Blue Jays Discussion: Prospects getting the call! Jansen, Reid-Foley up to the show

[Animal]

Nice to see Jansen starting again.

other than Jansen, I don't want to watch any of those guys. Ugly lineup

 

[canucksfan]

other than Jansen, I don't want to watch any of those guys. Ugly lineup

Grichuk and Smoak are worth watching. Martin has been on a hot streak. Just noticed Pillar is batting second! Wow.

 

[Nineteen67]

This surprises me that SRF gets sent down.

I guess they’re sending him to Buffalo to get that 97 mph fastball he forgot to pack last week.

He looked like the same guy I saw in spring games- a lot of pitches with a quite a few not even close to the strike zone.

With his delivery, I think he has too many opportunities to overthink what he’s trying to do gets his mechanics off. One thing I noticed at game speed is he doesn’t get his chest pointed at his target, over his knee and that causes him to miss his release point when he pulls the ball though his delivery.

Also, he sometimes lands with his right hip pointed at the plate and other times he falls off the mound other times he was position to field.
He couldn’t have pitched like that in Buffalo, so I think they’ll reboot him and give him another shot September.

 

[Eyedea]

SRF throws 93-95. He’s not someone that will consistently hit 97.

 

[canucksfan]

 

[TOGuy14]

I think for Donaldson you could probably extract 2 wildcard prospects rather then just on if signed for free in the off season. Depending on the type of prospects you may want to deal Donaldson if he has any worth. But it depends on the players/prospects coming back and if they project to be better then the one if QO isn't accepted.

The Donaldson thing really sucks timing wise. If he was healthy and playing at even 3/4 of his normal self we could have snagged a couple really good prospects for the rebuild but instead now we are looking at a possible rejected QO return...

 

[phillipmike]

Nah, he hasn't really played any more than he did in any of the previous three seasons. He played almost every day in 2015 (152 games) and then played every day in 2016 and 2017 minus a 4-6 week stretch each where he was hurt. So... pretty much the exact same as this year.

Trouble in the AL East? Sure, fair enough, though that's not going to change if he's on the team next year.

But it's hard to argue it's a problem with being overused/overexposed since his usage has been pretty much the same as it was the rest of his career.

Not at all, he was and has been overused than he is used to. You are mistakenly looking at the final number rather than what he has played to date or Aug 11th to keep it consistent.

Games played and games started on Aug 11th:
2014: 93/88 out of 117 (75% games started)
2015: 105/84 out of 114 (73%)
2016: 70/66 out of 114 (58%)
2017: 82/79 out of 115 (69%)
2018: 111/108 out 116 (93%)
Started 29 more games and played 23 more games on average from 2014-17.

Plate Appearances on Aug 11th:
2014: 375
2015: 384
2016: 283
2017: 329
2018: 471
Had 128 more PAs than his average from 2014-17

Defensive Innings Played on Aug 11th:
2014: 790
2015: 730
2016: 558
2017: 655
2018: 901
Played 227 more innings on average than 2014-17.

Seems like he was used as a starter this season - more than any other.

Tough AL East, more time to acclimatize. I expect him to be better being in the AL East again next season if used properly.

Unlike what you may think he was used like no other season before and it has adversely affected him imo.

 

[IceColdBear]

What kind of return do folks around here think we could get for Pillar this off-season?

He hasn't provided all that much defensive value this season, and that's his bread and butter - I (like most here) am worried that bread will go stale and the butter will grow mould if we don't deal him soon.

He's controllable until the 2021 season. If we can bolster our pitching prospects by moving him, I would not hesitate.

 

[Bluelines]

PREACH!!!! Tim "The Truth" Seixeiro...

Everything I've been saying for the last few years, selfish team, selfish team, selfish team.



Oh and Superman is batting 2nd as punishment.

 

[MS]

Not at all, he was and has been overused than he is used to. You are mistakenly looking at the final number rather than what he has played to date or Aug 11th to keep it consistent.

Games played and games started on Aug 11th:
2014: 93/88 out of 117 (75% games started)
2015: 105/84 out of 114 (73%)
2016: 70/66 out of 114 (58%)
2017: 82/79 out of 115 (69%)
2018: 111/108 out 116 (93%)
Started 29 more games and played 23 more games on average from 2014-17.

Plate Appearances on Aug 11th:
2014: 375
2015: 384
2016: 283
2017: 329
2018: 471
Had 128 more PAs than his average from 2014-17

Defensive Innings Played on Aug 11th:
2014: 790
2015: 730
2016: 558
2017: 655
2018: 901
Played 227 more innings on average than 2014-17.

Seems like he was used as a starter this season - more than any other.

Tough AL East, more time to acclimatize. I expect him to be better being in the AL East again next season if used properly.

Unlike what you may think he was used like no other season before and it has adversely affected him imo.

This is almost entirely because he spent huge chunks of time on the DL before this point in the season in 2016 and 2017. He was fully a regular for those Padres teams.

The guy is going through a predictable curve for an infielder in his 30s. His defensive metrics are falling off a cliff and he isn't going to have a magic resurgence next year at age 32.

Again : Guerrero will be the starting 3b next year past a couple weeks into the season. Drury is a young guy who has spent 2 years as a MLB starter at 3b who the organization just invested in and will be the backup. Martin will still be around and is competent insurance. Diaz and Travis are better, cheaper, and younger than Solarte and 2b and ss. Gurriel looks better than Solarte and is a young guy needing an opportunity to get at-bats. Tulo is untradeable and still in the picture.

How on earth do you carry all these guys on the team and still have room for backups at other positions?

There are too many better, younger, and more important players who will be on the 25-man roster next year to be dragging this guy back and hoping he'll have some sort of turnaround. It makes no sense.

 

[phillipmike]

What kind of return do folks around here think we could get for Pillar this off-season?

He hasn't provided all that much defensive value this season, and that's his bread and butter - I (like most here) am worried that bread will go stale and the butter will grow mould if we don't deal him soon.

He's controllable until the 2021 season.

If we can further bolster our pitching prospects by moving him, I would not hesitate.

most non Dave Stewart GMs will know he is a declining asset. You probably get a Grichuk type return maybe slightly better as he has been more valuable but does have age and his declining asset work against him so maybe worse.

 

[phillipmike]

This is almost entirely because he spent huge chunks of time on the DL before this point in the season in 2016 and 2017. He was fully a regular for those Padres teams.

The guy is going through a predictable curve for an infielder in his 30s. His defensive metrics are falling off a cliff and he isn't going to have a magic resurgence next year at age 32.

Again : Guerrero will be the starting 3b next year past a couple weeks into the season. Drury is a young guy who has spent 2 years as a MLB starter at 3b who the organization just invested in and will be the backup. Martin will still be around and is competent insurance. Diaz and Travis are better, cheaper, and younger than Solarte and 2b and ss. Gurriel looks better than Solarte and is a young guy needing an opportunity to get at-bats. Tulo is untradeable and still in the picture.

How on earth do you carry all these guys on the team and still have room for backups at other positions?

There are too many better, younger, and more important players who will be on the 25-man roster next year to be dragging this guy back and hoping he'll have some sort of turnaround. It makes no sense.

Doesn't need to have a magic resurgence. 1 WAR is fine, kind of what he was on pace for after the first 3 months but instead of just covering and the team getting healthier we got less and less good news from the injury front.

Still have to see what happens to the other guys before penciling them in the lineup 7 months from now.

 

[canucksfan]

Makes sense to try Biggio in the OF.

 

[Epictetus]

Pillar is another dude who should have already been dealt.

 

[Nineteen67]

PREACH!!!! Tim "The Truth" Seixeiro...

Everything I've been saying for the last few years, selfish team, selfish team, selfish team.



Oh and Superman is batting 2nd as punishment.

Honestly, I don’t know if their players know when the make mental mistakes. Missing the cutoff or throwing to the wrong side of the cutoff, outstandingly horrible base running are such simple aspects that they’ve struggled with for years. Gibby getting mad now is meaningless.

 

[BertCorbeau]

This is the consummate "old men yell at clouds" article:

'I Find It Very Difficult' to Watch: Why MLB Greats Think Baseball's in Trouble

 

[Nineteen67]

This is the consummate "old men yell at clouds" article:

'I Find It Very Difficult' to Watch: Why MLB Greats Think Baseball's in Trouble

We’ve been to a 5 mlb games this year ( atl, Stl, col) and haven’t seen what I’d call an above average play, 0 attempted stolen bases , no hit and run. We did see a few HRs though.

Because we’ve been to Wrigley several times we actually cancelled a trip to Chicago.

 

[Discoverer]

Not at all, he was and has been overused than he is used to. You are mistakenly looking at the final number rather than what he has played to date or Aug 11th to keep it consistent.

Games played and games started on Aug 11th:
2014: 93/88 out of 117 (75% games started)
2015: 105/84 out of 114 (73%)
2016: 70/66 out of 114 (58%)
2017: 82/79 out of 115 (69%)
2018: 111/108 out 116 (93%)
Started 29 more games and played 23 more games on average from 2014-17.

Plate Appearances on Aug 11th:
2014: 375
2015: 384
2016: 283
2017: 329
2018: 471
Had 128 more PAs than his average from 2014-17

Defensive Innings Played on Aug 11th:
2014: 790
2015: 730
2016: 558
2017: 655
2018: 901
Played 227 more innings on average than 2014-17.

Seems like he was used as a starter this season - more than any other.

Tough AL East, more time to acclimatize. I expect him to be better being in the AL East again next season if used properly.

Unlike what you may think he was used like no other season before and it has adversely affected him imo.

Yep. Last year he didn't play for six weeks in June and July. The year before it was most of April and May. He could have played every inning of every game outside of the injuries and it would have looked like he was a part time player if you didn't know about the injuries.

This is way more research than you needed to do. He was a full-time player who missed time with injuries. That's it.

 

[MS]

Doesn't need to have a magic resurgence. 1 WAR is fine, kind of what he was on pace for after the first 3 months but instead of just covering and the team getting healthier we got less and less good news from the injury front.

Still have to see what happens to the other guys before penciling them in the lineup 7 months from now.

Obviously if multiples of those other guys get unexpectedly hurt or traded and we the team suddenly has no depth than picking up the option might make sense.

However, given what we know know and the most likely scenario that those guys will be on the team, then there is absolutely no room on the team for Solarte. Especially given his age and performance.

 

[trellaine201]

Great LLWS game on now. Bottom of 8th, tied.

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

10 best college players in the 2019 MLB Draft

1. Adley Rutschman, C, Oregon State: Rutschman raked during Oregon State's run through Omaha in the College World Series and he kept going with Team USA. Despite not joining the national team until late, he still led the squad in batting average (.355), on-base percentage (.432), slugging (.516) and doubles (five).

2. Andrew Vaughn,1B, Cal: After finishing as a Golden Spikes Award Finalist as a sophomore (.402/.531/.819), Vaughn went on to hit .308 with five homers and 14 RBIs in 14 Cape Cod League games. From there, he joined Team USA, where he hit a bit of a wall (.224/.316/.367), though that did little to hurt his stock as one of the best all-around college bats in the class.

3. Logan Davidson, SS, Clemson: Davidson has been a bit of an enigma, but one scouts clearly feel will figure it out. He's hit for power over his first two years at Clemson (27 homers), albeit with some swing and miss. He has the tools to stick at short, but he didn't hit well in the Cape for the second straight summer.

4. Shea Langeliers, C, Baylor: Langeliers had a down sophomore year at Baylor (.252/.351/.496), but the catcher had a strong showing for Team USA, hitting .346/.393/.500 in eight games of action. There's plenty of power to go along with very good catch-and-throw skills behind the plate.

5. Nick Lodolo, LHP, TCU: The big left-hander, who was taken No. 41 overall by the Pirates in the 2016 Draft, didn't pitch over the summer. But despite being a bit inconsistent in two years as a part of Texas Christian's rotation, scouts can't look past his size (6-foot-6) and his stuff (a fastball up to 95 mph and a solid breaking ball) when evaluating the college crop.

 

[IceColdBear]

This is the consummate "old men yell at clouds" article:

'I Find It Very Difficult' to Watch: Why MLB Greats Think Baseball's in Trouble

Not really, the article raised a couple points I fully agree with.

I'm 23, and most of my friends like basketball, hockey, and football, and will watch regular season games in these sports regardless of who is playing, or how the hometown team is doing. These guys were "Jays fans" two years ago, but haven't watched more than a game or two of baseball since the team started last season 2-11.

Young people who haven't grown up with baseball find the lack of action dull, which is highlighted by a very relevant quote from the article:

"And there's plenty of time for that grumbling: Tom Verducci of Sports Illustrated in June noted there is more dead time per game than ever before and that the average time between balls in play is three minutes, 45 seconds."

A ball in play is where most of the excitement happens: a defender makes a great play, a homerun is cranked, someone makes an error, a run scores etc. Exciting things are happening all the time in other sports, in baseball something exciting only happens every 3 minutes & 45 seconds, which is way too long.

Baseball is already at a disadvantage in terms of density of excitement versus other sports - they need to stop the trend of longer games with less balls in play, while maintaining the integrity of the game, if they want to keep young people interested.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Not really, the article raised a couple points I fully agree with.

I'm 23, and most of my friends like basketball, hockey, and football, and will watch regular season games in these sports regardless of who is playing, or how the hometown team is doing. These guys were "Jays fans" two years ago, but haven't watched more than a game or two of baseball since the team started last season 2-11.

Young people who haven't grown up with baseball find the lack of action dull, which is highlighted by a very relevant quote from the article:

"And there's plenty of time for that grumbling: Tom Verducci of Sports Illustrated in June noted there is more dead time per game than ever before and that the average time between balls in play is three minutes, 45 seconds."

A ball in play is where most of the excitement happens: a defender makes a great play, a homerun is cranked, someone makes an error, a run scores etc. Exciting things are happening all the time in other sports, in baseball something exciting only happens every 3 minutes & 45 seconds, which is way too long.

Baseball is already at a disadvantage in terms of density of excitement versus other sports - they need to stop the trend of longer games with less balls in play, while maintaining the integrity of the game, if they want to keep young people interested.

Baseball for me is something to watch when I need to do something else or if there is nothing else on. It does not take away too much of your attention but can still be entertaining to watch in the background. However I doubt I would watch any games, at least regular season games that I would watch on TV, without doing something else. Even when they were good I was never that interested. I still follow them because they are the local team and I still like the sport.

I think baseball will always have the appeal of being relatively cheap to attend and many days where it is easy for people (especially families) to attend. But the lack of eventfulness of the sport + good, upcoming teams in other sports which are generally seen as more interesting will mean that the Jays are going to have to be good if they really want to draw in a lot of interest from people. It's just a good thing they do not play in the winter, because they'd have no chance against the Leafs and Raptors. They'll always be able to beat the Argos and TFC even if it's just because there are not that many games to watch in the first place.

 

[The Nemesis]

This is the consummate "old men yell at clouds" article:

'I Find It Very Difficult' to Watch: Why MLB Greats Think Baseball's in Trouble

Goose Gossage is a well-known crank. He has had problems with, at various times, all of the following:

1) Analytics
2) "Nerds" ruining the game (This is the same link as point #1, but he ranted about multiple things at once here, so we should be thankful he coordinated to not waste the media's time)
3) Bat flips (peaked at calling Jose Bautista "a ****ing disgrace to the game)
4) Relievers that throw just one inning (in particular he outright said it was 'disgraceful' to compare his achievements to 'one-inning Rivera'. This dovetails into a broader rant about pitch counts and coddling pitchers as well)
5) Players that used drugs (and the fans that still like them)
6) The fact that the Yankees had enough of his shenanigans to the point of not inviting him to spring training as a guest instructor.

Just get off Goose's lawn already, Bert

I enjoyed that one of the articles had a line at the end that summed it all up perfectly:

Through all his complaining about the current state of baseball, we can't give Goose Gossage the one thing he really wants - a time machine.

 

[Bluelines]

Young people who haven't grown up with baseball find the lack of action dull, which is highlighted by a very relevant quote from the article:

Yep, you hit the nail on the head.

When I grew up there was one option in the summer, baseball. One option in the fall, football. One option in the winter, hockey. Now kids have a billion activities / distractions they can do. Lets face it , if you are playing in the younger leagues you might go multiple games with out a ball being hit in your direction ... how boring is that.

When I coached 10-12 year old's many moons ago, I would actually have to tell kids, take your ball glove off your head, stop lying down in the outfield, etc. the short attention span generation like to be stimulated every waking hour and if not they quickly lose interest.

Baseball can be a boring game for those who don't understand it.

Try convincing a 10 year old that sacrificing with less than 2 out and a runner in 2nd is the fun thing to do.