News Article: Rutherford has resigned - Part 2

[Empoleon8771]

Man that bottom pairing is hilarious. I'd pay to watch Scuderi and Gill defend nowadays. Those two made Maatta look like McDavid.

To be fair, it was a different time then

They could have organized those pairs better by having something like Whitney-Gill and Scuderi-Sydor, which has 1 puck mover on that pair, but Scuderi-Gill was still an effective pair at the time.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

To be fair, it was a different time then

They could have organized those pairs better by having something like Whitney-Gill and Scuderi-Sydor, which has 1 puck mover on that pair, but Scuderi-Gill was still an effective pair at the time.

Yeah, because Gill would just bearhug people and Scuds would play 2nd goalie--which wasn't always an effective strategy.

 

[Andy99]

I know you all were waiting patiently to hear from TIOPS...here’s what he has to say courtesy of another poster...

--Pointed out all the players with 5v5 goals, and noting that 87/71 combine for ZERO 5v5 goals, which is obviously an issue.

--Says that the "rising star" assistant GMs are staying away from the Penguins job. Believed Penguins were very interested in Drury, Mellanby, and MacFarland (in that order). First two pulled out, and TIOPS claims that MacFarland reportedly doesn't see the Penguins job as a great job, and it is possible he eventually pulls his name as well.

--TIOPS says Morehouse interviewed Kevin Weekes Wednesday. Says Weekes is known as a very strong interviewer, but many view this as a tough position for Weekes with no managerial experience.

--TIOPS says a rumor is out there that Eddie Olczyk has privately put in a request to be considered for a front office role with the team. Says Olczyk was close to getting a Hockey Ops role with NJ

--Says permission to interview Botteril was officially given Tuesday, however, Botteril has not really shown interest in the Penguins job to this point. Says that may change, but not known at this point.

--TIOPS also says a new name that is flying around the rumor mill is former Penguin Norm Maciver. Says he has been discussed internally and team is deciding whether they will grant him an interview. Says he interviewed for the job with Penguins in 2014, and spent 8 seasons as Asst GM in Chicago.

I also see something from Tuesday on TIOPS that claims there are the "tiers" of Penguins interest (and this was before some pulled out)

Tier1: Drury, Hextall, Gillis, Chiarelli
Tier2: Ferguson Jr, Gilman, Futa
Long shots: Weekes, Allvin

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Bob Errey for GM.

I’m all in on this.

 

[Ryder71]

I know you all were waiting patiently to hear from TIOPS...here’s what he has to say courtesy of another poster...

--Pointed out all the players with 5v5 goals, and noting that 87/71 combine for ZERO 5v5 goals, which is obviously an issue.

--Says that the "rising star" assistant GMs are staying away from the Penguins job. Believed Penguins were very interested in Drury, Mellanby, and MacFarland (in that order). First two pulled out, and TIOPS claims that MacFarland reportedly doesn't see the Penguins job as a great job, and it is possible he eventually pulls his name as well.

--TIOPS says Morehouse interviewed Kevin Weekes Wednesday. Says Weekes is known as a very strong interviewer, but many view this as a tough position for Weekes with no managerial experience.

--TIOPS says a rumor is out there that Eddie Olczyk has privately put in a request to be considered for a front office role with the team. Says Olczyk was close to getting a Hockey Ops role with NJ

--Says permission to interview Botteril was officially given Tuesday, however, Botteril has not really shown interest in the Penguins job to this point. Says that may change, but not known at this point.

--TIOPS also says a new name that is flying around the rumor mill is former Penguin Norm Maciver. Says he has been discussed internally and team is deciding whether they will grant him an interview. Says he interviewed for the job with Penguins in 2014, and spent 8 seasons as Asst GM in Chicago.

I also see something from Tuesday on TIOPS that claims there are the "tiers" of Penguins interest (and this was before some pulled out)

Tier1: Drury, Hextall, Gillis, Chiarelli
Tier2: Ferguson Jr, Gilman, Futa
Long shots: Weekes, Allvin

MacFarland then Hextall then Gillis and Futa. I'd be good with any of them. I don't like the other names I'm seeing. Any other names and I might start turning over furniture in a fit of rage!









Well, not really, after all it's my furniture. Maybe if I visit a friend.

 

[OswaldBates]

I know you all were waiting patiently to hear from TIOPS...here’s what he has to say courtesy of another poster...

--Pointed out all the players with 5v5 goals, and noting that 87/71 combine for ZERO 5v5 goals, which is obviously an issue.

--Says that the "rising star" assistant GMs are staying away from the Penguins job. Believed Penguins were very interested in Drury, Mellanby, and MacFarland (in that order). First two pulled out, and TIOPS claims that MacFarland reportedly doesn't see the Penguins job as a great job, and it is possible he eventually pulls his name as well.

--TIOPS says Morehouse interviewed Kevin Weekes Wednesday. Says Weekes is known as a very strong interviewer, but many view this as a tough position for Weekes with no managerial experience.

--TIOPS says a rumor is out there that Eddie Olczyk has privately put in a request to be considered for a front office role with the team. Says Olczyk was close to getting a Hockey Ops role with NJ

--Says permission to interview Botteril was officially given Tuesday, however, Botteril has not really shown interest in the Penguins job to this point. Says that may change, but not known at this point.

--TIOPS also says a new name that is flying around the rumor mill is former Penguin Norm Maciver. Says he has been discussed internally and team is deciding whether they will grant him an interview. Says he interviewed for the job with Penguins in 2014, and spent 8 seasons as Asst GM in Chicago.

I also see something from Tuesday on TIOPS that claims there are the "tiers" of Penguins interest (and this was before some pulled out)

Tier1: Drury, Hextall, Gillis, Chiarelli
Tier2: Ferguson Jr, Gilman, Futa
Long shots: Weekes, Allvin

OLD BILLY might want to read Bob MacKenzie, Settle refused to let Botteril interview ! he makes Dwayne Keith Klessel look smart

 

[Empoleon8771]

--Says permission to interview Botteril was officially given Tuesday, however, Botteril has not really shown interest in the Penguins job to this point. Says that may change, but not known at this point.

Well we know TIOPS is lying here, because McKenzie flat out said that Seattle didn't allow the Penguins to interview Botterill.

 

[Andy99]

There’s another rumor going around that Mario and Burkle want to sell the team again in the near future and that may be hampering potentially interested candidates. If true, maybe a reason for JR’s departure?

 

[Borgir]

Chiarelli LOL

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Chiarelli LOL

I thought that was Olli Jokinen.

Olli for President.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'm still expecting Tallon to be JR's replacement, because it would be really weird to try and bring on Tallon as an advisor last year only to not give him a GM role that opened up like 10 games into the next season.

Not sure how I'd feel about Tallon tbh. I definitely feel that's more in the JR mold, but I'd be tempted to get more of a "long term GM" option than him. Tallon is just as old as JR is, so he'd be another short term hire.

 

[EightyOne]

Man that bottom pairing is hilarious. I'd pay to watch Scuderi and Gill defend nowadays. Those two made Maatta look like McDavid.

Gil could poke check to center ice from the goal line though lol

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

I wonder if these younger up and coming candid are not as attracted to it as initially assumed bc of where we are in our franchise life cycle.

Are they thinking that they’d probably go down with the 87/71 ship?

 

[SEALBound]

Yeah, because Gill would just bearhug people and Scuds would play 2nd goalie--which wasn't always an effective strategy.

You have to give credit where credit is due. Although Scuds left on extremely unfavorable terms in 2015, that doesn't diminish the role he played in 2009. He was tasked with going up against a lot of strong competition, including Ovechkin's line. Obviously worked out well for us. Gill couldn't make that first pass to save his life though.

There’s another rumor going around that Mario and Burkle want to sell the team again in the near future and that may be hampering potentially interested candidates. If true, maybe a reason for JR’s departure?

I mean, they've been rumored to wanting to sell it for awhile now with the overall value being so high with Sid and Geno. They know org value is gonna tank when one or both retire. Buy low, sell high. Odd concept for some I know but at the end of the day, Burkle is a businessman.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Odd concept for some I know but at the end of the day, Burkle is a businessman.

Eh. Guy has cash Pens or not though, he’s not like Snyder or the Rooney’s.

Professional sports team is exclusive. There’s only so many of them. Billionaires club. It is absolutely a business but it’s also a status type thing to own.

Not saying he wouldn’t sell, but I don’t think it’s as simple as “buy low, sell high” in this case.

 

[Pens x]

Here was the Penguins roster at the end of the 2005-2006 season:

Malone-Crosby-Armstrong
LeClair-Hillbert-Recchi
Surovy-Christensen-Ouellett
Koltsov-Talbot-Boguniecki

Orpik-Gonchar
Scuderi-Whitney
Melichar-Welsch

Fleury-Caron

This was their lineup at the end of the 2007-2008 season:

Dupuis-Crosby-Hossa
Malone-Malkin-Sykora
Talbot-Staal-Kennedy
Roberts-Hall-Ruuttu

Orpik-Gonchar
Whitney-Sydor
Scuderi-Gill

Fleury-Conklin

So yeah, sorry if I don't buy the "Ray Shero did nothing" claim.

Where do I even begin????

Patrick drafted Malkin, so why is Shero getting credit for that? It’s also odd you picked that one random season, a season where we had Hossa for a couple of months. He also didn’t draft Malone, and Staal was the #2 overall pick, so not really that impressive.

You act like Hillbert and Christiansen were turned into Malkin and Staal.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

I know you all were waiting patiently to hear from TIOPS...here’s what he has to say courtesy of another poster...

--Pointed out all the players with 5v5 goals, and noting that 87/71 combine for ZERO 5v5 goals, which is obviously an issue.

--Says that the "rising star" assistant GMs are staying away from the Penguins job. Believed Penguins were very interested in Drury, Mellanby, and MacFarland (in that order). First two pulled out, and TIOPS claims that MacFarland reportedly doesn't see the Penguins job as a great job, and it is possible he eventually pulls his name as well.

--TIOPS says Morehouse interviewed Kevin Weekes Wednesday. Says Weekes is known as a very strong interviewer, but many view this as a tough position for Weekes with no managerial experience.

--TIOPS says a rumor is out there that Eddie Olczyk has privately put in a request to be considered for a front office role with the team. Says Olczyk was close to getting a Hockey Ops role with NJ

--Says permission to interview Botteril was officially given Tuesday, however, Botteril has not really shown interest in the Penguins job to this point. Says that may change, but not known at this point.

--TIOPS also says a new name that is flying around the rumor mill is former Penguin Norm Maciver. Says he has been discussed internally and team is deciding whether they will grant him an interview. Says he interviewed for the job with Penguins in 2014, and spent 8 seasons as Asst GM in Chicago.

I also see something from Tuesday on TIOPS that claims there are the "tiers" of Penguins interest (and this was before some pulled out)

Tier1: Drury, Hextall, Gillis, Chiarelli
Tier2: Ferguson Jr, Gilman, Futa
Long shots: Weekes, Allvin

I really hope we stay away from Chiarelli and Gillis!!

 

[Jacob]

Gillis doesn’t pass my eye test. Has a nervous energy about him and seems to bristle at the media when under even the tiniest scrutiny.

Always red and perspiring like he’s mid-heart attack.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

There’s another rumor going around that Mario and Burkle want to sell the team again in the near future and that may be hampering potentially interested candidates. If true, maybe a reason for JR’s departure?

Could be but I doubt it, wasn't GMJR out of a contract after next season? I would think he would have complete his mandate and not leave that money on the table like he did.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Shero should be given his due for modernizing the team, implementing things like "real depth lines" and quickly building a workable team concept around their young stars. He also ended up employing a scouting team that drafted some important guys years down the line. So hey that counts for something, too.

That's it, though. That's the list. I have no idea why anyone would pine for the guy or try to paint him in a more positive light beyond those very real and very appreciated things. He quickly lost the plot and/or got attached to concepts he should not have. And one very dumb coach.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Shero should be given his due for modernizing the team, implementing things like "real depth lines" and quickly building a workable team concept around their young stars. He also ended up employing a scouting team that drafted some important guys years down the line. So hey that counts for something, too.

That's it, though. That's the list. I have no idea why anyone would pine for the guy or try to paint him in a more positive light beyond those very real and very appreciated things. He quickly lost the plot and/or got attached to concepts he should not have. And one very dumb coach.

I mean that plus 2 cup appearances is a pretty damn extensive list, though.

The only serious "flaw" Shero had as GM was that he stuck with Bylsma for way too long, that's really it. Sure, there were things that weren't ideal (like the entire feedback loop of trading picks for rentals because you don't have young players), but pretty much every single GM has those things that aren't idea.

 

[Tom Hanks]

I wonder if these younger up and coming candid are not as attracted to it as initially assumed bc of where we are in our franchise life cycle.

Are they thinking that they’d probably go down with the 87/71 ship?

It’s a fair point because if they don’t do well but more so of our situation than how they GM it sets them back a bit. They might prefer a team they can build up.

On the flip side if they do well there will always be jobs for them.

I’m happy for younger guys to bow out if they don’t think it’s the right fit. There’s a lot of pressure on who comes in because ownership will won’t one last crack at the cup before a rebuild.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Beyond Bylsma, the only really big complaint I had with Shero is how often he targeted short term options with using picks, plus he didn't trade 1st rounders for win-now talent as much as I would have liked. That's not something JR did at all, he'd trade for guys and figure out how the money worked down the line. Look at a trade tracker for the Penguins with Shero vs the Penguins with JR, you constantly see JR trading picks for players with term while Shero seemingly only traded picks for rentals. I think that could partially be justified due to the cap then (Crosby and Malkin made way more then than they did with JR, relative to the ceiling), but that's still not a good thing.

If you keep trading 2nd and 3rd round picks for deadline fixes like Stempniak, Goc, Ponikarovsky and Leopold, you're never going to fix those issues in the long run. That's not what JR did, JR would sooner pay more to get guys with term over trading assets for rentals. I would have rather traded a 1st and a prospect for 2009's version of Kapanen over having to go through a rotating cast of guys like Ponikarovsky, Satan, Sullivan and such just because it's cheaper to do that.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I mean that plus 2 cup appearances is a pretty damn extensive list, though.

The only serious "flaw" Shero had as GM was that he stuck with Bylsma for way too long, that's really it. Sure, there were things that weren't ideal (like the entire feedback loop of trading picks for rentals because you don't have young players), but pretty much every single GM has those things that aren't idea.

Nah I hated his entire philosophy roughly post-Hossa-signing-failure. I'm not saying he was equivalent to his pet coach in stupidity... Shero strikes me as actually quite smart and very plugged into the finer details of the game. But I think he had a completely backwards vision for this core, for whatever reason and it showed.

Frankly he hasn't done much since he left to convince me I'm wrong.

 

[BrookswasHere44]

I don't want to derail this with Pierre memes nor am I advocating for him but is it at all odd that not even a whisper of him? Wasn't he in the running before JR got the gig?

He kinda seems to be at least passively mentioned in openings?