they're a D.

There's also the fact that the systems for the D are likely a lot harder/more complex then that of the wingers.

 

[Son Goku]

Because you have a lot more options up front to hide guys and to give them a chance. I mean it's not like it's a big deal to put ZAR (or Rowney) or whomever on the 4th line and then double shift Crosby/Malkin/Kessel to limit their minutes if they're struggling. Which means its really easy to insert someone into the lineup when they're a forward and then just kind of play it by ear based on how they do. When they're a blueliner... unless you're going to play your other 5D 22+ minutes each... it's a lot harder to hide/shelter someone when they're a D.

There's also the fact that the systems for the D are likely a lot harder/more complex then that of the wingers.

So true. Wingers systems are literally mostly just "skate really fast up the board and pass the puck to your nearest teammate if you can't drive to the net"

 

[Empoleon8771]

I made a proposal on the main boards and I'm curious to see what people think, would you do Maatta and Sprong for Klefbom? I'd have to think really hard about that deal, adding a #2 who's a borderline #1 at his best in Klefbom would be a gamechanger for this defense.

 

[Sideline]

I made a proposal on the main boards and I'm curious to see what people think, would you do Maatta and Sprong for Klefbom? I'd have to think really hard about that deal, adding a #2 who's a borderline #1 at his best in Klefbom would be a gamechanger for this defense.

I'm a homer when it comes to Maatta, but I don't want to give up on a guy with his hockey IQ. Get the guy a figure skating coach for the summer.

 

[Shady Machine]

Is Klefbom demonstrably better than Maatta? Why am I adding Sprong?

 

[Empoleon8771]

Is Klefbom demonstrably better than Maatta? Why am I adding Sprong?

I'd say he is, yeah. Klefbom's a #2 who's a borderline #1 on his best day. Maatta's a #3 at absolute best, and you need to limit his minutes or he starts to struggle.

 

[Shady Machine]

I'd say he is, yeah. Klefbom's a #2 who's a borderline #1 on his best day. Maatta's a #3 at absolute best, and you need to limit his minutes or he starts to struggle.

What makes you think that? I suppose I haven't watched him as closely as you have, but I don't see any stats that scream surefire top pairing dman.

 

[Empoleon8771]

What makes you think that? I suppose I haven't watched him as closely as you have, but I don't see any stats that scream surefire top pairing dman.

Good possession stats when playing 23 minutes a night (that TOI is a big deal, since Maatta loses effectiveness when he plays too much). Very good production last year, his production this year isn't at good. Good shot suppression and shot generation numbers. The big difference between the two is that Klefbom can handle 23 minutes a night when Maatta appears to not be able to handle 20.

The Penguins need another minute eater, I've been pretty adamant about that recently. Even if Klefbom isn't much better than Maatta, he can definitely handle more minutes than Maatta. That has a lot of value, especially if you want to limit Letang's minutes. A Klefbom-Letang pair would be one of the best top pairs in all of hockey.

 

[Shady Machine]

Good possession stats when playing 23 minutes a night (that TOI is a big deal, since Maatta loses effectiveness when he plays too much). Very good production last year, his production this year isn't at good. Good shot suppression and shot generation numbers. The big difference between the two is that Klefbom can handle 23 minutes a night when Maatta appears to not be able to handle 20.

The Penguins need another minute eater, I've been pretty adamant about that recently. Even if Klefbom isn't much better than Maatta, he can definitely handle more minutes than Maatta. That has a lot of value, especially if you want to limit Letang's minutes. A Klefbom-Letang pair would be one of the best top pairs in all of hockey.

A Dumo-Letang pair should be one of the best in hockey and is when Letang plays well. Fair points on the minute munching, but I question if adding Sprong to that makes us a better team. Maybe it does. I'd have to watch him play more closely. Appreciate the thoughtful answer.

 

[Turin]

I’d probably do it. I don’t think Maatta is ever going beyond a number 4 at this point.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I'd rather just play Sprong next year. He's got too good a chance of becoming a productive winger to use him as sweetener for a marginal LD upgrade.

 

[Shady Machine]

I'd rather just play Sprong next year. He's got too good a chance of becoming a productive winger to use him as sweetener for a marginal LD upgrade.

That's where I'm at as well.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Where does Sprong realistically fit in, though? I mean... if you are the Penguins and Sullivan.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Where does Sprong realistically fit in, though? I mean... if you are the Penguins and Sullivan.

There is a spot he fits in, Sullivan keeps talking about him with respect to being Sid's long term RWer. The issue is that they have quite a few options for that spot, so they don't "need" Sprong.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

There is a spot he fits in, Sullivan keeps talking about him with respect to being Sid's long term RWer. The issue is that they have quite a few options for that spot, so they don't "need" Sprong.

I'll believe that when I see it. There has been little to no indication that that's the direction they wish to go in, despite the nice words. And your overall point is what I was alluding to. Sprong's chances of having much real success here decreased exponentially about a month ago.

 

[Gurglesons]

I'll believe that when I see it. There has been little to no indication that that's the direction they wish to go in, despite the nice words. And your overall point is what I was alluding to. Sprong's chances of having much real success here decreased exponentially about a month ago.

I’d rather have an organization that values commitment to an overall game and can get it then forcefeeding a kid with a hot shot and a documented difficult attitude a top line spot.

Sprong has not proven he is an NHLer yet and would not help any of the main issues we are actually having this year.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I never said he would. But I like his skillset and wish him success. I'd rather it be here than elsewhere. If not... world will still go round. I'm a fan but you are right that he hasn't proven much at the NHL level, yet.

 

[Peat]

I made a proposal on the main boards and I'm curious to see what people think, would you do Maatta and Sprong for Klefbom? I'd have to think really hard about that deal, adding a #2 who's a borderline #1 at his best in Klefbom would be a gamechanger for this defense.

I've floated the idea here a few times. I'd like a pick back as well, but maybe I'm off base there. Something like this seems the most realistic way to improve our defence and, while I still believe there's a place for Sprong here, the team clearly won't miss match if he moves in a fair deal.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I made a proposal on the main boards and I'm curious to see what people think, would you do Maatta and Sprong for Klefbom? I'd have to think really hard about that deal, adding a #2 who's a borderline #1 at his best in Klefbom would be a gamechanger for this defense.

I'd do it in a heartbeat, I don't know why Edmonton would do that. They're already lacking in high end defenseman, so why would they trade their best one for a downgrade and a good prospect?

 

[Riptide]

What makes you think that? I suppose I haven't watched him as closely as you have, but I don't see any stats that scream surefire top pairing dman.

From what I've seen, he's more of a good #2/great #3 when he's on his game then anything close to being a #1. That said... if there was a way to swap Maatta+ for Klefbom I'd easily do it. Klef suits this team soo much better. He's basically a better version of Dumoulin and comes with an amazing contract.

And if that + included Sprong... damn that would be so hard (remember, this is me and I love Sprong)... but in the end I'd probably do it - if only because at the end of the day, the more mobile quality blueliners we have, the better off our team will be - especially when the current makeup of our blueline is less than ideal.

I'd rather find a way to move Sheary+ then Sprong... but I'd probably still move Sprong.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'd do it in a heartbeat, I don't know why Edmonton would do that. They're already lacking in high end defenseman, so why would they trade their best one for a downgrade and a good prospect?

Not why they'd do this specific deal, but it is rumored that Klefbom may be trade bait because Chiarelli is an idiot. If he's available, I think that's a very competitive package.

I think that for the responses I'm getting from Oilers fans and Penguins fans, it's probably a pretty close to fair trade.

From what I've seen, he's more of a good #2/great #3 when he's on his game then anything close to being a #1. That said... if there was a way to swap Maatta+ for Klefbom I'd easily do it. Klef suits this team soo much better. He's basically a better version of Dumoulin and comes with an amazing contract.

I think a better way to put it is Klefbom is Dumoulin if Dumoulin was actually good offensively.

 

[Riptide]

I never said he would. But I like his skillset and wish him success. I'd rather it be here than elsewhere. If not... world will still go round. I'm a fan but you are right that he hasn't proven much at the NHL level, yet.

That's just it. You don't move him for just anyone, or just because it's "good value" or because you don't see him having a future here (remember, 4 years ago everyone was saying the same thing about Dumoulin). Klefbom is 25 this summer and has 5 years left at 4.16m. Again, I'd rather find another way to get something like that done then with Sprong... but as Emp said, we do have other young forwards. None quite like Sprong... but then while there's no major need to upgrade on Maatta when everyone is healthy and clicking... if we could do so without a cap hit increase or getting much older, and are getting someone who's a much better fit for our team... I'd be very very interested.

 

[Riptide]

I think a better way to put it is Klefbom is Dumoulin if Dumoulin was actually good offensively.

That's a pretty fair assessment.

Dumoulin's inability to put up points is so weird. He pinches, he keeps pucks in the zone, he makes great outlet passes, has a quality shot - and will actually use it. And on top of that, the team produces when he's on the ice, and yet despite all that... the points typically do not really come to him.

 

[Andy99]

I'd do it in a heartbeat, I don't know why Edmonton would do that. They're already lacking in high end defenseman, so why would they trade their best one for a downgrade and a good prospect?

They wouldn't do it...Bob was discussing this on TSN or the like...he says Klef was injured most of the year with a shoulder, that EDM doesn't want to move him with the expectation he'll improve next year....