Rumor: Rumors and Proposals Thread | Reseason Training Camp Opens July 13th?

[smokersarejokers]

There are a ton of posters here that literally evaluate players like this:

Is he currently an Oiler?
If NO: He was a cancer. He is not welcome here.
If YES :
Is he the current goat? : If Yes -> TRADE HIM
If No -> He is infallible.

No other evidence need be considered.

This perfectly sums up my discussions with friends and family as well.

99% of Oilers fans I know NEED some kind of whipping boy and I've never understood it and I never will.

Right now, Matt Benning and 9 game old Andreas Athanasiou seem to be taking a lot of heat with honorable mention going to Kris Russell.

 

[Captain Controversy]

This perfectly sums up my discussions with friends and family as well.

99% of Oilers fans I know NEED some kind of whipping boy and I've never understood it and I never will.

Right now, Matt Benning and 9 game old Andreas Athanasiou seem to be taking a lot of heat with honorable mention going to Kris Russell.

My last whipping boy was Eberle I think. He was useless in the playoffs.

 

[FlameChampion]

I'm confused are we not evaluating after the 9 games or these 9 games too precious that we cant afford to waste?

If people criticized the trade at the time, I'm fine with that. Those people are entitled to their opinion and dont have to be a fan of the player. If they think two late second rounders are some kings random, I would disagree. You are going to get a player with some warts for that cost.

My beef is with those writing him off after just 9 games. We can be patient. He isnt a UFA. Let's believe in the kid and support him so that he reaches his potential.

I agree. I think we need to give AA more time.

The media was also meddling with his psyche before he had even played a game here or 1 game. "I hear you like to hold onto the puck, well on this team, you're going to have to give McDavid the puck if you expect to play with him". Guy probably had lost his confidence in Detroit after their trainwreck of a year and now second guesses his play here and trying to fit in with the team. I hope he has a decent playoffs.

 

[CycloneSweep]

Bouchard at 12. Broberg doesn't make the list.

#2 and #3 were both on the board when we picked last draft.

 

[smokersarejokers]

My last whipping boy was Eberle I think. He was useless in the playoffs.

Yes, that was the guy in 2017.

Because of course the guy who had 50 points that season and 60 the following season was the major problem.

 

[McShogun99]

My last whipping boy was Eberle I think. He was useless in the playoffs.

Then he was really good in his second playoff appearance with NYI.

 

[McShogun99]

Bouchard at 12. Broberg doesn't make the list.

#2 and #3 were both on the board when we picked last draft.

I wanted Caufield but it didn't make sense for us to draft him where we were at. It also didn't make sense to draft Broberg where we were at. Zegras was probably who we should have picked but I see him as a worse version of RNH.

 

[North]

Bouchard at 12. Broberg doesn't make the list.

#2 and #3 were both on the board when we picked last draft.

These lists mean nothing.

 

[CycloneSweep]

These lists mean nothing.

They are less nothing than our opinions.

 

[belair]

Bouchard at 12. Broberg doesn't make the list.

#2 and #3 were both on the board when we picked last draft.

I've never been a fan of these lists. They take a ton of work to put together, admittedly. But there are far too many discrepancies when you put that many players together and rank them based on numerous intangible factors.

Cozens at 1 is easily argued. Then there are 49 others.

 

[Smartguy]

This perfectly sums up my discussions with friends and family as well.

99% of Oilers fans I know NEED some kind of whipping boy and I've never understood it and I never will.

Right now, Matt Benning and 9 game old Andreas Athanasiou seem to be taking a lot of heat with honorable mention going to Kris Russell.

I don’t get it either, I think Facebook comments are the worst for this, even it’s in this board and on reddit.

The most I don’t get is the AA hate, for 1, we gave up 2 seconds for him, the odds that either of those players play half the games AA will end up playing here is like sub 30%, secondly he’s been here for 9 games, in which he sustained an injury in the second game. We need more skill in our bottom 6, not less, I don’t understand why people are using him as a whipping boy already and wanting him shipped out this summer. Id bet we see a much better player in the play in games after he gets a training camp to not only meet Edmontons guys, but learn to play with them.

He has yet another year of RFA protection to top off all that, we are one of the few teams not going to get burned giving up assets for a rental in a lost season.

We have had a D as a whipping boy here forever, Benning gets hammered though for being what he is, a serviceable number 6.

 

[FlameChampion]

Bouchard at 12. Broberg doesn't make the list.

#2 and #3 were both on the board when we picked last draft.

I dont put a ton of stock in this article. I have a few things from Wheeler and I dont agree with lots of it. He just seems to like the players he likes and is a bit oblivious to the rest. I feel like he manipulates these types of lists to make his draft rankings look better or something.

Putting together an article like this where you have players from all kinds of different ages playing all over the world at different levels is impossible though.

 

[Smartguy]

I dont put a ton of stock in this article. I have a few things from Wheeler and I dont agree with lots of it. He just seems to like the players he likes and is a bit oblivious to the rest. I feel like he manipulates these types of lists to make his draft rankings look better or something.

Putting together an article like this where you have players from all kinds of different ages playing all over the world at different levels is impossible though.

Yeah it’s good reading some of it, especially now when your starved for hockey news. If you’ve followed his past work many of the players he once loved who have struggled are on there and fairly high. Vilardi and Walhstron for starters.

The one thing I do like about Wheeler is he will circle back and talk about how wrong he’s been, not many guys have the ability to do that.

 

[CycloneSweep]

Yeah it’s good reading some of it, especially now when your starved for hockey news. If you’ve followed his past work many of the players he once loved who have struggled are on there and fairly high. Vilardi and Walhstron for starters.

The one thing I do like about Wheeler is he will circle back and talk about how wrong he’s been, not many guys have the ability to do that.

People like to shit on him for being "wrong" and not having their favorite prospects higher. Everyone seems to dislike his lists which imo makes them good lol.

The reality always is though that no matter how "good" a list is, you will always be wrong in retrospect.

 

[McDNicks17]

Yeah it’s good reading some of it, especially now when your starved for hockey news. If you’ve followed his past work many of the players he once loved who have struggled are on there and fairly high. Vilardi and Walhstron for starters.

The one thing I do like about Wheeler is he will circle back and talk about how wrong he’s been, not many guys have the ability to do that.

Watch out for Vilardi next season.

He basically missed all of '18-'19 because of a serious back injury and then came back and lit it up this year.

Wouldn't be surprised if he's in the conversation for the Calder next year.

 

[Smartguy]

Watch out for Vilardi next season.

He basically missed all of '18-'19 because of a serious back injury and then came back and lit it up this year.

Wouldn't be surprised if he's in the conversation for the Calder next year.

Agreed, I’ve always liked him too, I put a proposal on this board last offseason that we should have tried to use Pulju and bought low on him last year, considering no one knew how he would come back from those injuries. If he stays healthy, the Kings land one of Byfield/Stutzle, on top of already having Turcotte coming up soon, they are going to be a top team in our division in a few short years. Doughty and Kopitar might get one last shot at it

 

[OiledUp]

People like to shit on him for being "wrong" and not having their favorite prospects higher. Everyone seems to dislike his lists which imo makes them good lol.

The reality always is though that no matter how "good" a list is, you will always be wrong in retrospect.

Has anyone ever bothered to actually review these guys making prospect lists, both pre and post draft lists, to see who has the best track record and who is just talking out of their respective rear ends.
It would be interesting to see if a guy like Wheeler is worth listening to. He has Cozens at the top for example who I personally have found a bit simplistic in his skillset to become a high end NHL player, NHLer sure, best prospect in hockey hmmm. But if Wheeler is actually good at this stuff maybe I should take another closer look to see what I'm missing, it’s not like I'm some kind of prospect savant so I could very well wrong. But if Wheeler is just a hack I don’t want to waste my time. So who is the best talent evaluator in media? I need to know goddamnit!

 

[The Nuge]

These lists mean nothing.

considering Drai was below Bennett after the draft and even the following year in nearly all of those rankings you see, I definitely take them with a grain of salt

 

[CycloneSweep]

considering Drai was below Bennett after the draft and even the following year in nearly all of those rankings you see, I definitely take them with a grain of salt

Because things can change. Kucherov was below a ton of people in his draft year, teams own rankings were totally off base in the end.

That's the thing about these lists they are all predictions and current placement. Things always change and no list looks good in retrospect. That doesn't make the list or rankings bad.

 

[OiledUp]

Because things can change. Kucherov was below a ton of people in his draft year, teams own rankings were totally off base in the end.

That's the thing about these lists they are all predictions and current placement. Things always change and no list looks good in retrospect. That doesn't make the list or rankings bad.

I get that it's not an easy thing to do predicting player development and how well someone's skillset translates, you will look silly regarding some players in hindsight. But if the predictions are constantly way off what's the point in actually reading them, these writers are pretty much selling them as expert opinions, if they are slightly better than flipping a coin why bother? I read online scouts to get an idea on how different prospects fare since I don’t have near the time to see them all and to get a different pov on the guys I have seen play. Would be nice to know if they are at least somewhat educated in their guesses.

 

[Faelko]

So games start Aug 1st, my holidays start Aug 1st...my liver hates me already...

3 weeks of nothing but NHL, BBQ and booze on the deck.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

They are less nothing than our opinions.

No, they hold the same weight as our opinions.

 

[LTIR]

considering Drai was below Bennett after the draft and even the following year in nearly all of those rankings you see, I definitely take them with a grain of salt

The lists provide a general idea of a prospect's abilities.
There are no guarantees that Lafreniere will be a better NHLer than Jaromir Pytlik but most would have the same guy ranked ahead of the other.

These lists are more than a grain of salt. The people who picked Bennett and Puljujarvi ahead of Drai and Tkachuk did not go by the lists by hfboards fans but paid a lot of money to professional scouts to get their rankings.

 

[Stoneman89]

My last whipping boy was Eberle I think. He was useless in the playoffs.

And he took a well deserved whipping for that performance.

 

[McJadeddog]

Bouchard at 12. Broberg doesn't make the list.

#2 and #3 were both on the board when we picked last draft.

Many of us complained about passing on Zegras. It was dumb then, it is even harder to understand today.