Post-Game Talk: Plus/Minus: Pens vs. CBJ - Backs against the wall edition

[DesertPenguin]

Certainly Geno was on another level during his time with Hagelin and Hornqvist, but I don't agree that it was only Malkin or that Malkin-Hornqvist haven't worked together since. See @Peat 's post above. Their numbers can be good together even if it's not pretty.

I wouldn't trade someone as valuable and unique as Hornqvist for salary cap or some perceived chemistry reasons. They can look elsewhere to make the changes if needed.

You can run Geno/Hornqvist, but you can't do it with ZAR on the opposite wing. Need Rust, Kessel etc on the opposite side. Someone who can transition and play in the rush with Geno.

 

[SaucyCelly]

Certainly Geno was on another level during his time with Hagelin and Hornqvist, but I don't agree that it was only Malkin or that Malkin-Hornqvist haven't worked together since. See @Peat 's post above. Their numbers can be good together even if it's not pretty.

I wouldn't trade someone as valuable and unique as Hornqvist for salary cap or some perceived chemistry reasons. They can look elsewhere to make the changes if needed.

Depending on what Simmonds wants in the off-season, he is not my favorite player considering he has been on the philly phloppers for so long, but he is someone I could see fill that role.

Younger
Can hit
Natural Goal Scorer
Great PP net front presence
Can move him up and down a lineup

 

[Andy99]

He just mentioned something might happen. You're the one who's put a name on this.

This will be your fault.

It doesn't matter the hockey gods know all! I've been putting a reverse jinx on the Pens all year with my negativity, so that better be good enough...

 

[pistolpete11]

You can run Geno/Hornqvist, but you can't do it with ZAR on the opposite wing. Need Rust, Kessel etc on the opposite side. Someone who can transition and play in the rush with Geno.

Agreed. As someone who wants Rust with Malkin anyway and not 100% convinced ZAR is Malkin's long term LW, I'd be fine with running Rust-Malkin-Hornqvist.

Depending on what Simmonds wants in the off-season, he is not my favorite player considering he has been on the philly phloppers for so long, but he is someone I could see fill that role.

I can't imagine Simmonds will come cheaper than Hornqvist and they are both RW. So why not just keep Hornqvist then?

 

[Trade]

Eh. Much respect guys but I'm just gonna have to do the ol' agree to disagree. If you get the other wing just right it can work here and there. But Malkin needs puck support through the NZ and someone to do more than simply make a beeline for the net. He also seems to generally favor his RW as his shooter on the line. I just don't like the majority of the dynamic I see nearly every time those two are tried though there are of course ways in which is does work since Horns has a hell of a motor, never quits on the play and does his thing in front of the net and Malkin is, of course, Malkin.



Hey man... I made sure to mark that post safe from jinxing. I have no idea who this single-letter character is you are referencing. I can only assume you guys came up with a nickname for Garrett Wilson while I was away.

Giroux, the best G in the league! 6 points away from 6 more points

 

[SaucyCelly]

Agreed. As someone who wants Rust with Malkin anyway and not 100% convinced ZAR is Malkin's long term LW, I'd be fine with running Rust-Malkin-Hornqvist.


I can't imagine Simmonds will come cheaper than Hornqvist and they are both RW. So why not just keep Hornqvist then?

Younger
Can hit
Natural Goal Scorer
Great PP net front presence
Can move him up and down a lineup

Not suggesting that they should but depending on his price I would look at.​

 

[Andy99]

Agreed. As someone who wants Rust with Malkin anyway and not 100% convinced ZAR is Malkin's long term LW, I'd be fine with running Rust-Malkin-Hornqvist.

As the bearer of bad news, Rusty's looking like he'll be out the remainder of the RS likely---4-6 weeks is my guess..that's per usual for him as the poor guy has played only 57 and 69 games the last two years respectively

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Yeah... Rust isn't exactly sturdy, it would seem.

It's also worth remembering that his was absolutely a tale of two seasons. His goal totals wouldn't look like that had he not gone on just a crazy and nearly unprecedented rip.

I'm not trying to dump on the guy but it is what it is.

 

[BHD]

In Bryan Rust’s case he was hit by Adam McQuaid in what should be considered interference in 2019. That is the extent of McQuaid’s value. Throwing hits with the puck away.

Pretty much.

 

[madinsomniac]

Rust is like Dupuis... the perfect middle six winger. Can play first or fourth line minutes, but is a speedy defensively responsible guy who can create a little offense too... we tend to overplay or underplay those guys, but you need a guy like him on a successful team... hope he gets healthy asap

 

[pistolpete11]

Younger
Can hit
Natural Goal Scorer
Great PP net front presence
Can move him up and down a lineup

Not suggesting that they should but depending on his price I would look at.​

Younger --> He's like a year and half younger
Can hit --> So does Hornqvist
Natural Goal Scorer --> Not any more than Hornqvist
Great PP net front presence --> So is Hornqvist
Can move him up and down a lineup --> So can Hornqvist

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

His goal totals wouldn't look like that had he not gone on just a crazy and nearly unprecedented rip.

Uh, ok. But he did.

 

[pistolpete11]

As the bearer of bad news, Rusty's looking like he'll be out the remainder of the RS likely---4-6 weeks is my guess..that's per usual for him as the poor guy has played only 57 and 69 games the last two years respectively

Poor Rusty.

 

[pistolpete11]

Yeah... Rust isn't exactly sturdy, it would seem.

It's also worth remembering that his was absolutely a tale of two seasons. His goal totals wouldn't look like that had he not gone on just a crazy and nearly unprecedented rip.

I'm not trying to dump on the guy but it is what it is.

His goal totals could be even higher if he didn't get off to such an atrocious start.

As you say, it is what it is. Even it out and he was having a great season.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Uh, ok. But he did.

It's fine man. I like Bryan Rust. It's OK.

I'm only saying there was that month or so at the top of the year where he wasn't doing anything. Consistency counts.

I just hope this latest injury isn't serious. If they make the playoffs, he's always been a big factor there.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Yeah... Rust isn't exactly sturdy, it would seem.

It's also worth remembering that his was absolutely a tale of two seasons. His goal totals wouldn't look like that had he not gone on just a crazy and nearly unprecedented rip.

I'm not trying to dump on the guy but it is what it is.

the first half slump is just as much of an anomaly as the high scoring stretch though. I think the overall totals are about what I would expect from him.

 

[SaucyCelly]

Younger --> He's like a year and half younger
Can hit --> So does Hornqvist
Natural Goal Scorer --> Not any more than Hornqvist
Great PP net front presence --> So is Hornqvist
Can move him up and down a lineup --> So can Hornqvist[/QUOTE]

Horny's hits are smaller
Horny can't shoot for crap, simmonds has a shot
Horny is better in front of the net
Horny has shown us that he can't be productive on the 3rd or 4th line, he needs to be attached to Geno or Sid.

I'm not saying that we should get him but if he was available at the right price and someone wanted horny, i'd do it. If one of those conditions is met than we keep horny
Edit: sorry idk why it formatted like this

 

[ZeroPucksGiven]

I'm only saying there was that month or so at the top of the year where he wasn't doing anything. Consistency counts.

.

That's everyone in the league not McDavid, Crosby, Ovi, etc

These are professional players going up against other pros- they are equally capable of going off on a good stretch and having poor runs.

The difference between guys like Rust and Crosby is what you said: consistency.

Crosby does things at a high level game in and game out. Rust can't. Great players don't just do great things occasionally, they do them all the time

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Why are we all so sensitive about Bryan Rust? I'm literally just pointing out something that happened in the midst of being extremely complimentary to him as a player. Because I like Bryan Rust and am glad he's a Penguin. Good lord.

I definitely wasn't one of the people in here screaming for him to get traded when he didn't score a goal for like a month straight. But that DID happen.

EDIT: Like... I spend a fair amount of posts bitching about just about every Penguin player and I say a couple of mildly down things about ol' Rusty and that's the line. Just funny.

 

[Shady Machine]

That's why you don't play them together. That's why I stated that with the right partners (Schultz and Petterson) they could work out. Do I think it will work without Letang and Dumo in the line-up? Not really, at least not well enough to win the cup. However if our defence going into the playoffs is:

Letang - Dumo
Johnson - Schultz
Petterson - Gudbranson

I think we'd be fine with that line-up. The problem is trying to decide what to do with Maatta when he's healthy. Petterson deserves to be in the line-up, Maatta and Johnson will be in the line-up. The most logical would be to have Maatta -Schultz and Johnson - Petterson, but will Sully sit JR's new pet? I guess it will depend on the opponent. It is a nice problem to have, but I have a feeling that at least one of the three main injuries is likely longer term then the team is admitting.

My bad. You reference Scuderi-Gill and I was more commenting on the logic of that type of pairing in today's NHL. That pairing would blow today.

Personally I think JJ-Schultz can be fine, but that's more Schultz carrying JJ than Schultz actually benefiting from JJ. MP-Gudbranson is probably fine as a 3rd pair, but again, MP would be propping up Gudbranson IMO.

It would be much better if we could roll MP-Schultz and have a 3rd pairing that doesn't have two anchors on it.

 

[Peat]

Depth players are inconsistent. Not all of them are Rust level inconsistent. I think pointing out the level of the inconsistency he's shown this season is fair, although in both cases its a bit freakish and unlikely to be repeated. Rust has veered between bad Hagelin and Guentzel with wheels this season. He seems to have settled down to something a bit less mad though.

Eh. Much respect guys but I'm just gonna have to do the ol' agree to disagree. If you get the other wing just right it can work here and there. But Malkin needs puck support through the NZ and someone to do more than simply make a beeline for the net. He also seems to generally favor his RW as his shooter on the line. I just don't like the majority of the dynamic I see nearly every time those two are tried though there are of course ways in which is does work since Horns has a hell of a motor, never quits on the play and does his thing in front of the net and Malkin is, of course, Malkin.

The point about puck support through the NZ is a good one.

 

[Empoleon8771]

You can run Geno/Hornqvist, but you can't do it with ZAR on the opposite wing. Need Rust, Kessel etc on the opposite side. Someone who can transition and play in the rush with Geno.

ZAR definitely should be staying on Malkin's wing though, that's just the issue. ZAR has performed like a legit 2nd line forward after his bad start this year.

 

[Trade]

It's fine man. I like Bryan Rust. It's OK.

I'm only saying there was that month or so at the top of the year where he wasn't doing anything. Consistency counts.

I just hope this latest injury isn't serious. If they make the playoffs, he's always been a big factor there.

Saying he wasn't doing anything is pretty unjust. He wasn't scoring, but he was still being the Bryan Rust we know and love playing fast, tenacious and smart hockey. Puck luck is a real thing.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Puck luck is a real thing depending on the player you are. Nobody is criticizing Evgeni Malkin's freshly-minted 20 goals as a result of bad puck luck. Or hardly anyone.

I apologize for besmirching the good name of Bryan Rust.

 

[Peat]

Saying he wasn't doing anything is pretty unjust. He wasn't scoring, but he was still being the Bryan Rust we know and love playing fast, tenacious and smart hockey. Puck luck is a real thing.

Some of the time he was. Some of the time he conspicuously wasn't. There's a reason Rutherford's first blast pointed very squarely at him. Puck luck took a while to return after the effort levels.