RW/LW Vasili Podkolzin - SKA St.Petersburg, KHL (2019, 10th, VAN) Part 3
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lawrence
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- May 19, 2012
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he's ready for 4th line role, that is a form of NHL ready too.
. but yea, but this is nothing new, Brian Burke though he was NHL ready when we drafted him as per his comments during the 2019 draft.This is all talk and talk is cheap. He is no 4th liner and has no deal spending time with stone hands. That would be waisting his talent and development.he's ready for 4th line role, that is a form of NHL ready too.
Still trying to fool the westerners I see.
Vityaz has the budget, they had no reason to trade Aaltonen for nothing, while they were leading the league. Yes, they also traded their hot starter to SKA for their backup. After that trade the team fell off a cliff.
And it is not the first time. How does it happen, that their young top prospects end up in SKA all the time?
Rubtsov-check
Podkolzin-check
Khusnutdinov-check
Sochi has 10 players on their roster who played in SKA system before joining Sochi, lots of them played there last year. They also have Nikita Tochitsky, who is a son of Andrey Tochitsky, SKA General Manager.
SoundAndFury
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- May 28, 2012
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Jesus Atas, everyone and their mom understand Sochi is SKA's farm.
Vityaz I think would like to have some dignity and be a somewhat separate entity but money is just too good to turn down for them. In other words, they have dignity but it's fairly cheap.
I agree with your take on Podkolzin though.
Vityaz I think would like to have some dignity and be a somewhat separate entity but money is just too good to turn down for them. In other words, they have dignity but it's fairly cheap.
I agree with your take on Podkolzin though.
You can't understand the simplest things(most people are like that, so not to worry. That's how all the media machine works, with a receptive audience). Vityaz does have the budget? When did that happen?
Rubtsov 0 games for SKA - check?
SKA harvesting all the young talent around the country is now somehow specifically bound to Vityaz? What about young players from other teams? They never existed? Oh, I see, that does not fit your argument.
There are few other rich teams that are exempt from SKA's harvesting attempts. That is the reality, not you neat story. What about Spartak, Severstal and numerous others. All SKA farms? Half the league?
Sochi is an expansion team project built from the scratch. Every single player there comes from some other KHL team's system. There are and were the same amount of former AkBars players on their rosters. Kvartalnov Jr. is there. So what? Are they now AkBars' farm or SKA's? The reality is again different forom your attempts to fix it. Sochi is the leagues' love child. They are held afloat by other teams continuously sending players there that don't fit in with the bigger teams. Not only SKA does that. You rip things out of context, you bend the facts to fit your statements.
Is Sochi now SKA's or AkBars' farm I am confused. I thought we were sending players we did not like there all the time.
Sorry, if he is no 4th liner, why does he seem to be playing as a 4th liner right now in Russia? If he is going to "develop" there playing 4th line minutes, why not do the same here. I must be missing something?
You are, Go through the thread, read it. He is not on the 4th line. And mixing up the misleading term "4th line minutes" and player assignments is the mistake you make. You are also replying to my post in which I explicitly explain what the problem is with playing on the 4th line is - low skill linemates. This is not what is going on with Pordkolzin on SKA. And for the hundredth time playing 8 minutes is not going to hurt his development per se. If people want to believe that minutes equal development - fine, then 10 hours straight of pond hockey with kids would develop a monster of an NHLer.
One thing is certain, if a teenager is yet not deeemed ready to play 15+ minutes in the KHL he is not getting more in the NHL and any other league is worse than the KHL Podkolzin is playing in.
Canucks LB
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Sorry but this thread is gonna look silly in a couple years.
The guy is a train, everytime i watch him I am impressed.
Not just by his motor, but his bull like style on the ice, his game screams NHL.
I have no clue what SKA is thinking right now, Maybe they are annoyed he is leaving next year, Maybe they are doing some tough love, who knows.
But the moment he comes over, he will get 22+ Minutes a night in Utica and or 15+ Min a night in Vancouver.
Guy is gonna be a damn good player, I have no concerns not even in the slightest.
The guy is a train, everytime i watch him I am impressed.
Not just by his motor, but his bull like style on the ice, his game screams NHL.
I have no clue what SKA is thinking right now, Maybe they are annoyed he is leaving next year, Maybe they are doing some tough love, who knows.
But the moment he comes over, he will get 22+ Minutes a night in Utica and or 15+ Min a night in Vancouver.
Guy is gonna be a damn good player, I have no concerns not even in the slightest.
SKA is not developing him, nor do they have any interest in developing a guy who is leaving in 6 months. The KHL is not a development league, it is a win for your job league.
Podkolzin will be over with the Canucks as soon as the KHL season ends and begin working with our coaches and trainers, likely getting bottom 6 minutes.
Having a 19 YO kid fighting for minutes in the 2nd best league in the world is far from the worst thing, especially when you consider the lilihood that the AHL, NCAA and CHL will be cancelled or significantly shortened.
Raistlin
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Cmon, your argument is flimsy at best. There are many types of "development", one cannot be a maestro by simply studying theory and not conducting a piece. Yes he does learn from his training, practice, watching tapes, but his overall development is slowed if you slowplay him on the fourth line playing fourth line minutes.
Everyone knows that you learn more by playing more, you get into a better rhythm if you don't play sporadically less than 3 minutes a period. You learn to play under pressure if Bragin taps you on your shoulder with 1 minute to go in the third, you feel better about yourself playing esp when you know you can impose your will on the game, all elite talent knows internally, Larionov knows and is trying to give him a positive spin on the whole political situation. Thank god the kid is coachable and is mature beyond his years. KHL is the second best league yes, but AHL is not pond hockey.
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Im really torn here,
because in one hand, the tweet is saying many and multiple scouts are saying Podz has a mature 2way game that is NHL ready, then there's also guys like Brian Burke, Craig, Button, Sam Constantino who are knowledgeable hockey guys who are also saying Podz is already a man and can step into the NHL.
But on the other hand, i have an HF poster Joe Schmo saying he is not ready.
This is a tough a call on who to believe.
lol not!
I respectufully disagree with your opionion.
First of all, how can you possibly know if he will or will not be ready in April?
He still has a full season of KHL and WJC in December to go through for his development. His game will be even be better by April.
I cant wait till Podz comes to the NHL in April. Will he be given top 6 minutes right away, no. But thats the great thing about Podkolzin, his game has many shapes. I see him being developed very much like the way Bo Horvat on our team has been developed.
Start off on the 4th line, get a feel for the game and the players, learn the x's and os and maybe play some powerplay 2 and penalty kill. Then slowly work yourself up the lineup.
I have no doubt this guy will be ready for the next level of his development which is the NHL, in April.
The development is not slowed if you are in the 2ndbest league. It is slowed when you play in juniors until you are 20 and then in the AHL until you are "good enough" to leave NA again.
How many times do I have to tell here that he is not playing on the 4th line btw?
And who is everyone? I've heard numerous coaches complain about today's junior leagues because players play too much instead of practicing and learing at the age when they should.
And spare me Larionov. That man's words are null and void to me, because he is a turd and will remain a turd. For the record, I have not yet made any remarks about his coaching as there is no substance to work with yet. And there is NO political situation, except in some twisted minds of some NA journalists.
As for the AHL, it has a track record of being a graveyard for russian prospects who come through the CHL, a better track record for those who go the AHL directly, but it still a mile behind the KHL in terms of developing young Russians.
Those great hockey minds you are trusting selected Kucherov 58th overall. Just saying. But feel free to trust them more on matters they are not necessarily knowledgeable about(russian leagues and russian prospects in particular) and/or have an agenda, be it more clicks in case of the writers or policies of bringing Russians over as soon as possible.
And I sincerely hope two things. One - there is hockey in NA in April. Two - Podkolzin dvelops so fast that he can step into te NHL in April. I don't know which one is more of a mere hope.
And I hope you realize, that for all the hype Podkolzin is still no Ovechkin type of prospect. Those take longer to develop with more bumbs along the road.
I have 0 expectations of Podkolzin developing into an Ovi.
I compare him most to Gabriel Landeskog.
I agree that if a prospect is pure skill like an Elias Pettersson, then there is no point in bringing them into the NHL right away unless a team is prepared to give them top 6 role and minutes and be on powerplay.
However, with players like Podz, I think he can develop extremely well in the NHL even if he starts with a middle/bottom 6 role while killing PK and maybe PP2
Thanks for your (kind) response. I don't need to be bogged down by your back and forth with others and all the baggage that comes with it. And I certainly won't read 100 of your posts to hear you pontificate and defend being in an argument that you created all on your own.
My question was not in any way unfair, and it was a legit inquiry.
I intentionally used the term 4th line minutes, rather than 4th line player. For me, the reason for that language sits in the question: how does his team see him: As a developing top level player, a player they don't yet trust in many situations, or as a player that deserves to only play 6-9 minutes a game? So I was asking you, is he a 4th line player and does the team see him as a 4th line player.
It seems clear to me that the team feels he is less ready right now than the 3-6 wingers playing ahead of him. And that might be a fair assessment. I was and am keen to know if it is also your assessment?
Or something else is going on.
If he is only being given 4th line minutes because he hasn't earned more, than this is completely reasonable usage and it will be up to him if he earns more. And if he legitimately hasn't earned those minutes with his performance, then I would agree he likely would not earn them in Vancouver either.
However, if his team is mis-using him for a variety of other reasons, including him leaving or not signing, him being on a certain contract, then this would be a bad situation for the player and for his development.
I choose to believe that he is a young player that needs to develop and earn trust to be used up the lineup and that he has a bright future ahead of him in time.
I most certainly didn't say that minutes is correlated perfectly to development, but are you seriously trying to argue that there is not at least some correlation between more minutes and development, especially at the level he is playing at? For example, would he be more likely to develop playing first line minutes (let's say 19 minutes a night) in the KHL than 4th line minutes (Say an average of 7 minutes)? Of course he would. Would 2o minutes a night for 4 months in the AHL or MHL be better than 2:30 a night at the KHL level? This is a more complex question.
But, I couldn't help be most struck by you jumping to your pond hockey example. This seems a ridiculous way to have a discussion on this board, IMO.
In the end, sounds like you think he is going to be a good player and just needs some time developing. And I prefer to hear more about that and the answer to my above questions rather than being mocked by you for my question, but to each his own.
Cheers
There is your problem. He is pure skill and top6 player only. Those absurd misconceptions about prospects are why I hate so called experts/writers and whatnot who create those narratives.
Sweet jesus, it's late Sept and we're only 8 games into the season. Podkolzin is fine.
Vancouver fans were saying the same things last year "He's being treated so unfairly! Ice time! Politics!" No, Podkolzin is a kid who's being methodically developed, just like most Russian kids are generally speaking. It has served him well. Last year was a great development year. This was painfully obvious when you pitted him against high-level competition his own age. Seriously, North American hockey culture has an affinity for instant gratification.
Vancouver fans were saying the same things last year "He's being treated so unfairly! Ice time! Politics!" No, Podkolzin is a kid who's being methodically developed, just like most Russian kids are generally speaking. It has served him well. Last year was a great development year. This was painfully obvious when you pitted him against high-level competition his own age. Seriously, North American hockey culture has an affinity for instant gratification.
The Iron Goalie
Formally 'OEL for Norris'
Better get some real mins today, as SKA are dressing 6 teenagers today (including Podkolzin), and are missing 5 of their top 8 scorers. Starts on the 3rd line.
Fun note - Marat Khusnutdinov makes his KHL debut, and will be Podkolzin's centre today!
Fun note - Marat Khusnutdinov makes his KHL debut, and will be Podkolzin's centre today!
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