Rochester Americans: 2016-17 Season - Part 1

[sabrefan27]

It's ridiculous because you repeatedly fail to come to grasp with the number of call ups due to injuries that were out of anyone's control. You keep beating this drum that Murray did nothing to help rochester which is just flat out not true. He attempted to add grant, fedun, falk (or Nelson depending who won the 7th dman spot...or both if you believed that heavily in guhle), burgdoerfor, nylander, and was poised to graduate past high picks like karabacek and cornel. Not to mention he was giving rochester at least two of baptiste, bailey, and Fasching to rochester if not all three. Kasdorf was supposed to bring a potential 1a 1b goalie situation but has subsequently sucked. To add to the potential defensive depth he brought in Bennet and strachan...Murray made a huge late season trade to bring top ahl scorer Cole Schneider to the amerks and attempted to shake up the core looking for new results...

Bottom line, you listed off a bunch of players that have helped the Amerks to the bottom of the league.

The moves and attempts were there and we're derailed by injuries in buffalo as well as by a few guys really underperforming.

You simply won't accept that this team is drastically different from the team put on the ice the year or two beforehand.[/QUOTE]
This paragraph is pretty amusing. First of all, just signing veterans isn't enough. If you don't have the depth at the NHL level, what's the point? That is my entire premise. Murray fails to adequately stock depth at the NHL level. That is just as important as which AHL veterans are signed. Fedun and Falk have played a combined 30 games for the Amerks. Grant ? 0. You can blame injuries, and I partially agree, but I also blame the fact that Murray didn't sign an extra NHL dman and forward, which should have happened. Amerks would have still have seen little of Falk, but considerably more of Fedun and Grant. We can disagree there, but that's my opinion. Casey Nelson is awful, barely worth mentioning.

I find it amusing that you consider sending prospects like Fasching (who initially made the team, since the depth was so bad) and Baptiste to the Amerks is some sort of sign that Murray is doing good by Rochester. Job well done, Tim, for sending prospects to your AHL team. What is your point here? This does nothing to set the team apart from anyone else in the AHL. That's what every team does.

Cornel and Karabacek? Incredibly underwhelming and they do nothing to help the team. That's not to say I have a problem with them on the team, but to mention them shows how little you have to work with for your point. The fact that you mention Kasdorf is even more sad. That supposed to be evidence that Murray is helping the Amerks?

What I will say is this. Tim Murray generally signs good veterans in the offseason. I like O'Reilly, Schneider, Fedun, Burgdoerfer etc. I presumably would have liked Grant. I liked the signing of Kennedy and claiming Mullen. Where he consistently fails is adequately addressing the depth in Buffalo and in Rochester. You're not incorrect that there have been a lot of injuries in Buffalo and I acknowledge that plays a big part. But he could be doing so much more and he's not. Does he do anything to set the Amerks a part? You can't blame injuries every season, the Amerks have been mediocre to bad each season under Murray. My position has always been that the Amerks and Sabres have a unique relationship compared to most. History dating to the early 80's, the Amerks are the second oldest team in the league, they have a storied history etc. The Sabres should be going above and beyond other organizations IMO.

 

[sabrefan27]

I'm not a fan the way the Amerks have been handled since Murray took over. That being said....the constant injury based callups have not have helped.

They certainly haven't. But even when the Amerks had a mostly full team early on, they were outclassed every single night.

 

[Chainshot]

I get 27's point. It isn't good enough to just sign that's for the Rochester Americans. And not do anything to fill the gap layer at the bottom of the Sabres roster that might slip down to the Amerks if someone succeeds in camp. Injuries happen. They will always happen. The problem is there aren't enough quality bodies supplied by Tim Murray to fill those known injury issues. I was expecting Murray to do a much, much better job with Rochester than he has.

 

[sabrefan27]

I get 27's point. It isn't good enough to just sign that's for the Rochester Americans. And not do anything to fill the gap layer at the bottom of the Sabres roster that might slip down to the Amerks if someone succeeds in camp. Injuries happen. They will always happen. The problem is there aren't enough quality bodies supplied by Tim Murray to fill those known injury issues. I was expecting Murray to do a much, much better job with Rochester than he has.

Thank you. I've always appreciated your ability to look at the Amerks as more than just a breeding ground for some prospects. I wish more people in Buffalo respected the history and tradition of the Amerks. Many do, but others certainly don't.

 

[Chainshot]

Thank you. I've always appreciated your ability to look at the Amerks as more than just a breeding ground for some prospects. I wish more people in Buffalo respected the history and tradition of the Amerks. Many do, but others certainly don't.

Thanks. They are near and dear to me and I would be thrilled to see them succeed. Perhaps I'm very old-school in thinking that a winning environment, experience going deep into professional playoff series, is important in the development cycle for the big club players as well as important to the success of the brand and hockey in Upstate NY. To poopoo the Amerks smacks of a mercenary point of view that I think is myopic at best.

 

[Dirty Dog]

A breeding ground for prospects and a dominant team don't have to be mutualy exclusive. Look at the marlies and what those prospects got to experience. Our prospects get to experience a god awful team and sub-par hockey

 

[MattyB101]

For all of the talk about needing change the culture and instill a "winning culture from top to bottom" coming from the organizational leadership, there seems to be a pretty cavalier attitude about winning when it comes to Rochester. I guess Rochester doesn't figure anywhere into the "top to bottom" of the organization. OK, that was a little facetious. I do believe Murray does care about the Amerks. It's just that the Sabres are, and always will be, the top priority for GMTM. As they should be. I would suggest the they hire someone for whom the Amerks are the priority. Maybe they could call him "Amerks GM".

 

[sabrefan27]

For all of the talk about needing change the culture and instill a "winning culture from top to bottom" coming from the organizational leadership, there seems to be a pretty cavalier attitude about winning when it comes to Rochester. I guess Rochester doesn't figure anywhere into the "top to bottom" of the organization. OK, that was a little facetious. I do believe Murray does care about the Amerks. It's just that the Sabres are, and always will be, the top priority for GMTM. As they should be. I would suggest the they hire someone for whom the Amerks are the priority. Maybe they could call him "Amerks GM".

The Sabres being the top priority has absolutey nothing to do with discussion and just is a distracting point. The Amerks don't need to be the top priority. They just need to be a priority, period. And they simply aren't.

I agree the Amerks need a GM. They don't, which is another case of them simply overlooking the team.

 

[MattyB101]

The Sabres being the top priority has absolutey nothing to do with discussion and just is a distracting point. The Amerks don't need to be the top priority. They just need to be a priority, period. And they simply aren't.

I agree the Amerks need a GM. They don't, which is another case of them simply overlooking the team.

Yeah, I guess I worded that poorly. The bolded is what I trying to say.

 

[joshjull]

I get 27's point. It isn't good enough to just sign that's for the Rochester Americans. And not do anything to fill the gap layer at the bottom of the Sabres roster that might slip down to the Amerks if someone succeeds in camp. Injuries happen. They will always happen. The problem is there aren't enough quality bodies supplied by Tim Murray to fill those known injury issues. I was expecting Murray to do a much, much better job with Rochester than he has.

Same. Murray has been very disappointing in how he's handle them

 

[Husko]

Don't some other teams employ a structure where an assistant GM acts as the GM of the minor league team? In fact, wasn't that one of GMTM's roles before coming to Buffalo? Seems as though employing someone in such a role might help Rochester some.

 

[sabrefan27]

Don't some other teams employ a structure where an assistant GM acts as the GM of the minor league team? In fact, wasn't that one of GMTM's roles before coming to Buffalo? Seems as though employing someone in such a role might help Rochester some.

Yes. Murray was GM Binghamton. As we mentioned a page or two back, Jody Gage seems like he would fit well in this role.

 

[Zip15]

Yes. Murray was GM Binghamton. As we mentioned a page or two back, Jody Gage seems like he would fit well in this role.

Toward the end of the Regier era, didn't he say Devine was Rochester's GM? Has Murray said or intimated that Jakubowski is Rochester's GM?

 

[LaxSabre]

@SabresPR - The Sabres have assigned forward Evan Rodrigues to the Rochester Americans (AHL).

@AmerksHockey - Tonights Amerks Store Feature Item - Amerks Team Trading Cards for only $4!!!! Also stop in tonight and check out our $2 table!!

 

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[sabrefan27]

Amerks really proved why they're probably the worst team in the league tonight. Incredible how bad the are. It's expected, but tstill amazing how they find new ways to lose.

 

[LaxSabre]

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

Nylander rocked Meeks down 2-0 already

 

[Husko]

How has Nelson looked? Seems we haven't heard a thing about him after many were penciling him in for the big club after his play to end last season.

 

[sabrefan27]

How has Nelson looked? Seems we haven't heard a thing about him after many were penciling him in for the big club after his play to end last season.

Absolutely awful. Their weakest defenseman easily.

 

[RyanCarpenter28]

Which prospects do you think will join the Americans towards the end of the season.

 

[Zip15]

Which prospects do you think will join the Americans towards the end of the season.

Depending on when seasons end: Hagel, Estephan, Stephens, and Guhle. Perhaps Florentino.

 

[dotcommunism]

Asplund may be an outside possibility.

 

[DJN21]

Bottom line, you listed off a bunch of players that have helped the Amerks to the bottom of the league.

The moves and attempts were there and we're derailed by injuries in buffalo as well as by a few guys really underperforming.

You simply won't accept that this team is drastically different from the team put on the ice the year or two beforehand.

This paragraph is pretty amusing. First of all, just signing veterans isn't enough. If you don't have the depth at the NHL level, what's the point? That is my entire premise. Murray fails to adequately stock depth at the NHL level. That is just as important as which AHL veterans are signed. Fedun and Falk have played a combined 30 games for the Amerks. Grant ? 0. You can blame injuries, and I partially agree, but I also blame the fact that Murray didn't sign an extra NHL dman and forward, which should have happened. Amerks would have still have seen little of Falk, but considerably more of Fedun and Grant. We can disagree there, but that's my opinion. Casey Nelson is awful, barely worth mentioning.

I find it amusing that you consider sending prospects like Fasching (who initially made the team, since the depth was so bad) and Baptiste to the Amerks is some sort of sign that Murray is doing good by Rochester. Job well done, Tim, for sending prospects to your AHL team. What is your point here? This does nothing to set the team apart from anyone else in the AHL. That's what every team does.

Cornel and Karabacek? Incredibly underwhelming and they do nothing to help the team. That's not to say I have a problem with them on the team, but to mention them shows how little you have to work with for your point. The fact that you mention Kasdorf is even more sad. That supposed to be evidence that Murray is helping the Amerks?

What I will say is this. Tim Murray generally signs good veterans in the offseason. I like O'Reilly, Schneider, Fedun, Burgdoerfer etc. I presumably would have liked Grant. I liked the signing of Kennedy and claiming Mullen. Where he consistently fails is adequately addressing the depth in Buffalo and in Rochester. You're not incorrect that there have been a lot of injuries in Buffalo and I acknowledge that plays a big part. But he could be doing so much more and he's not. Does he do anything to set the Amerks a part? You can't blame injuries every season, the Amerks have been mediocre to bad each season under Murray. My position has always been that the Amerks and Sabres have a unique relationship compared to most. History dating to the early 80's, the Amerks are the second oldest team in the league, they have a storied history etc. The Sabres should be going above and beyond other organizations IMO.[/QUOTE]

I really don't think we are far off from agreeing here lol. You seem to have a little more pride for the amerks and expect them to be treated better whereas I see the attempts to make then better which have failed...not unsimilar to Murray's attempts with the sabres. You keep addressing that you wanted depth but there is a vet maximum on ahl teams...not sure how you see your way around that with your point but I'm all ears as to how you would've handled it differently ( I mean that genuinely not sarcastically ). I watched us hoist the calder, I go to nearly every home game. I get it. Wanting the amerks to regain their glory days is not lost on me. I just don't think it's as easy as you make it out to be.

That can open a whole other can of worms in regards to drafting versus ahl depth, activity in college free agent signings etc.

I respect your passion and knowledge of the amerks because it's nice to see someone follow them ad closely as me. I guess I just saw a different team on paper to start the year than we have ever actually seen. Compound ed with the likes of guys you mentioned...and so did I underperforming like Nelson and kasdorf.

 

[sabrefan27]

My issue with depth is mostly in Buffalo. The Sabres entered camp with too few NHL players. As I've said before, Murray should have signed an additional NHL forward and defenseman. This would have made the Amerks much stronger throughout the season. Fasching, Nelson and Grant all made Buffalo out of camp. That's an issue of NHL depth.

Beyond that, I get there's an vet limit. Murray needs to sign more guys on AHL deals that are not veterans. 2nd or 3rd year pros who have established themselves in the AHL but haven't hit the veteran threshold yet. These players are key when injuries and call ups hit. Murray does an extremely poor job stocking the Amerks with AHL quality depth.

Also most of the prospects just haven't been very good at all. And that isn't an Amerks issue, but it has a huge effect.