Speculation: Roster Building Thread LXXXVI: Spring into action (GMJG outta hibernation?)

[The Crypto Guy]

None of those guys have proven they can handle that responsibility though. Buchnevich is a major contributor. The other guys aren’t (yet). The Rangers lose A LOT if/when they deal Buchnevich. Garland helps bridge that gap at a more affordable price tag. Assuming Kakko or Kravtsov can do that is a recipe for disaster. Garland you can bridge for around what Buchnevich is making now and you don’t really lose anything.

At a certain point you just need to accept the growing pains and let Kakko/Laf flourish or burn.

if you get Garland and then the kids flourish, which 2/3 of them likely will, then you have the same issue again we have now with Buch. If we we are trading buch we need a center piece back, not a winger.

 

[LokiDog]

They don't need to trade him right now, but they may have to trade someone with salary eventually, and I think the argument is that you can probably get more in a deal for him now than when he is 28-29.

Personally, given how Kakko and Lafreniere have been slow starters, I wouldn't be opposed to extending Buchnevich on a pretty long deal. I think NYR will be able to trade Trouba and Kreider in 3 and a half years which will open up a lot of space. Also, there's a near zero chance that Strome doesn't depart, either by trade or UFA eventually.

In 2 years time you can potentially have 3 lines with scoring wingers. Panarin, Kreider, Laf on the left, Buchnevich, Kakko, Kravtsov on the right. That's solid balance. Combine it with the top blueliner prospects we have in the pipeline and, minus center, that's a complete roster.

Who slots in at 3C behind Zibanejad and Chytil is the interesting Q going forward, and honestly I think the appropriate answer might be a Vinny Propal-esque bargain bin veteran signing. There are going to be a lot of players bought out with the flat cap, so opportunities will arise.

In two years if NYR don't make any major trades I could see the following lineup

Panarin-Chytil-Kravtsov
Kreider-Zibanejad-Kakko
Lafreniere-?-Buchnevich
4th line

Miller-Trouba
Lindgren-Fox
Robertson-Lundkvist/Schneider

You've got 8 scoring forwards on that roster, so four per PP unit. Two PP defensemen (Fox, Lundkvst/Trouba) If Robertson and the RD even turn out to be halfway decent, that has a potential to be a top 5 defense in the league.

Panarin, Kreider, Trouba, Zibby, Buch are the veteran leadership.

Then, when Trouba and Kreider's NMC's end in 2024, you move them out to make space for long term extensions for the new core, who would be ready for leadership roles. Potentially Buchnevich gets moved around then as well. Reassess where Zibanejad is into his new contract.

I'm making a lot of assumptions with this roster, but you can see how the moving parts could align for a very long competitive window (3-4 years with Kreider-Trouba-Panarin, the following 6 years with the new core.)

I see it this way as well. Kakko’s next deal shouldn’t be costly and Kravstov hasn’t been in the NHL yet. Give Buch term to keep cap down a bit and look at moving Trouba in 3 years when KK needs a third deal.

 

[Savant]

At a certain point you just need to accept the growing pains and let Kakko/Laf flourish or burn.

if you get Garland and then the kids flourish, which 2/3 of them likely will, then you have the same issue again we have now with Buch. If we we are trading buch we need a center piece back, not a winger.

When was the last trade of a winger for a center, where the team trading the winger got good value?

would like to see if any examples of that come to mind.

also I can accept the growing pains. I can’t accept putting the players in bad situations and expecting them to sink or swim.

if you run into the same problem with Garland, then guess what? You can trade him too. It’s good asset management. Rangers needs may be different when that would occur too.

 

[Fitzy]

When was the last trade of a winger for a center, where the team trading the winger got good value?

Gaborik for Brassard worked out pretty well

 

[Savant]

Gaborik for Brassard worked out pretty well

Okay so we want to go back about a decade then?

The last good winger for center trade was a about decade ago?

 

[BKGooner]

Flashbacks to the discussions at the 2019 draft

How much confidence do you have in one of Gauthier or Kravs becoming a legitimate second line forward or getting Buch at a couple of years for 6 mill or less? i have been advocating Newhook for the Rangers since his last season in BCHL, but Buch is a big pert of this team right now. I would give a big chunk of what people are looking to give up for Eichel for a Newhook leaving school this summer.

 

[Savant]

Flashbacks to the discussions at the 2019 draft

If memory serves the Rangers had a deal but the Avalanche spiked it because they loved Newhook (who I believe is also who the Rangers wanted). Hard to see Sakic reversing course on that now

 

[Fitzy]

Okay so we want to go back about a decade then?

The last good winger for center trade was a about decade ago?

I guess If I was to think outside the organization, Laine for PLD seemed somewhat fair.

 

[Savant]

I guess If I was to think outside the organization, Laine for PLD seemed somewhat fair.

CBJ got Roslovic too as a replacement center and as we know there were some very apparent off ice matters that forced that deal. Not going there because of the weirdness of that situation.

not very often two organizations have three players more or less on strike between them and try to accommodate each other

 

[duhmetreE]

Knoblauch getting at least 2 more games as Head Coach

didn't see that

 

[mike14]

Okay so we want to go back about a decade then?

The last good winger for center trade was a about decade ago?

Spooner for Strome seems to be good value.
Patches for Suzuki was generally seen as pretty good trade for both parties.
The Jets were pretty happy with Lemmy and picks for Hayes

 

[LokiDog]

Okay so we want to go back about a decade then?

The last good winger for center trade was a about decade ago?

Gaborik in a vacuum would have had way better value than Brassard. Brassard was coming off of 47 and 41 point seasons. Gaborik scored 41 goals the year before the trade. Gaborik was ~5 years older and the trade worked out well, but realistically you lose value on a winger trading for a center no matter what.

 

[Synergy27]

Buchnevich for Newhook

do you do it?

Call me crazy, but I’d want an add for Newhook at this point. And I like Newhook.

Buchnevich is a PPG player and a complete one at that. I don’t think the urgency to trade him exists either with Deangelo out of the mix.

 

[LokiDog]

I guess If I was to think outside the organization, Laine for PLD seemed somewhat fair.

PLD vs Laine on production favored Columbus, and they got Roslovic as well.

You always lose value in the transfer moving a winger for a center.

 

[Savant]

Spooner for Strome seems to be good value.
Patches for Suzuki was generally seen as pretty good trade for both parties.
The Jets were pretty happy with Lemmy and picks for Hayes

So two prospect trades and one swap of two players no one wanted? Don’t think this is really equitable.

 

[Savant]

Gaborik in a vacuum would have had way better value than Brassard. Brassard was coming off of 47 and 41 point seasons. Gaborik scored 41 goals the year before the trade. Gaborik was ~5 years older and the trade worked out well, but realistically you lose value on a winger trading for a center no matter what.

Yup. I agree. You are usually taking a bath when you are trying to get equal value on winger for center.

 

[mrmovies779]

Call me crazy, but I’d want an add for Newhook at this point. And I like Newhook.

Buchnevich is a PPG player and a complete one at that. I don’t think the urgency to trade him exists either with Deangelo out of the mix.

You're crazy.No way they do that.

 

[mike14]

So two prospect trades and one swap of two players no one wanted? Don’t think this is really equitable.

Then I guess we're in agreement. Based on trade requirements that you find acceptable, no there aren't any

 

[NYR Viper]

I know we are concentrating on center prospects being traded for high end wingers and how infrequent it has occurred but that’s a pretty strict filter. How many high end wingers were traded in the last 10 seasons? That list isn’t going to be that long.

Now if you look at those trades, what was the value coming back? Some teams are set at center and would prefer other pieces, such as a young d-man or goalie. Stone got Brannstrom. Are we saying Brannstrom’s value isn’t comparable then to a good center prospect now?

 

[wafflepadsave]

If you could trade Kakko to LA for Byfield right now. Would you? Would anyone else?

Yep

 

[wafflepadsave]

That's fair. I just can't wrap my head around the idea that Gorton would meddle because he's concerned about what the fans think.

No, he would only mandate goat playing if some scouts were coming to watch.

 

[wafflepadsave]

Knoblauch getting at least 2 more games as Head Coach

didn't see that

And I really like his record and what the players saying about him!

 

[bobbop]

If you need to make a move for economic reasons. Could do a lot worse than Conor Garland centric deal

My first though was that this was wistful thinking until I saw the Friedge hit from last nights game.

Garland is a good player. He reminds me a lot of Lindgren with his propensity to block shots and get hit with pucks. He also absorbs a lot of hits because he is the Coyote most likely to mix things up. He's a second line player on an average team and probably a very valuable third line player on a very good team. I think the Coyotes are hoping that they may get an overpayment for him given their need to restock their prospect and draft pick ranks.

Depending on the price, definite interest. He is exactly what I meant by a player who is worthy of expansion protection that might be available.

 

[Trxjw]

Okay so we want to go back about a decade then?

The last good winger for center trade was a about decade ago?

The Hurricanes got Trocheck for a winger and handful of prospects literally less than a year ago.

 

[Savant]

My first though was that this was wistful thinking until I saw the Friedge hit from last nights game.

Garland is a good player. He reminds me a lot of Lindgren with his propensity to block shots and get hit with pucks. He also absorbs a lot of hits because he is the Coyote most likely to mix things up. He's a second line player on an average team and probably a very valuable third line player on a very good team. I think the Coyotes are hoping that they may get an overpayment for him given their need to restock their prospect and draft pick ranks.

Depending on the price, definite interest. He is exactly what I meant by a player who is worthy of expansion protection that might be available.

Garland does a lot of the things that the Rangers are bad at, and he can play on a top line at times. If the Rangers need an economic move where they don’t have to take a bath on value, he is someone I would look at.