Speculation: Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2019-20 - "Ross the Boss" Edition

[leeroggy]

Especially since it puts Minny at 50 contracts.

They have 13 of those current pre-trade contracts expiring after this year according to Capfriendly.

 

[crasherino]

NHL DRAFT 2020:
Best draft in ages, and that although we've had some real good ones in recent years.

The amount of high-end prospects is nothing less than astounding.

You do not move the 2020 1st and 2nd rounders!

They're now officially off the board for any and all trade suggestions we make throughout this winter.

That's the impression I was under (mostly from hearing it from folks like yourself) and then I read this from Pronman and became thoroughly confused:

My early impressions of this class are that it’s a roughly average draft class. It’s forward heavy, and while there are some very good centers, there is a lack of truly premier center talent, despite it being so forward heavy.

Pronman: 2020 NHL Draft -- Ranking the top prospects

He has Lafreniere as "Special NHL Prospect" has Byfield on the Special bubble and then has Holtz and Raymond as "Elite Prospects".

His "average" assessment doesn't seem to jive with anything else I've read about this class but I don't really have any first hand knowledge here.

 

[leeroggy]

That's the impression I was under (mostly from hearing it from folks like yourself) and then I read this from Pronman and became thoroughly confused:


Pronman: 2020 NHL Draft -- Ranking the top prospects

He has Lafreniere as "Special NHL Prospect" has Byfield on the Special bubble and then has Holtz and Raymond as "Elite Prospects".

His "average" assessment doesn't seem to jive with anything else I've read about this class but I don't really have any first hand knowledge here.

HF posters tend to buy into the first assessment too much and resist outside opinion. We'll get better insight when the WJC is held as well as the other youth events. Anyone of us who claims any great first hand knowledge of this class is kidding themselves. While a few posters do see many games and events with 2020-eligible draftees the vast majority of us, including me, just regurgitate what we read online from sources we got comfortable going back to over and over.

 

[leeroggy]

A little reality check on Boychuck, from yesterday's Staple article in The Athletic:

Noah Dobson sat for a second-straight game on Monday, meaning the 19-year-old has played two of six so far.

And despite Boychuk’s standout moments, he’s struggled to contain opponents at five-on-five. His on-ice shot attempt share is 39.4 percent, sixth-worst in the league for players with more than 80 5v5 minutes (courtesy Natural Stat Trick); in actual shots on goal, his on-ice share is 35.9 percent, worst in the league.

It will be a tough decision going forward, especially because there is something to the intangibles discussion. It’s easy to see where Trotz, who has a good feel for his dressing room, would be reluctant to scratch both Martin and Boychuk on the same night, given that those are two of the veterans best at keeping the team loose before and during games.

But Dobson needs to play, and Boychuk is the one struggling the most.

***

I appreciate his efforts as much as anyone but I've pointed out repeatedly that he's a major liability when he has the puck in the defense zone. One reason he tries to block so many shots is because he's no longer able to easily cut down space and compensates by trying to block the shot, hence the injury issue. If the stat is tracked I'd bet he's responsible for a third of all the icings we give up because of the puck handling issue.

 

[boredmale]

A little reality check on Boychuck, from yesterday's Staple article in The Athletic:

Noah Dobson sat for a second-straight game on Monday, meaning the 19-year-old has played two of six so far.

And despite Boychuk’s standout moments, he’s struggled to contain opponents at five-on-five. His on-ice shot attempt share is 39.4 percent, sixth-worst in the league for players with more than 80 5v5 minutes (courtesy Natural Stat Trick); in actual shots on goal, his on-ice share is 35.9 percent, worst in the league.

It will be a tough decision going forward, especially because there is something to the intangibles discussion. It’s easy to see where Trotz, who has a good feel for his dressing room, would be reluctant to scratch both Martin and Boychuk on the same night, given that those are two of the veterans best at keeping the team loose before and during games.

But Dobson needs to play, and Boychuk is the one struggling the most.

***

I appreciate his efforts as much as anyone but I've pointed out repeatedly that he's a major liability when he has the puck in the defense zone. One reason he tries to block so many shots is because he's no longer able to easily cut down space and compensates by trying to block the shot, hence the injury issue. If the stat is tracked I'd bet he's responsible for a third of all the icings we give up because of the puck handling issue.

Coincidence or not, our 2 worst games this season Boychuk was out of the lineup. Last playoffs the Team hit a wall when Boychuk was injured.

 

[boredmale]

I fully understand the rumour is coming from EK so take it with a grain of salt, but Jamie Benn. Big LW that is 30, has 5 years left (I believe) on his contract at a 9.5m cap hit. Has lead the league in scoring, seems to be in the dog house in Dallas...curious what folks on here think. I personally think it would be great and would be very quick to offer a package of:
1st round pck
Anthony B
Bode Wilde / Bellows
throw in a medium salary dump that can help them as trading Benn would give the team about 14 m in cap space.

IF we are picking up Benn, Ladd has to go back to offset some salary

 

[Shot of Bailey]

IF we are picking up Benn, Ladd has to go back to offset some salary

I agree, perfect contract to send back.

 

[leeroggy]

Coincidence or not, our 2 worst games this season Boychuk was out of the lineup. Last playoffs the Team hit a wall when Boychuk was injured.

No, we hit the wall because we played a better version of us. As they are showing again this year with their 6-2 start to the year.

 

[Lame Lambert]

Fit matters, so it's possible the lines you're suggesting make more sense. I just don't think that second line has enough oomph on it for when the going gets tough. I'm by no means suggesting Lee needs to stay where he is and his spot can't be improved upon. I don't like the idea of forcing players into certain spot.

I don’t like forcing players into spots either, but I also don’t like Lee with Barzal or Brassard. Nelson is locked into the 2C spot, so we really don’t have a lot of options for the 2nd line.

 

[xIsle]

NHL DRAFT 2020:
Best draft in ages, and that although we've had some real good ones in recent years.

The amount of high-end prospects is nothing less than astounding.

You do not move the 2020 1st and 2nd rounders!

They're now officially off the board for any and all trade suggestions we make throughout this winter.

Better than 2015? It's really hard to believe!

 

[Duanesutter12]

A little reality check on Boychuck, from yesterday's Staple article in The Athletic:

Noah Dobson sat for a second-straight game on Monday, meaning the 19-year-old has played two of six so far.

And despite Boychuk’s standout moments, he’s struggled to contain opponents at five-on-five. His on-ice shot attempt share is 39.4 percent, sixth-worst in the league for players with more than 80 5v5 minutes (courtesy Natural Stat Trick); in actual shots on goal, his on-ice share is 35.9 percent, worst in the league.

It will be a tough decision going forward, especially because there is something to the intangibles discussion. It’s easy to see where Trotz, who has a good feel for his dressing room, would be reluctant to scratch both Martin and Boychuk on the same night, given that those are two of the veterans best at keeping the team loose before and during games.

But Dobson needs to play, and Boychuk is the one struggling the most.

***

I appreciate his efforts as much as anyone but I've pointed out repeatedly that he's a major liability when he has the puck in the defense zone. One reason he tries to block so many shots is because he's no longer able to easily cut down space and compensates by trying to block the shot, hence the injury issue. If the stat is tracked I'd bet he's responsible for a third of all the icings we give up because of the puck handling issue.

I disagree on just about everything other than Boychuck handling the puck. He is visibly slower and he is a liability with the puck but man does he make HUGE plays! The other night in the Blues game that diving swipe at he puck to keep it inside the blue line led to Barzal's tying goal. That's just a winner's instinct and I don't think any other defenseman we have brings that kind of wily play. I think he's fine the way it is now where he's not playing every game and this should keep him relatively fresh as the season wears on.

 

[MJF]

I disagree on just about everything other than Boychuck handling the puck. He is visibly slower and he is a liability with the puck but man does he make HUGE plays! The other night in the Blues game that diving swipe at he puck to keep it inside the blue line led to Barzal's tying goal. That's just a winner's instinct and I don't think any other defenseman we have brings that kind of wily play. I think he's fine the way it is now where he's not playing every game and this should keep him relatively fresh as the season wears on.

The bottom line with Boychuk is he’s not going to dress every night, nor should he. I don’t want him to get run down over the course of a season. So it will be a matter of playing Dobson or Thomas Hickey in his place. So I’m all for Dobson getting his feet wet in Trotz’s defense-first system. Hickey should stay where he is right now.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

They have to take back come salary, Brassard comes off their books and Clutterbuck pays for Zucker's money. That's the tradeoff. If they want a lot of futures (Wilde is junk?)

Wilde is fine, but he's not a needle mover.

they take back something to make the money work. A 1-6 team, last in the West, and nowhere's near like a Blues team that turned it around, has to show some flexibility. Next year, they are on the hook for $25 million for their Top 4 defensemen! Add Parise and it's about $33 million for those 5 and a team that might well be picking Top 5 next draft.

Rationalizing.

 

[leeroggy]

Wilde is fine, but he's not a needle mover.



Rationalizing.

Rationalizing WHAT? The trade? Come on. Those are all facts plus one projection. Right now Minny stinks. Why else does a team look at changing things up. Winning teams make few changes.

 

[BelovedIsles]

Serious Question for posters here-
Do folks feel the Isles are a top 3 F away from contending?

For example, let's say Panarin did sign would you feel the team was ready?

OR say

If Isles were to acquire Taylor Hall towards the deadline, would you feel the team was ready?

My guess would be the DEvils would get a similar package to what Columbus got for Blue Jackets -

#1 pick, Abramov, and Davidsson

Isles for Hall -
#1 pick, Bellows, and Salo?

or do you do Leddy and #1?

Adding a top line talent moves the needle enough where I think this team goes from a bubble team to a true playoff contender that is a lock and can win a round or three. Assuming the goaltending holds up.

But I’d be content w adding a 25-30 goal scorer, one more weapon. They move from a bubble team to a playoff team imho.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

Rationalizing WHAT?

Right now Minny stinks. Why else does a team look at changing things up. Winning teams make few changes.

Rationalizing this. That they should just give away nice things for a bunch of stuff because they need to "change things up". If the Isles got off to a 2-5 start, would trading Leddy for 4th liners, middling prospects and a 1st be ok?

 

[leeroggy]

Make up your mind. Either I'm giving up TOO MUCH, which some posters are arguing here, or not enough, like you are.

When has a losing team looking to shake it up EVER gotten fair, full value? 2020 1st, 2021 2nd and Wilde are not crap pieces. 2 salary eveners that are not going to be there. A solid goalie prospect that Minny certainly could use and a still young winger to develop.

Would you prefer putting Beau in for Dal Colle/Bellows? Will that be enough for the Minny GM to pull the trigger? How about Sorokin?

If you don't agree with the offer that's fine, just say so and save us some time.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

If you don't agree with the offer that's fine, just say so and save us some time.

I did. You're the one belaboring it since you seem to have taken offense. That wasn't my intention. Just sharing why I don't agree with your made up trade for made up reasons.

 

[GrandmaSlices51631]

I agree, perfect contract to send back.

But why would Dallas take back Ladd for Benn? Benn's fraction of his former self still has the potential to be Ladd at the peak of his career.

If it's because Ladd can be placed on LTIR, why don't we just do that and avoid paying a grizzled guy whose body is busted up a major chunk of change?

Give the big bucks to the kids who have yet to reach their peaks!

 

[BrockLobster]

Adding a top line talent moves the needle enough where I think this team goes from a bubble team to a true playoff contender that is a lock and can win a round or three. Assuming the goaltending holds up.

But I’d be content w adding a 25-30 goal scorer, one more weapon. They move from a bubble team to a playoff team imho.

Teams with the 5th best record in hockey arent bubble teams...

 

[BrockLobster]

Coincidence or not, our 2 worst games this season Boychuk was out of the lineup. Last playoffs the Team hit a wall when Boychuk was injured.

100% agree. The team is much better with JB back there. I dont care what any analytics say.

 

[Bronson]

What I'm trying to say is: get a damn goalscorer whatever the cost.

 

[BelovedIsles]

Teams with the 5th best record in hockey arent bubble teams...

They are this year, they overachieved last year. As constructed, yeah, they are a bubble team.

 

[BrockLobster]

They are this year, they overachieved last year. As constructed, yeah, they are a bubble team.

Ok....sigh

 

[BelovedIsles]

What I'm trying to say is: get a damn goalscorer whatever the cost.

Watched the Avs-Cats tonight. Would love to have one of their wingers.