Speculation: Roster Building Thread Part XIV: There ain't no gettin' off of this train we're on

[Mac n Gs]

So since the Kings only scored 3 against Vegas in 4 games, the Zucc to LA narrative is gonna go into overdrive, right?

 

[Good Intentions]

So since the Kings only scored 3 against Vegas in 4 games, the Zucc to LA narrative is gonna go into overdrive, right?

only by the NHL18 gamers.

 

[egelband]

Btw I believe a team can only retain on three players at a given time.

 

[Irishguy42]

Btw I believe a team can only retain on three players at a given time.

Correct

 

[Edge]

I feel like the whole Evander Kane scenario is us complaining about how the women we take home from the bar tend to be more trouble than their worth, and then going up to the girl with the "crazy" look in her eyes.

Yes, that first night might be pretty fun. And then the sun comes up...

 

[egelband]

Correct

Had a look. Seems Rangers with zero retained once Nash comes off the books.

Retained Salary Transactions - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I feel like the whole Evander Kane scenario is us complaining about how the women we take home from the bar tend to be more trouble than their worth, and then going up to the girl with the "crazy" look in her eyes.

Yes, that first night might be pretty fun. And then the sun comes up...

I can't believe you compared Evander Kane to my ex-wife!

 

[kovazub94]

#1 - hopefully land a top 3 pick in the draft lotto scheme.
Trade Zucc, Spooner along with one of OGara, Gilmour or Nieves. Try to unload Smith too, eating some salary.
Resign the other RFAs to reasonable deals
Let all the UFAs walk. Maybe keep a vet or two for Hartford that can move up if need be. (Sproul/Carey/Holland ?)
Maybe sign another long shot like Lindkvist, be it a college player or European
Invite Tchakev to camp.
Acquire assets.
Draft wisely, moving up or down and/or trading at given opportune times
Sign a few shorter term UFAs. Kovalchuk, j Moore and JVR perhaps if he takes a Shatty type deal.
Come to camp prepared with a new coaching staff.

Not against bringing him over, but Tkachev '95 was pretty invisible again in this play-off run. I personally thought that he'd have more of an impact from what I'd seen from him during regular season. A knock on him has been that when he doesn't have as much time/space - his performance plummets. Need to keep our expectations in check for awhile.

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

If I was Gorton, I would be heavily looking into how badly Montreal wants to get rid of Andrew Shaw's contract.

Staal + Vesey

for

Shaw + Galchenyuk

we take on ~3M in salary

Shaw although massively overpaid can still be a useful player at times, and is an agitator which we don't have. Gotta think Galchenyuk is on the block. Both in their mid 20's still.

Staal is still an ok defenseman with less years remaining on his contract than Shaw

Vesey thrown in as a sweetener, and to replace Shaw's production.

They free up some more space to make a run at Tavares

would anybody do this?

does montreal do this?

can this be massaged into a workable deal?

combine this with a Zucc for Klefbom deal, Sign Kovalchuk,

Kreider - Zib - Buch
Galchy - Hayes - Spooner
Kovalchuk - Chytil - Lias
Names/trade/FA/call-up - Shaw - Fast

Klefbom - Shattenkirk
Skjei - Smith/ADA/Pionk
FA/Rookie/Gilmour/Dahlin - Smith/ADA/Pionk

Hank
Georgiev

That team looks pretty good. D still a little weak, maybe move Namestnikov/Spooner/some later picks for D, could Sign John Moore for bottom pairing.

 

[RGY]

LAK needs to tear it down before its too late. They have no defense beyond Doughty. Martinez and Muzzin are good but not anything fantastic. Good Top 4 guys although I think Martinez’s game is plateauing. Need to move on from Brown. I would see what you can get for Kopitar and/or Carter. As a team they seemed slow.

 

[Gardner McKay]

I don’t see Kane as a target. Besides the potential character issues, most reports do not have Gorton looking at long term deals, meaning anything over three years. Kane coming to NY is bad idea for both Kane and the Rangers.

I would be extremely pissed if we signed Kane to a big deal. Forget the character issues - I don't like him as a hockey player. He is lazy. He doesn't do the small things it takes to win. He isn't good defensively. He is frustrating to watch.

Desharnais did fine and pretty much was what he was asked to be. I felt he was a bit of a scapegoat.

No problem with having him as a backup.

100% agree with everything in this post. He was a scapegoat. I would love to bring him back for another year. He can play anywhere in the lineup, he does what he is asked to do and he is just a good depth forward.

 

[Gardner McKay]

If I was Gorton, I would be heavily looking into how badly Montreal wants to get rid of Andrew Shaw's contract.

Staal + Vesey

for

Shaw + Galchenyuk

we take on ~3M in salary

Shaw although massively overpaid can still be a useful player at times, and is an agitator which we don't have. Gotta think Galchenyuk is on the block. Both in their mid 20's still.

Staal is still an ok defenseman with less years remaining on his contract than Shaw

Vesey thrown in as a sweetener, and to replace Shaw's production.

They free up some more space to make a run at Tavares

would anybody do this?

does montreal do this?

can this be massaged into a workable deal?

combine this with a Zucc for Klefbom deal, Sign Kovalchuk,

Kreider - Zib - Buch
Galchy - Hayes - Spooner
Kovalchuk - Chytil - Lias
Names/trade/FA/call-up - Shaw - Fast

Klefbom - Shattenkirk
Skjei - Smith/ADA/Pionk
FA/Rookie/Gilmour/Dahlin - Smith/ADA/Pionk

Hank
Georgiev

That team looks pretty good. D still a little weak, maybe move Namestnikov/Spooner/some later picks for D, could Sign John Moore for bottom pairing.

Montreal does not do that. It isn't terrible but... If their GM is anything like their fans (it is Bergevin after all so you really don't know) they expected Kreider (L O EFFING L) for Shaw. When I see the price tag that MB attached to Pacioretty, I could imagine him having that high of an ask for Shaw. And, if you listened to his interview from last week, it is clear that the guy has no idea what the hell he is doing. Fans usually like to believe they are smarter than the GM and in most cases they are very wrong. With regards to MB, I am confident that 99% of posters on HFboards could do a better job than him.

There is no question that the man is the worst GM in the NHL and although this phrase gets abused, it really isn't even close. It doesn't stop there. Bergevin isn't just the worst GM in the NHL. He is one of the worst GM's in NHL history. If you feel I am exaggerating, I beg of you to go listen to the interview he did. It was an embarrassment. I bleed NYR blue. I have for as long as I can remember. But if he was our GM, I would stop watching as I know there would be zero chance for success.

 

[brians1128]

Chytil is a world class talent but it's a raw talent. I'd like him, to take simple assignments and build confidence while mistakes are covered. The RW next to Kreider and Zibanejad is just about the easiest place in the league to be. Let him start there while he hones the pro game. If it goes well, he centers next year.

Andersson is very much the opposite. Already polished player who just needs time to grow into himself. I think we should develop him similar to Horvat or Couturier. Let him center a lower line and teach him defense first. I'm not saying give him the hardest assignments, but let him rack up D-zone starts and give him a sense of responsibility and importance. Don't force him to go 200 feet until his skating improves. No expectations on his production.

Totally agree, I wouldn't even be against Chytil playing another year in the A, I believe his contract would slide. Hartford should be a much better team next year, Ronning, Lindgren, Hajek, Howden, maybe this euro Lindqvist, and some others. The team needs to address the D, continue to see what they have. No sense in rushing our most talented prospect into a dumpster fire. Draft well in 2018, add a top 62 pick or 2 for next year and see where we are at.

 

[Ola]

Every now and then the topic of Eric Staal comes up. Oohh why couldn't we do more with him? Why didn't we keep him? But like watch Minny in the POs. Eric Staal is a burden for his team, way to slow to skate against better teams when the games look like they do during the POs. Sure he is clutch, but I don't think he cut it at center at the highest level. Last year he was 0+1 in 5 games in the POs and this year he has better numbers with 1+1 in 4 games. But he is just not good at all.

This year in 4 games he has a CF% of 42% which is tremendously bad for a team that has trailed as much as they have. Last year he was bottom 5 on Minny.

Thank god we didn't keep him. Slow centers just don't work well in this league right now.

 

[Savant]

I was at Evander Kane's first game in San Jose, and have followed since because that's where work HQ is.

He should never leave Joe Pavelski. Kane needed to go to a team with strong leadership. That isn't the Rangers anymore. The only thing dumber than the Rangers signing Kane, would be Kane if he wanted to walk.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

LAK needs to tear it down before its too late. They have no defense beyond Doughty. Martinez and Muzzin are good but not anything fantastic. Good Top 4 guys although I think Martinez’s game is plateauing. Need to move on from Brown. I would see what you can get for Kopitar and/or Carter. As a team they seemed slow.

In any other season Kopitar would have been an MVP candidate. They could get the moon for and they aren’t going to move him.

 

[bobbop]

The Kings have 11 players left from their Cup winning team 4 years ago. They need to break up that team. Doughty will get a huge long term contract offer to stay in LA this summer. They already have $72M committed for next season. LA scored three goals in a sweep to an expansion team.

The Ducks have so much money tied up in three aging forwards. Getzlaf,Perry and Kesler. Anaheim is basically stuck with the same team which loses every year. They can't break up the team and lose with different players.

The Caps are the same thing. Carlson is going to get a massive contract this summer. The Caps are screwed both ways. Pay him or lose him. He will get 7 years as a free agent. Crazy money. The Caps can't replace him. They gave a 31 year old TJ Oshie 8 years. Good luck to them.

Gorton made the right decision to begin the process of rebuilding. Avoid those long term contracts to players in their late twenties to mid thirties. Break it down and start fresh.

Both teams are a cautionary tale of time and money. I know the Kings didn't give Carter that contract and when healthy he is still playing at a high level but at 33, decline beckons. The one guy they need to move is Dustin Brown. I thought he was washed up but if they can find a (sucker) Eastern Conference team to take him, Id move him in a minute. At 33, this year was not a bounceback as much as an aberration.

Actually I really like LA's backend and they just added Brickley. That's not a defense you walk away from. Unless of course, you decide to move on from Doughty. They have a lot of work to do upfront though and they are a cap mess.

 

[NYR Viper]

If LA was smart, they'd move Carter and Brown this off-season along with either Muzzin or Martinez.

 

[East Coast Bias]

Every now and then the topic of Eric Staal comes up. Oohh why couldn't we do more with him? Why didn't we keep him? But like watch Minny in the POs. Eric Staal is a burden for his team, way to slow to skate against better teams when the games look like they do during the POs. Sure he is clutch, but I don't think he cut it at center at the highest level. Last year he was 0+1 in 5 games in the POs and this year he has better numbers with 1+1 in 4 games. But he is just not good at all.

This year in 4 games he has a CF% of 42% which is tremendously bad for a team that has trailed as much as they have. Last year he was bottom 5 on Minny.

Thank god we didn't keep him. Slow centers just don't work well in this league right now.

What? He scored 42 goals this year. He's got 70 goals and 71 assists over 2 season for them.

They suck but I'm not sure how you can pin that on him.

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

Montreal does not do that. It isn't terrible but... If their GM is anything like their fans (it is Bergevin after all so you really don't know) they expected Kreider (L O EFFING L) for Shaw. When I see the price tag that MB attached to Pacioretty, I could imagine him having that high of an ask for Shaw. And, if you listened to his interview from last week, it is clear that the guy has no idea what the hell he is doing. Fans usually like to believe they are smarter than the GM and in most cases they are very wrong. With regards to MB, I am confident that 99% of posters on HFboards could do a better job than him.

There is no question that the man is the worst GM in the NHL and although this phrase gets abused, it really isn't even close. It doesn't stop there. Bergevin isn't just the worst GM in the NHL. He is one of the worst GM's in NHL history. If you feel I am exaggerating, I beg of you to go listen to the interview he did. It was an embarrassment. I bleed NYR blue. I have for as long as I can remember. But if he was our GM, I would stop watching as I know there would be zero chance for success.

I figured they probably wouldn't, but in a weird way, it makes sense for them.

Shaw is worth 2M at most, and is getting paid double his worth until 2022.

They have 2 of the WORST contracts in the NHL with Price and Weber taking up 1/4 of their cap. They really can't afford to pay double what Shaw is worth, especially if they want another big contract with Tavares.

They need to get rid of Shaw while he is still a useful player


after crunching the numbers, that scenario I laid out leaves us with ~4M with no cap increase and before signing Kovalchuk.

Gotta think the cap will go up, but we can trade spooner and/or namestnikov and sign a cheaper FA or something to make the money work.

If we get lucky and land a top 3 pick, maybe they're fighting for a spot that makes another contract expendable.

Lots of options, lots of ways this can go

 

[TheTakedown]

The Kings have 11 players left from their Cup winning team 4 years ago. They need to break up that team. Doughty will get a huge long term contract offer to stay in LA this summer. They already have $72M committed for next season. LA scored three goals in a sweep to an expansion team.

The Ducks have so much money tied up in three aging forwards. Getzlaf,Perry and Kesler. Anaheim is basically stuck with the same team which loses every year. They can't break up the team and lose with different players.

The Caps are the same thing. Carlson is going to get a massive contract this summer. The Caps are screwed both ways. Pay him or lose him. He will get 7 years as a free agent. Crazy money. The Caps can't replace him. They gave a 31 year old TJ Oshie 8 years. Good luck to them.

Gorton made the right decision to begin the process of rebuilding. Avoid those long term contracts to players in their late twenties to mid thirties. Break it down and start fresh.

Rangers happened to be in a good spot to start rebuilding. Longest Contract was the goalie, who's still a top end goalie. Not much of a problem there.

All of their "top guys" had no more than 4 years on their contracts, and Stepan was moved right before his NTC hit.

Rangers had the right opportunity to redo it from the bottom up.

These other teams have to try and catch lightning in a bottle.

 

[TheTakedown]

Montreal does not do that. It isn't terrible but... If their GM is anything like their fans (it is Bergevin after all so you really don't know) they expected Kreider (L O EFFING L) for Shaw. When I see the price tag that MB attached to Pacioretty, I could imagine him having that high of an ask for Shaw. And, if you listened to his interview from last week, it is clear that the guy has no idea what the hell he is doing. Fans usually like to believe they are smarter than the GM and in most cases they are very wrong. With regards to MB, I am confident that 99% of posters on HFboards could do a better job than him.

There is no question that the man is the worst GM in the NHL and although this phrase gets abused, it really isn't even close. It doesn't stop there. Bergevin isn't just the worst GM in the NHL. He is one of the worst GM's in NHL history. If you feel I am exaggerating, I beg of you to go listen to the interview he did. It was an embarrassment. I bleed NYR blue. I have for as long as I can remember. But if he was our GM, I would stop watching as I know there would be zero chance for success.

Holy shit, i just found that interview (with questions edited out just so you hear Bergy's answers)....

What a moron.... He LEGITIMATELY THINKS that the ONLY reasons their season went to shit is a) Carey Price and b) Player's Attitudes

Then he sits there and says that "we never looked like a team"... Aren't you the GM, fool? Aren't YOU the one who is responsible for this cesspool?

Jack Todd: Marc Bergevin shows how not to take responsibility for poor performance

 

[Gardner McKay]

Holy ****, i just found that interview (with questions edited out just so you hear Bergy's answers)....

What a moron....

Jack Todd: Marc Bergevin shows how not to take responsibility for poor performance

If you can, find one with the questions. It goes from really bad to really really really really really bad.

Oh wait. That isn't even the one. Go to the OP of the thread I linked below. It is an interview with TSN 690. I do believe the OP is correct and the Habs tried to have the interview removed because it was such an embarrassment.


http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/tsn-690-interview-with-marc-bergevin.2476885/

 

[Zats Muccarello]

Every now and then the topic of Eric Staal comes up. Oohh why couldn't we do more with him? Why didn't we keep him? But like watch Minny in the POs. Eric Staal is a burden for his team, way to slow to skate against better teams when the games look like they do during the POs. Sure he is clutch, but I don't think he cut it at center at the highest level. Last year he was 0+1 in 5 games in the POs and this year he has better numbers with 1+1 in 4 games. But he is just not good at all.

This year in 4 games he has a CF% of 42% which is tremendously bad for a team that has trailed as much as they have. Last year he was bottom 5 on Minny.

Thank god we didn't keep him. Slow centers just don't work well in this league right now.

Have you seen his production over the last two seasons?

 

[Ola]

What? He scored 42 goals this year. He's got 70 goals and 71 assists over 2 season for them.

They suck but I'm not sure how you can pin that on him.

I know, but the reason for why I pin it on him is because he looks so painfully slow and Minny sucks the most when he is on the ice.

Kudos to B.B. and Eric for getting him to produce during the regular season. Eric is good when he can play that stationary game.

But a center that cannot skate + the NHL POs 2018 is not a good fit at all. Most of the time he is a zone behind the play.