News Article: Rutherford has resigned - Part 2

[Scandale du Jour]

You got me; that seems like a crappy move they’d make.

I won't lie, I listened to the whole thing (as I do everytime he get got).

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

That video makes me like Futa too.

no idea if any of these guys are good at their jobs

 

[chethejet]

Some times these interviews are used as sounding boards as to what they see organizational wise. I really don't think Mario and Neverland Ron will hire a GM that is lazy as to decision making. No question they were not happy with the kind of returns and signings GMJR had done the last two years. But I like the AGM from the AVS. No retreads please. Tallion. Hextall ect. No No and No.

 

[Beauner]

 

[Randy Butternubs]

I'm really surprised I haven't seen my name mentioned in any of McKenzie's tweets.

 

[Empoleon8771]

It's really interesting that Seattle said no because of "the timeframe Pittsburgh is looking at". I wonder if that is because the Penguins are trying to fill the position ASAP, but Seattle wants to have a full crew for this entire season to be prepared for the expansion draft after the year. That would make sense to me, Seattle is willing to let Botterill go but they don't want to have to scramble to replace him when the expansion draft isn't that far away.

Either way, I'm all aboard the Hextall train.

 

[OswaldBates]

Penguins Brass??? HMMM do they have wind section ?

 

[LOGiK]

So Chris Drury fell through?

Even when he was a player they would mention his ivy league (or whatever it was... maybe law degree?) saying he had options outside of hockey for a successful (lucrative) career. Outside of that he seems like a guy with brains... not sure how much trading/contracts/gm'ing...etcetcetc brain smarts he has, but I wouldn't be upset if he came on board.

Of course he wont, but still.... I always liked Drury. He also reminded me of mulder playing hockey for some reason...

 

[Turin]

It's really interesting that Seattle said no because of "the timeframe Pittsburgh is looking at". I wonder if that is because the Penguins are trying to fill the position ASAP, but Seattle wants to have a full crew for this entire season to be prepared for the expansion draft after the year. That would make sense to me, Seattle is willing to let Botterill go but they don't want to have to scramble to replace him when the expansion draft isn't that far away.

Either way, I'm all aboard the Hextall train.

Hextall is basically Shero. Held on to a bad coach (significantly worse than Bylsma) for way too long, had power struggles with others, got terrible liabilities to play in depth roles, and only real redeeming thing was that some of his younger draft picks (which outside the first round GMs have like nothing to do with) turned out after he was gone.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

Hextall is basically Shero. Held on to a bad coach (significantly worse than Bylsma) for way too long, had power struggles with others, got terrible liabilities to play in depth roles, and only real redeeming thing was that some of his younger draft picks (which outside the first round GMs have like nothing to do with) turned out after he was gone.

it was also his first real experience as a GM
There are not many assistants that leave and make a big impact right away. Look at Botteril that we so didn't want to lose what happened to him in Buffalo
Maybe Brisebois in Tampa, but let's be honest Yzerman left him in a pretty good freaking situation!!

 

[HandshakeLine]

I think Hextall would be okay on the beginning end of a rebuild, but not now.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Hextall is basically Shero. Held on to a bad coach (significantly worse than Bylsma) for way too long, had power struggles with others, got terrible liabilities to play in depth roles, and only real redeeming thing was that some of his younger draft picks (which outside the first round GMs have like nothing to do with) turned out after he was gone.

And Ray Shero won 1 cup, got the Penguins to another cup and made draft picks from 2010-2013 that played a massive role in them winning 2 more cups.

So yeah, I'll be fine with Shero 2.0 because acting like Shero was a bad GM is asinine. Just like I'd be fine with a JR 2.0 GM.

 

[Turin]

And Ray Shero won 1 cup, got the Penguins to another cup and made draft picks from 2010-2013 that played a massive role in them winning 2 more cups.

So yeah, I'll be fine with Shero 2.0 because acting like Shero was a bad GM is asinine. Just like I'd be fine with a JR 2.0 GM.

You want a guy who has unwavering loyalty to bad coaches and bad players to manage Crosby and Malkin’s swan song? Maybe he’s changed, but if he manages the Penguins like he managed Philly- goodnight.

Shero inherited the best situation any GM has ever had outside of the 80’s Oilers. Two generational centres, Gonchar with Whitney and Letang in the pipeline and Fleury. Only Chiarelli could screw that up. I’m not saying he sucked but he certainly hasn’t inspired much confidence in anyone since 2011.

 

[EightyOne]

I'm really surprised I haven't seen my name mentioned in any of McKenzie's tweets.

@Gurglesons is the shoe-in

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Hextall and Futa or Hextall and MacFarland

 

[Empoleon8771]

You want a guy who has unwavering loyalty to bad coaches and bad players to manage Crosby and Malkin’s swan song? Maybe he’s changed, but if he manages the Penguins like he managed Philly- goodnight.

Shero inherited the best situation any GM has ever had outside of the 80’s Oilers. Two generational centres, Gonchar with Whitney and Letang in the pipeline and Fleury. Only Chiarelli could screw that up. I’m not saying he sucked but he certainly hasn’t inspired much confidence in anyone since 2011.

Hextall also managed to fix a lot of the mistakes Holmgrem made and greatly restocked the Flyers prospect pool.

I also don't see how Hextall showed "unwavering loyalty to bad coaches and bad players". How often do GMs pull the plug on coaching hires after only 2 years? Hakstol was the Flyers coach for only 3.5 seasons, which really isn't that much. When was the "appropriate" time to fire him so he wouldn't show "unwavering loyalty to bad coaches", in a way that actually lines up with how NHL teams operate? Just because fans want coaches fired for a bad 5 game stretch doesn't mean teams actually operate that way.

The mistake Hextall made was the same mistake JR made with Johnston: he hired a good juniors/college coach and thought he could translate over to the NHL. That doesn't magically mean that he "stuck with a bad coach for too long", because GMs doing what JR did to Johnston is incredibly uncommon.

 

[SEALBound]

It's really interesting that Seattle said no because of "the timeframe Pittsburgh is looking at". I wonder if that is because the Penguins are trying to fill the position ASAP, but Seattle wants to have a full crew for this entire season to be prepared for the expansion draft after the year. That would make sense to me, Seattle is willing to let Botterill go but they don't want to have to scramble to replace him when the expansion draft isn't that far away.

Either way, I'm all aboard the Hextall train.

This close to the draft, I probably would give permission either. Last thing they want to do is go find an AGM and then have them play catch up. I imagine Botts has been neck and neck with Francis on determining players, structure, coaches, etc.

Looking at the Hextall best and worst, I love what he's built in the draft and ultimately, I do like what the Flyers have put together. That said, the passing on ROR, Oshie, Kessel, and trading of Schenn for little in return has me worried. I don't think we have time to build through the draft with Sid and Geno and if Letang is the fish traded, I worry about the return. So there are red flags there. Probably not enough to keep me from being happy but still a nugget of doubt. Maybe not unlike with JR.

I'm trying to figure out what I like or don't like about MacFarland. No doubt the Avs are a solid team at the moment but what have they really done to make themselves that way roster wise other than striking big on high draft picks and MacKinnon finally realizing his potential after years in the gutter? I get a Botterill like feeling from him. Botts was a huge part of the Penguins in two Cups. Goes to Buffalo and blows chunks.

 

[OnMyOwn]

It’s MacFarland as 1 for me and Hextall as 2.

 

[vodeni]

Hextall also managed to fix a lot of the mistakes Holmgrem made and greatly restocked the Flyers prospect pool.

I also don't see how Hextall showed "unwavering loyalty to bad coaches and bad players". How often do GMs pull the plug on coaching hires after only 2 years? Hakstol was the Flyers coach for only 3.5 seasons, which really isn't that much. When was the "appropriate" time to fire him so he wouldn't show "unwavering loyalty to bad coaches", in a way that actually lines up with how NHL teams operate? Just because fans want coaches fired for a bad 5 game stretch doesn't mean teams actually operate that way.

The mistake Hextall made was the same mistake JR made with Johnston: he hired a good juniors/college coach and thought he could translate over to the NHL. That doesn't magically mean that he "stuck with a bad coach for too long", because GMs doing what JR did to Johnston is incredibly uncommon.

probably about three seasons too long for Mr. MJ 2.0

 

[Turin]

Hextall also managed to fix a lot of the mistakes Holmgrem made and greatly restocked the Flyers prospect pool.

I also don't see how Hextall showed "unwavering loyalty to bad coaches and bad players". How often do GMs pull the plug on coaching hires after only 2 years? Hakstol was the Flyers coach for only 3.5 seasons, which really isn't that much. When was the "appropriate" time to fire him so he wouldn't show "unwavering loyalty to bad coaches", in a way that actually lines up with how NHL teams operate? Just because fans want coaches fired for a bad 5 game stretch doesn't mean teams actually operate that way.

The mistake Hextall made was the same mistake JR made with Johnston: he hired a good juniors/college coach and thought he could translate over to the NHL. That doesn't magically mean that he "stuck with a bad coach for too long", because GMs doing what JR did to Johnston is incredibly uncommon.

Hakstol was the single greatest thing about the 2016-2018 stretch of bliss outside the Pens themselves. It was obvious he was a terrible coach after his first year. The Flyers were absolutely lifeless. Give him a second? Ok. Third? Guy kept Mike Johnston around for three seasons.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Hakstol was the single greatest thing about the 2016-2018 stretch of bliss outside the Pens themselves. It was obvious he was a terrible coach after his first year. The Flyers were absolutely lifeless. Give him a second? Ok. Third? Guy kept Mike Johnston around for three seasons.

That doesn't answer my question. When was the "appropriate" time to fire Hakstol that lines up with how other GMs normally operate?

JR firing Johnston after like 100 games is almost unheard of with coaches that aren't massively under .500.

 

[Turin]

That doesn't answer my question. When was the "appropriate" time to fire Hakstol that lines up with how other GMs normally operate?

JR firing Johnston after like 100 games is almost unheard of with coaches that aren't massively under .500.

Why is “average GM timetable” the standard and not “this coach is killing the team” the standard? I don’t want a GM who looks at a horrid soul sucking coach and shrugs “well, it’s not really nice to let him go. Only guys like Rutherford would do that.”

 

[Jacob]

Hakstol was a real bonehead. The second he paired Gostisbehere with Provorov and then Manning with Gudas I’d have canned him. That’s Iginla-on-his-off-side levels of incompetence.

That said Hextall’s a seemingly smart guy and hopefully learned from his entire tenure. Not like JR didn’t have a long list of gaffes on his resume when we hired him.

 

[pistolpete11]

Almost every GM is going to have some perceived flaw. Either they are inexperienced or they were fired as a GM before. There's not many GM's out there that just walk away from a job like JR did.

Of the remaining candidates, I'd pick Hextall, MacFarland, and then Futa in that order. Everyone else would be watching with clenched teeth to see what happened...kind of like it was with JR at the beginning




....except Chiarelli. That would just be bad. I'd probably give up on the Penguins if that's the case.

 

[Turin]

I will say that if Hextall wins the Cup as a Penguins GM that would be hilarious and satisfying. But everything about how he handled Philly suggests that the Cup would come after Crosby and Malkin are gone. I don’t think that’s the right play.

However, he probably would make the team less soft.