GDT: Pre-season game 3: Golden Knights @ Sharks 7pm “Streamed” on Sharks.nhl.com

[Led Zappa]

Patrick Marleau at about Kanes age with 8 years of PO experience.

GP 11 Goals 3 Assists 3
GP 13 Goals 4 Assists 4

What a loser. Right Jux?

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Look, I hold our players to a pretty high standard and I've been known to be pretty outspoken against people I think are disgraceful playing for this team *cough* Tores *cough*, but I really don't have any problem with Kane. Being kind of a dick when your young an stupid isn't the same thing as ending people's careers intentionally. He seems to me like he's grown up, is looking for a fresh start, and likes where he is now. The other guys seem to like him, so that's really all I need to know. As stated above, the charges were dismissed against him, and all we can really do is trust that the system worked as it should. If he's abusing women, then he should be ejected into the sun as fast as possible, but there really is no evidence of that, and we can't just assume because someone accused him of something, then dropped it, that he's a *******. So until I see some accusations against him hold, and he either admits or is found guilty, it's really a non-issue.

As for his salary, it's a bit high, but if he can put up 60 points this year, I'm fine with it. If he can't, we will cross that bridge when we get to it.

I mean, yeah, we can wait to complain. We can wait to be unhappy about things. If DW signs some AHL 4th line grinder to a max term/AAV contract, we can always play the “wait and see before we criticize!” game; sure. But the reality is that Kane’s career high in non-contract years is 43 points. And so, for as much as we’ve seen “Kane is on a good team now, he’s definitely going to try harder and score more!” a lot of us have heavily disagreed with this logic, based on sound logic of our own, and our arguments are slowly becoming vilified.

He has played 74 and 78 games in contract years and averages like 60 games per season outside of them. He has scored 55 and 57 points in contract years and averages like 40 points per season outside of them. He has scored 29 and 30 goals in contract years and averages like 22 goals per season outside of them.

What Jux is trying tell you guys is that it’s incredibly naive to think that suddenly, because he is on a good team, Kane is going to start performing better than he ever has before. Statistically speaking, we’ve got a lot more precedence to suggest that because he is not in a contract year, Kane is going to start performing about as well as he has in his other seasons that weren’t contract years.

 

[LeftHeartInSF]

Patrick Marleau at about Kanes age with 8 years of PO experience.

GP 11 Goals 3 Assists 3
GP 13 Goals 4 Assists 4

What a loser. Right Jux?

This is a great comparison, especially because so many here knocked Marleau for 'not trying hard enough' or 'not having the drive he needs.' Just silly. We all saw what Joe Thornton did with Marleau and Heatley on either side. He turned Cheechoo into a Rocket winner. He turned Setoguchi into a 30 goal scorer.

I for one can't wait for a full season of EK on Joe T's wing.

 

[Led Zappa]

This is a great comparison, especially because so many here knocked Marleau for 'not trying hard enough' or 'not having the drive he needs.' Just silly. We all saw what Joe Thornton did with Marleau and Heatley on either side. He turned Cheechoo into a Rocket winner. He turned Setoguchi into a 30 goal scorer.

I for one can't wait for a full season of EK on Joe T's wing.

I was never a Marleau lover. I hated the way he'd disappear. But I never thought he was extremely overpaid for what he was doing or that he wasn't an important contributor to the team. I just wish we'd traded him earlier for someone like Kane that had a more physical game.


I'm certain I complained about Patty far less than the complaining around here about a 6D player who was better than almost all 6D's the Sharks ever iced before

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Patrick Marleau at about Kanes age with 8 years of PO experience.

GP 11 Goals 3 Assists 3
GP 13 Goals 4 Assists 4

What a loser. Right Jux?

Perhaps comparing nothing but goals and assists over a very small sample size is a bit disingenuous when there are other factors to consider? How about the fact that Kane got suspended for a game for a stupid, undisciplined play, took 23 penalty minutes in 9 games, was a team-worst -5, and was generally terrible? How about the fact that his line was f***ing terrible in every game he played and then it was awesome as soon as he got suspended and replaced by Meier?

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Comparing him to Marleau during those two years is quite convenient. The difference though is that Marleau proved he had playoff value the previous three times when he had 47 points in 50 games. Something that Kane doesn't have on his resume. I get the point and would generally agree with it but going about it that way is shallow arguing.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

I was never a Marleau lover. I hated the way he'd disappear. But I never thought he was extremely overpaid for what he was doing or that he wasn't an important contributor to the team. I just wish we'd traded him earlier for someone like Kane that had a more physical game.


I'm certain I complained about Patty far less than the complaining around here about a 6D player who was better than almost all 6D's the Sharks ever iced before

 

[Barrie22]

Perhaps comparing nothing but goals and assists over a very small sample size is a bit disingenuous when there are other factors to consider? How about the fact that Kane got suspended for a game for a stupid, undisciplined play, took 23 penalty minutes in 9 games, was a team-worst -5, and was generally terrible? How about the fact that his line was ****ing terrible in every game he played and then it was awesome as soon as he got suspended and replaced by Meier?

Outside of the 15 minutes he received for the suspension crosscheck. He had the same amount of minors in the 9 games as couture/hertl/pavelski.

 

[do0glas]

I mean, yeah, we can wait to complain. We can wait to be unhappy about things. If DW signs some AHL 4th line grinder to a max term/AAV contract, we can always play the “wait and see before we criticize!” game; sure. But the reality is that Kane’s career high in non-contract years is 43 points. And so, for as much as we’ve seen “Kane is on a good team now, he’s definitely going to try harder and score more!” a lot of us have heavily disagreed with this logic, based on sound logic of our own, and our arguments are slowly becoming vilified.

He has played 74 and 78 games in contract years and averages like 60 games per season outside of them. He has scored 55 and 57 points in contract years and averages like 40 points per season outside of them. He has scored 29 and 30 goals in contract years and averages like 22 goals per season outside of them.

What Jux is trying tell you guys is that it’s incredibly naive to think that suddenly, because he is on a good team, Kane is going to start performing better than he ever has before. Statistically speaking, we’ve got a lot more precedence to suggest that because he is not in a contract year, Kane is going to start performing about as well as he has in his other seasons that weren’t contract years.

No one is guaranteeing hes gonna hit career highs, though. But you can reasonably assume he will be good for 50+

His contract is inflated and probably could've been better negotiated, but i dont see a lot of options out there. We have some surplus D we can trade for forwards but i doubt we can pull a top 6 winger.

Ive watched a lot of kane in buffalo and lazy has never crossed my mind. He has some weaknesses though.

 

[Led Zappa]

I don't know what this means, but if you enjoyed watching Patty play patty cake along the boards, well, ce la vie.

 

[Barrie22]

No one is guaranteeing hes gonna hit career highs, though. But you can reasonably assume he will be good for 50+

His contract is inflated and probably could've been better negotiated, but i dont see a lot of options out there. We have some surplus D we can trade for forwards but i doubt we can pull a top 6 winger.

Ive watched a lot of kane in buffalo and lazy has never crossed my mind. He has some weaknesses though.

Have to remember this is from the same board that said kane didn't care about his offseason training because he hadn't posted about it on instagram.

People here will find reasons to complain about kane, even if those reasons are made up inside there own little minds.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

I don't know what this means, but if you enjoyed watching Patty play patty cake along the boards, well, ce la vie.

I enjoyed Patty actually scoring far more often than most do on this team even in the playoffs.

 

[Led Zappa]

Comparing him to Marleau during those two years is quite convenient. The difference though is that Marleau proved he had playoff value the previous three times when he had 47 points in 50 games. Something that Kane doesn't have on his resume. I get the point and would generally agree with it but going about it that way is shallow arguing.

It wasn't convenient. I picked the two closest years to Kane's age. If I had picked his first PO performance it would have been worse. I didn't pick them out of thin air to make it look its worse. I guess I could go do that now.

 

[Lebanezer]

You guys know we have Erik Karlsson now right?

 

[hockeyball]

You guys know we have Erik Karlsson now right?

What position does he play? is he a center? Do have any highlight reels?

 

[Barrie22]

You guys know we have Erik Karlsson now right?

Nope. He hasnt been playing so nope. Its just your imagination.

 

[Jaleel619]

Kane disappears in the playoffs and we’re giving him the injury excuse and venerating a 17 game stretch during which the majority of his goals were scored against the Calgary Flames.

I have no idea what Kane has done to earn such undying loyalty around here.

How can you even say that? I don't think its undying loyalty it has more to do with predicting what he can do given the situations hes been in the past 9 years, also that was his first playoffs on a team he only played a handful of games with. I thought he did pretty good all things considered, and the game he got suspended was in the one where nobody showed up, at least he was involved. You're better than this Jux.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

It wasn't convenient. I picked the two closest years to Kane's age. If I had picked his first PO performance it would have been worse. I didn't pick them out of thin air to make it look its worse. I guess I could go do that now.

It was disingenuous no matter how you slice it.

 

[KirbyDots]

This is a great comparison, especially because so many here knocked Marleau for 'not trying hard enough' or 'not having the drive he needs.' Just silly. We all saw what Joe Thornton did with Marleau and Heatley on either side. He turned Cheechoo into a Rocket winner. He turned Setoguchi into a 30 goal scorer.

I for one can't wait for a full season of EK on Joe T's wing.

Assuming EK works on JT's wing. For every Cheechoo there are several others that just didn't work. Usually everybody gets a shot with JT, they try every new winger, from Meier to TJ Galiardi. Some work, most don't.

 

[Lebanezer]

What position does he play? is he a center? Do have any highlight reels?

He’s not a hockey player, he’s a spokesman for various products.

 

[Led Zappa]

It was disingenuous no matter how you slice it.

I was responding to Jux, where goals /points were the point of the discussion. In no way was it disingenuous. Follow along next time.

Two of Kane’s goals came in one game, and that game he was not particularly good outside the two goals (I remember this specifically). After that game, he had 3 points in 9 games. That’s really bad. Saying “everyone struggled versus Vegas”, aside from being untrue because Couture and Hertl were just fine, isn’t really any kind of defense of Kane.

Kane came in, scored in bunches against bad teams, got injured, and was completely useless from then on and into the playoffs. That’s pretty much been his MO in the NHL. He was the ONLY Shark we heard anything about injury-wise, which is telling, because we heard it from Kane himself. No other Shark excused themselves because of injuries. You’re entirely welcome to be optimistic that that will change, but I’m not, and my realistic opinion is just as valid as your optimistic one. That’s all I’m saying.

Patrick Marleau at about Kanes age with 8 years of PO experience.

GP 11 Goals 3 Assists 3
GP 13 Goals 4 Assists 4

What a loser. Right Jux?

 

[Church Hill]

Assuming EK works on JT's wing. For every Cheechoo there are several others that just didn't work. Usually everybody gets a shot with JT, they try every new winger, from Meier to TJ Galiardi. Some work, most don't.

Cheechoo worked because (1) Thornton was a beast and (2) Cheechoo was a smart f***ing player and knew where to go.

Kane is nowhere near as intelligent as Cheechoo was, although he is much more athletic. Thornton is also obviously much less of a beast than he was on 06. My prediction is that this won't work. Kane is the kind of guy who I'm not sure how he will fit into this team, which is why I'm one of the few Sharks fans critical of his signing. I hope to be proven wrong. And even worst-case, he'll still be a serviceable offensive forward.

 

[Doctor Soraluce]

An identical 9.33% according to CF. However, that number is based on his new cap figure into the cap of the season he signed in. Thus it's 7 mil into this past season's 75 mil cap figure.

I'm not understanding your answer... Kane should be the 7mil on this years cap, Coutures should be the 6mil he signed 5(?) years ago... I'm looking for the value when initially signed as a comparison. Then we have to consider how many years of UFA each gave up and obviously performance and position.

 

[Barrie22]

I'm not understanding your answer... Kane should be the 7mil on this years cap, Coutures should be the 6mil he signed 5(?) years ago... I'm looking for the value when initially signed as a comparison. Then we have to consider how many years of UFA each gave up and obviously performance and position.

Kane. 8.8
Couture 8.6

 

[Jaleel619]

Soon as they wise up to Kane on the 3rd line its gootchie
OR just run
Kane-Pavelski-Donskoi
Hertl-Couture-Labanc
Meier-Thornton-Karlsson
Sorenson-Sumo-Goodrow